Decisions, Decisions (feedback!)

[karmakitsch]

Hi all!

I just recently found this board (would have been a big help during the application process!), and I must say, you are quite an accomplished bunch.

If I may, I was hoping to pose a decision/problem that I recently faced when deciding where to attend.

Would you have accepted an offer from the MA program at the University of Chicago with a 50% tuition award, or an offer from the MA program at Wake Forest University with 100% tuition assistance?

Things to consider:

1) Wake Forest has no PHD program, and unfortunately their alumni list shows that very few who graduate with the MA in religion from the program go on to attend Universities on the level of UChicago. However, Wake Forest is certainly a good school, and the tuition award is generous.

2) The ultimate goal is to attain a PHD, and the University of Chicago is unique in that the MA program is used as their main source of PHD candidates. Should I attain the level of success I expect from myself, then admittance into the PHD program is available through in house petition.

3) University of Chicago is my number one choice

4) Both are thousands of miles from family, so familiarity/family ties plays no part in the decision.

Thanks for taking the time to read this! I am looking forward to hearing your thoughts.

Cheers

[Thanks4Downvoting]

Hi all!

I just recently found this board (would have been a big help during the application process!), and I must say, you are quite an accomplished bunch.

If I may, I was hoping to pose a decision/problem that I recently faced when deciding where to attend.

Would you have accepted an offer from the MA program at the University of Chicago with a 50% tuition award, or an offer from the MA program at Wake Forest University with 100% tuition assistance?

Things to consider:

1) Wake Forest has no PHD program, and unfortunately their alumni list shows that very few who graduate with the MA in religion from the program go on to attend Universities on the level of UChicago. However, Wake Forest is certainly a good school, and the tuition award is generous.

2) The ultimate goal is to attain a PHD, and the University of Chicago is unique in that the MA program is used as their main source of PHD candidates. Should I attain the level of success I expect from myself, then admittance into the PHD program is available through in house petition.

3) University of Chicago is my number one choice

4) Both are thousands of miles from family, so familiarity/family ties plays no part in the decision.

Thanks for taking the time to read this! I am looking forward to hearing your thoughts.

Cheers

If your ultimate goal is to obtain a PhD from a top tier school and University of Chicago is your top choice and it offers an exceptionally good opportunity to be a feeder for a University of Chicago PhD, one of the best programs imaginable, I think there's really only choice...the University of Chicago. While Wake Forest's award is generous, it's most likely not going to get you to your eventual goal and is, therefore, not an option. Just my two cents.

Edited June 11, 2010 by CBF+pwn

[rising_star]

Wake Forest. An MA program is what you make of it.

[Riotbeard]

Hi all!

I just recently found this board (would have been a big help during the application process!), and I must say, you are quite an accomplished bunch.

If I may, I was hoping to pose a decision/problem that I recently faced when deciding where to attend.

Would you have accepted an offer from the MA program in Religion at the University of Chicago with a 50% tuition award, or an offer from the MA program in Religion at Wake Forest University with 100% tuition assistance?

Things to consider:

1) Wake Forest has no PHD program, and unfortunately their alumni list shows that very few who graduate with the MA in religion from the program go on to attend Universities on the level of UChicago. However, Wake Forest is certainly a good school, and the tuition award is generous.

2) The ultimate goal is to attain a PHD, and the University of Chicago is unique in that the MA program is used as their main source of PHD candidates. Should I attain the level of success I expect from myself, then admittance into the PHD program is available through in house petition.

3) University of Chicago is my number one choice.

4) Both are thousands of miles from family, so familiarity/family ties plays no part in the decision.

5) 40K less in debt with Wake Forest

Thanks for taking the time to read this! I am looking forward to hearing your thoughts.

Cheers

If your goal is a PhD from UChicago and your claim that a lot of people do progress directly into said program from MA is accurate. Then you may want to consider the extra debt depending on your finances. It may be worth asking somebody at UChicago how many people get substantially better funding when transitioning from the MA to PhD (like a TA or Fellowship, where you wouldn't incur anymore substantial debt after the MA)etc. It just depends on how much you think having the best chance of getting your PhD at UChicago is versus the money situation, and the quality of options you can reasonably expect to have leaving Wake Forest (a great school don't know about your specific program but...).

[Thanks4Downvoting]

If your ultimate goal is to obtain a PhD from a top tier school and University of Chicago is your top choice and it offers an exceptionally good opportunity to be a feeder for a University of Chicago PhD, one of the best programs imaginable, I think there's really only one choice...the University of Chicago. While Wake Forest's award is generous, it's most likely not going to get you to your eventual goal and is, therefore, not an option (if I were in your shoes anyhow). Just my two cents.

[matcha]

Yeah, I would choose U of Chicago. The program is AMAZING and it would help you reach your end goal. And really, isn't getting an advanced degree about reaching our end goals?

[hubris]

Yeah, I would choose U of Chicago. The program is AMAZING and it would help you reach your end goal. And really, isn't getting an advanced degree about reaching our end goals?

Some U of Chicago MA programs have a reputation of being a cash-cows.

Might want to run some figures on how much that debt will be once you get out.

Then again, why not talk some people that made the switch to calibrate your expectations?

Edited June 11, 2010 by hubris

[karmakitsch]

Some U of Chicago MA programs have a reputation of being a cash-cows.

Might want to run some figures on how much that debt will be once you get out.

Then again, why not talk some people that made the switch to calibrate your expectations?

Thank you all for the input!

I think all Universities have a few higher degrees that are cash cows, although the MA in Religion is definitely not one of them. The Divinity School at Chicago is one of the top 3 or 4 hubs (if not THE leading) for the academic study of religion and its various spheres of influence.

Where did you hear, however, that University of Chicago is notorious for cash cow programs? My only understanding of it is as one of the most academically rigorous universities in the nation.

But to get back to the difficult (or maybe not?) decision:

Chicago was my number one choice and if I were to attend Wake Forest, I would be reapplying there in two years for my PHD.

If, lets say, i were accepted into every MA-PHD program in my field (Harvard, Princeton, Oxford, Texas, Chicago, etc), and all variables were equal, Chicago would still be my number one choice due to the strength of the program, long term prospects, and educational experience.

The only debate is economic, which of course, is a very difficult thing to get around. Its hard to justify any decision that will put one 40K in the hole, particularly when his current savings is approximately 1/40th of that (lol). And, as someone stated, Wake Forest is a pretty good school, although their MA in Religion isn't well known. In addition, while the MA program at Chicago is unique in its student's abilities to move into the PHD program (as stated before), it is not a guarantee that one's areas of interest will end up fitting with the faculty after finishing the MA, and they will have move on to study elsewhere (or, the case that the person just won't do well and won't be allowed to move forward).

However, it may also be the case that the MA program at Wake Forest simply won't have as much weight later one when applying for PHD programs, and the extra debt incurred at Chicago may be worth it due to the better long term educational/job prospects.

I have a headache now after writing that.

By the way, what do you mean by "made the switch?"

Edited June 12, 2010 by karmakitsch

[karmakitsch]

If your ultimate goal is to obtain a PhD from a top tier school and University of Chicago is your top choice and it offers an exceptionally good opportunity to be a feeder for a University of Chicago PhD, one of the best programs imaginable, I think there's really only choice...the University of Chicago. While Wake Forest's award is generous, it's most likely not going to get you to your eventual goal and is, therefore, not an option. Just my two cents.

Thanks for responding! That is pretty much my line of thinking.

its always tough, however, to turn down a wonderful scholarship offer (one that markedly minimizes the amount of accrued debt). I'm sure there are those on this board who have struggled making a similar decision- if possible, could they share what they decided, and what the eventual ramifications were?

Thank you!

Edited June 12, 2010 by karmakitsch

[karmakitsch]

Some U of Chicago MA programs have a reputation of being a cash-cows.

Might want to run some figures on how much that debt will be once you get out.

Then again, why not talk some people that made the switch to calibrate your expectations?

Thank you all for the input!

I think all Universities have a few higher degrees that are cash cows, although the MA in Religion from Chicago (as I understand it) is definitely not one of them.

Where did you hear, however, that University of Chicago is notorious for cash cow programs? My knowledge of the university is a little different.

But:

If I were to attend Wake Forest, I would be reapplying to Chicago in two years for my PHD.

If, lets say, i were accepted into every MA-PHD program in my field (University A, U of B, U of D, U of Y), and all variables were equal, Chicago would still be my number one choice due to the strength of the program, long term prospects, and educational experience.

The only debate is economic, which of course, is a very difficult thing to get around. Its hard to justify any decision that will put one 40K in the hole, particularly when his current savings is approximately 1/40th of that (lol). And, as someone stated, Wake Forest is a pretty good school, although their MA in Religion isn't well known. In addition, while the MA program at Chicago is unique in its student's abilities to move into the PHD program (as stated before), it is not a guarantee that one's areas of interest will end up fitting with the faculty after finishing the MA, and possibly will have move on to study elsewhere (or, the case that the person just won't do well and won't be allowed to move forward).

However, it may also be the case that the MA program at Wake Forest simply won't have as much weight later one when applying for PHD programs, and the extra debt incurred at Chicago may be worth it due to the better long term educational/job prospects.

I have a headache now after writing that.

By the way, what do you mean by "made the switch?"

Thanks again to everyone for the helpful words.

Cheers

Edited June 12, 2010 by karmakitsch

[sacklunch]

UChicago.

[American in Beijing]

I would choose neither, if I were in your position. If your ultimate goal is to get a PhD, I would wait another year to work on my application and reapply to M.A/PhD programs. $40,000 is a lot of money for a humanities MA, and the job market is not exactly the best. There's no guarantee you'll end up making enough money to pay that (and I'm also assuming your undergrad loans) back. Also, from what you mentioned, Wake Forest doesn't seem to offer a program that will make you a competitive candidate for a top-notch PhD program. Given this economy, you might want to ask yourself if a humanities' degree from a school that doesn't have a good reputation in your field is worth it. You might end up working as an adjunct on a salary that is far lower than any job you could have gotten with just your BA.

Admissions results change rapidly from year-to-year, so who knows? Maybe you'll get a fully funded offer from UChicago next year!