GRE related insanity

[Mike271828]

My background:

• Junior Mathematics student at Auburn University
• 20 years old
• 4.0 GPA
• I plan to get a Ph.D in my field and then teach; however, stopping with a Master's and working for a bit before continuing on is not out of the question
• Employed as a paid tutor for the past 2 years, coordinator of the tutoring program since last year
• Research in Number Theory conducted at a summer REU program
• Paper based on said research has been accepted for publication in the International Journal of Mathematics and Computer Science
• Also presented a poster on this research at the Joint Mathematics Meetings
• Continuing to do research in the field of Fractional Calculus
• Due to graduate in December of this year

Since my unfortunate discovery that I had yet another standardized test to look forward to (oh yay), I have been driving myself up the wall with all this GRE crapola. See, the problem is that I have traditionally done fairly poorly on standardized exams, at least when compared to the success I usually enjoy within my normal classes. Though I had a 32 on the ACT (not a terrible score), my peers seem to average a 34 while their GPAs are more around 3.2. Also troubling is the fact that my verbal section scores have always been consistently better than my math scores - I care so much about math that, not wanting to screw it up, I inadvertently spend waaaayyy too much time on it.

In the practice materials that I have used thus far, I have done fairly well on the quantitative portion (but not stellar - also, I can't give you an exact score as there appear to be no grading mechanisms included in any of the 8 practice books I bought), and I've done terribly on the verbal section (missing probably 3 of every 4 questions). Over time, I've gotten a bit better, but I get so nervous about the actual exam whenever I look at the practice tests that I end up pulling my hair out, rubbing my hands raw, and staring at the ceiling all night unable to sleep due to a driving compulsion to study until my eyes bleed.

I started seeing a psychologist; but he's been less than helpful, and during our last meeting he basically told me I'm a nut. I recently started taking valerian root and St. John's wort in an effort to calm down, though not enough time has passed for me to provide an accurate estimate of how much they have actually helped.

What's worse, I can't take comfort in my bachelor's degree since you basically can't do anything with a bachelor's in Math; so theoretically, all the hard work and hours of study I've put in could all be for naught just from the results of a single examination.

Of course, the endless varieties of grad school horror stories I've been told have certainly contributed to my current neurotic state: you need a 3.7 GPA to get into grad school, you need an 800 quantitative if you want to do mathematics related graduate work, you probably need a 700 verbal and a 5 analytical since the professors like to see people that can write research papers, they want leaders not followers, you should be able to speak and understand a foreign language, if you have a 4.0 GPA it's even more imperative that you do well on the GRE since a poorer GRE score is indicative of grade inflation, etc, etc, etc...

At this rate, I think I might really end up in the psychiatric ward if I don't regain some of my composure, but studying only makes me less confident and it seems like the only cure for this disease is to get the GRE over with and to be accepted by a university....ANY university. Of course, this can't be accomplished in its entirety until some time in spring of next year, and in the mean time I'm a nervous wreck and getting worse by the day...I'm not sure how much longer I can put up with this pressure.

Any advice you can give me will be greatly appreciated.

Thank you,

Mike

[newms]

Whoa, you need to calm down a bit. I think you're putting unnecessary pressure on yourself. Firstly, your background is stellar, and the fact that you have a publication is more important than your GRE score (as long as it's not terrible). As for the GRE - here's a little secret that ETS doesn't tell you, it's not that important for grad school admissions. The scores you set out: 800Q, 700V 6.0 AWA are exceptional scores that are better than 95% of all test takers - they are not the minimum needed for admission. Here's another secret about the GRE Quant - you don't have to get every single question right to get 800, if you got 2 or 3 wrong (depending on which ones) you'd probably still get an 800. Also, the quant is basically 10th grade math, so for a math major it won't be difficult material - they just like to try to trick you with the questions though, once you practice for these tricky questions you'll be fine. Also, the verbal and AWA scores are even less important for Math and Science people. A 700 is better than 97% of all test takers and would be a good score for an English major, there is no need to feel that you need to score 700. in fact I don't know if some places even look at the verbal for science applicants. As for the AWA, just score 4.0 or better and you're fine. Even if you score less than 4.0 that's only important if some schools have cutoffs at 4.0, and only a very few schools do. Schools will look at your SoP and see how good your writing is long before they consider your AWA score.

I personally think you have a really good profile so far for graduate school and you shouldn't be afraid of a standardized test that isn't so important at all.

Edited January 23, 2011 by newms

[Mike271828]

I'm just looking at the average scores of people getting into grad school (at least into the grad schools that post their averages online) and they're always well above the mean: about 780Q and 600V....given how nervous I get in standardized testing scenarios I'm really not convinced that I can pull off anything close to the averages; more so in the Verbal than in the Quantitative, but I still take waaaaayyy too much time to answer the math questions. The questions I answer I nearly always get correct, but I go far too slow to be able to answer every question. Right now I think I might be able to pull off being able to solve 3/4 of the problems with 95% accuracy and then being forced to guess on the rest due to time.

I'm always confident going into my tests here at school, but as soon as the word "standardized" gets tagged on I can barely even function.

What has me so uptight is the fact that this one test cannot make my application any better, but it could make it a heck of a lot worse. There is no outcome to the GRE which is favorable to me, only neutral or bad. As you said, my app is strong as is, and I know that; the GRE can only weaken my application with all that I've done while at Auburn and it frightens me to think that one test could be what prevents me from living out my life dream.

Edited January 23, 2011 by Mike271828

[newms]

I'm just looking at the average scores of people getting into grad school (at least in the grad schools that post their averages online) and they're always well above the mean: about 780Q and 600V....given how nervous I get in standardized testing scenarios I'm really not convinced that I can pull off anything close to the averages; more so in the Verbal than in the Quantitative, but I still take waaaaayyy too much time to answer the math questions.

I'm always confident going into my tests here at school, but as soon as the word "standardized" gets tagged on I can barely even function.

I would advise you to just keep practicing. The 780 you see is the average - so that means people get in with less than 780. That said, the GRE quant is not that hard for a math major (I was a math and CS major) so the material won't be hard, just tricky. So if you just practice you'll be fine. For the verbal, just improve your vocab by studying GRE words and practice and you'll be fine. A score of 600 is more than good enough for a science applicant.

For your anxiety issues with standardized tests, have you seen a counselor? If not perhaps you could see one at your school. All the best!

Edited January 23, 2011 by newms

[Mike271828]

A score of 600 is more than good enough for a science applicant.

For your anxiety issues with standardized tests, have you seen a counselor? If not perhaps you could see one at your school. All the best!

First, I'm pretty darn sure that a 600 verbal isn't going to happen. The only books I've read since freshman year of high school have been math books and various scientific articles.

And yeah, I've seen a counselor, but that was the psychologist I mentioned in the opening post. Needless to say, he hasn't helped much.

[newms]

Don't worry about the GRE verbal - it really isn't too important at all for science applicants - just practice and do your best.

I would definitely recommend seeing someone else, if that psychologist basically called you a nut. Does your school have counselors? If so I'd imagine they'd have a lot of experience dealing with students who have anxieties with standardized testing.

Anxiety about standardized tests is pretty common and admissions committees do consider that when they see a strong college record with lower GRE scores - so even if you do score below the averages for grad school, it won't keep you out.

Edited January 23, 2011 by newms

[Mike271828]

Interesting update: I went far too slow on a practice exam for the quantitative portion, only finishing about 2/3 of the problems in the allotted time. So frustrated with my performance, I began stabbing my practice book with a knife, wound up cutting myself as well, and I am now bleeding all over the floor of my dorm room.

[thepoorstockinger]

I would definitely suggest seeing someone with professional training to help you work through these issues. Seriously.

[Mike271828]

I would definitely suggest seeing someone with professional training to help you work through these issues. Seriously.

Thank you for that wonderful bit of insight.

[repatriate]

What kind of therapist are you seeing? Not all therapies (or therapists) are equal. It, very unfortunately, is not too uncommon to spend years (and lots of money) before finding a therapist/therapy that actually helps. For the problems you are describing, it sounds like behavioral therapy is probably the best bet. Your therapist should be giving you "homework" and also working on exposure in therapy sessions. Is s/he doing anything like this?

[Mike271828]

What kind of therapist are you seeing? Not all therapies (or therapists) are equal. It, very unfortunately, is not too uncommon to spend years (and lots of money) before finding a therapist/therapy that actually helps. For the problems you are describing, it sounds like behavioral therapy is probably the best bet. Your therapist should be giving you "homework" and also working on exposure in therapy sessions. Is s/he doing anything like this?

No, my psychologist hasn't done anything along those lines with me. For the most part he just sits there while I describe my issues, but he never gives me any sort of suggestions for how to get over them.

[repatriate]

No, my psychologist hasn't done anything along those lines with me. For the most part he just sits there while I describe my issues, but he never gives me any sort of suggestions for how to get over them.

Because of the seriousness and the immediacy of your anxiety-related issues (bleeding is bad!), I strongly encourage you to seek out a behavioral, cognitive-behavioral, or cognitive therapist. Have you told anyone else--friends, family--about what you are experiencing?

Do you need medical attention for your bleeding?

[Mike271828]

Because of the seriousness and the immediacy of your anxiety-related issues (bleeding is bad!), I strongly encourage you to seek out a behavioral, cognitive-behavioral, or cognitive therapist. Have you told anyone else--friends, family--about what you are experiencing?

Do you need medical attention for your bleeding?

Nah, the bleeding is under control. I didn't stab myself, just cut the side of my hand a little bit.

As for disclosure, I've tried to tell my parents about the intensity of these anxiety problems, but neither one of them really think it's that much of a concern. Can't say I blame them, I wasn't this neurotic before college so why should university change that? Of course, this is really the first time that I've injured myself and neither one of them have heard about this yet....prolly shouldn't tell them either...

It all started sophomore year; I just felt down at the very beginning of the semester, not depressed but a little off from my usual self. Since then, it seems like every day is a struggle to find motivation, and the only way to lift my spirits is to hang out with a group of friends and forget about school. However, this only works until I'm alone again, at which point it all comes flooding right back. This is actually why I started seeing the therapist in the first place, to try and lift my mood up from the hill it was rapidly descending.

My reflections on the GRE go up and down: earlier I was definitely in a valley; however, over time the valleys have been getting deeper and the hills have grown shallower. So though I'm ok right now, I am pretty certain that I haven't seen the last of the emotions that I had this evening.

[fall-11]

If you aren't clicking with this particular therapist, or don't find him helpful, do consider trying someone else. Sometimes you have to try a few before you find one that clicks with you. That's definitely been my experience, back when I was in college and dealing with depression. Therapy was really unhelpful until I found the right therapist.

Regarding the GRE -- as others have said, the GRE score is not the single or even the most important determining factor. The fact that you've done research and have even published a paper counts for far more. Those are the things you should focus on in your SOP. I'm sure there are lots of people who have test anxiety and don't do well on standardized tests even though they are extremely well qualified candidates -- and I'm sure adcoms know that. So don't freak out! Just take it easy and good luck.

[emmm]

You could try taking the GRE really early as a "practice run." I did that, and felt really relaxed throughout the whole test, even when I thought I was messing up because the questions seemed to be getting easier instead of harder. Not stressing out and panicking seemed to really work for me, since I ended up being quite satisfied with my "practice" scores and not re-taking later in the season, as I'd originally planned to.

[apieceofroastbeef]

Interesting update: I went far too slow on a practice exam for the quantitative portion, only finishing about 2/3 of the problems in the allotted time. So frustrated with my performance, I began stabbing my practice book with a knife, wound up cutting myself as well, and I am now bleeding all over the floor of my dorm room.

Go to your GP and tell him about your unhealthy anxiety (not about cutting yourself!) and ask for an Rx to help manage it (xanax or klonapin). He might send you to a psychologist first, but probably not if you act rationally. Don't abuse the pills, but find out how they affect you and then take one before the exam. I have major anxiety issues and I took one the night before so I could sleep. I personally wouldn't take one right before the exam because they make me lethargic and I basically needed the relief BEFORE the exam to set me up for a calmer testing situation. They are sort of like a reset button and I use less than 10 pills a year (I could use more but I don't want to become dependent).

What will happen will happen. You're not doing yourself any favors by dwelling on your bad reaction to the GRE. Set aside a set amount of time everyday to study and when you've completed that, tell yourself that you've done what you can and move on to something more enjoyable. When you get to the actual test, remember all the hours you've studied and let yourself feel prepared. You sound like a competitive applicant already, so try not to worry so much.

[cherubie]

My background:

• 4.0 GPA
• Employed as a paid tutor for the past 2 years, coordinator of the tutoring program since last year
• Research in Number Theory conducted at a summer REU program
• Paper based on said research has been accepted for publication in the International Journal of Mathematics and Computer Science
• Also presented a poster on this research at the Joint Mathematics Meetings
• Continuing to do research in the field of Fractional Calculus

You have so many good things going for you and you're worrying over one exam?! Seriously, if you look at various GRE forums/posts, MOST people don't have a 4.0 and posters. There are people who have below average GPA, little research, and can only hope the GRE can salvage their application just a little bit. For you, the rest of your application seems practically "perfect" (on paper at least). It's perfectly normal to be anxious, but I think that you're focusing on the negative aspect way too much. You haven't even TAKEN the GRE yet. Additionally, if you're THIS stressed over the GRE, you should reconsider whether you can handle the stress of grad school. I kind of felt the same way as you before, the rest of my application is so good I wanted to keep it that way- as if there's no room for failure. But you just need to calm the hell down! You need to actually sit down, identify what it is that you're bad at, then attack it from there. EVERYONE told me to just take the exam, and just take practice exams to "see where I stand". But I told them no, I refused to take practice tests if I feel like I'm still "learning". For several months, they thought I was gonna give up- even people who had never even SEEN the GRE was telling me to take a practice exam. Well screw them, I studied my butt off and took a total of 3 practice exams and went in and nailed it. The moral of that story is that if you're still learning (say, vocabs or angles or probability laws) then your current score is not your true score. Just simply taking practice exams isn't going to do much if you don't have the basics memorized. As for verbal, I spent maybe a total of 3 hours of practice exams on that part. I spent several months on math. I came out just fine. Verbal is seriously a vocabulary test. If you're doing that badly, you're either a non-native speaker, don't know how to read, or simply don't know vocabs. I'm going to assume it's the later. For quant, if you're getting questions consistently wrong, go back and make sure you know how to do that problem- even if it means memorizing the answer. This may sound stupid, since you obviously won't see the same problems on the exam, but knowing how to answer that TYPE of question is what matters. When you go back to check your answers, ask yourself, "what concept can I take away from this?".

Lastly, the more you hype up the exam, the worse you will do. So you're lowering your own chances by being so anxious. I didn't do this for the GRE, but one thing that helped me get the anxiety of finals of my undergrad was print out my goal, and phrases and pin them all over the room. I literally wrote (in huge font), "I'm studying because I want to reach my goal of graduating with honors" or "2 more exams then I'm done". They were everywhere in my room, and they got me through the 3 hell week of finals. If you find yourself feeling anxious, just stop, watch tv. Print out inspirational words, read them until you're convinced. Unless you get very lucky, you won't do very well with your current state of mind. It really depends on how badly you want to get to your goal. Right now, the biggest impediment is yourself. If you're as motivated as you sound in your post, you'll find a way to get past your anxiety.

[Mike271828]

For quant, if you're getting questions consistently wrong, go back and make sure you know how to do that problem- even if it means memorizing the answer. This may sound stupid, since you obviously won't see the same problems on the exam, but knowing how to answer that TYPE of question is what matters. When you go back to check your answers, ask yourself, "what concept can I take away from this?".

It's not that I can't do the problems, I CAN. I mean, I've done problems much harder than these and been quite successful. The difference is that having 4 problems on an hour test in my current classes would be pushing it for time just due to the difficulty and the amount of work required for each question. I go slowly out of a demand for accuracy, and I've found that going even a little bit faster than my internal pace can ruin my precision. What I need to do is learn shortcuts to solutions; however, the issue then becomes my lack of trust in shortcuts as most of these shortcut methods have been gutted in my math classes.

Lastly, the more you hype up the exam, the worse you will do. So you're lowering your own chances by being so anxious.

I totally agree, but I can't exactly tell myself to stop worrying and then do just that. To tell me "stop worrying" is like me telling you to ignore gravity. You can say what I should do all day long, but what I need is a method by which to do it. I've tried to reason my way out of my concerns, but the nagging doubts still exist in the back of my mind, eating away at any rational evaluations of my abilities and making the exam appear much larger than it actually is.

If you find yourself feeling anxious, just stop, watch tv. Print out inspirational words, read them until you're convinced.

If I did that I'd be watching TV all day! Also, I can't fool myself. I can tell myself that "everything will be fine" but I'll never believe those words. Saying the words doesn't make it true. You could try to tell me that 2+2=5 and repeat it over and over and I may eventually agree with you; however, I still won't believe that 2 apples and 2 oranges yield 5 fruits.

[cherubie]

Hah, telling yourself "I'm going to get a 1600" and then sit on your ass all day sure won't make it come true, now would it? What I meant was having those phrases was a motivation. I didn't reach my goal just by repeating those phrases while I ignored my classes. When I woke up at 2 a.m. to study, those words kept me going. No one is going to be able to tell you a "method," you just have to make your own.

What kind of exam are you taking with 4 questions in one hour?! Which program is this? If my experience is typical, you should be able to solve the problems on the actual exam in no more than 2 minutes. The questions on the exam isn't any more about precision than knowing your times table and knowing how to add. You need to be able to recognize basic math concepts in a matter of seconds if you want to do well. I don't know what program it is that you're referring to, but if it's 4 questions in an hour, it may seem like you're heading in the wrong direction. As far as shortcuts, I'm not sure what you mean. Do you mean math shortcuts, or shortcuts to problems?

In any case, my advice for you is to stop complaining and do something about it. Your tone sounds like "wahh I don't know how to get past my anxiety, someone tell me how." Well unfortunately, no one can.

[Mike271828]

What kind of exam are you taking with 4 questions in one hour?! Which program is this?

Real Analysis, Numerical Analysis, Combinatorial Design, Enumeration, Algebraic Coding Theory, Cryptography, (insert 5000 level math class here)

Your tone sounds like "wahh I don't know how to get past my anxiety, someone tell me how."

And what I hear from you is, "I'm a troll"

Edited January 25, 2011 by Mike271828

[Mike271828]

I'd like to make an addition:

I've noticed that people have stated that the Kaplan and Princeton Review study materials tend to undershoot actual scores, and I'm looking at my practice books seeing a ton of Kaplan and Princeton Review logos. I have an account on 800score and have gotten an 800 on the math in the practice test that I took there; however, I attributed my success to the test being too easy rather than the paper tests I have being harder. Do you think that the stark discrepancies are due to one being too hard, the other being too easy, or perhaps both?

Also, thank you all for your responses. It's really helped having some people to chat with.

[arkel]

I'm sorry you're feeling this way. When I was studying for the GRE I had these scary chest pains, and when I went to a doctor he told me there was no medical cause - it was just anxiety. I know it's not as bad as what you've been experiencing, but you're definitely not the only one who has had problems.

Obviously I'm not a psychologist (but I do study psychology!), so this advice should be taken with a grain of salt...but often how you frame a stressor can be a big determinant of how it affects you. You are framing the GRE as a threat to your ability to get into grad schools/your future success in life. Instead, you could think of it as a challenge, which will be difficult and will require a lot of hard work, but that you are ultimately able to overcome. An example from my own experience...I went to a particularly soul-crushing school for undergrad, and in my first year of life sciences there were many times when I did poorly on a test or felt I would never understand, but I never attributed my poor results to a lack of ability. Rather, I always concluded that I had not worked hard enough, or not prepared in the right way and it made me even more determined to succeed next time. Maybe I was deluding myself, but it worked - I never really despaired like so many of my peers did. I think this kind of relates to your situation, because it sounds like you have sort of concluded that you will not be able to succeed on the GRE, and when you don't meet your own expectations you attribute it to some personal failing, rather than something you can change and improve upon (I hope I haven't misrepresented your posts, but that was just the impression I got).

Also, if you're stressed about the the verbal, I don't know if anyone has mentioned this already, but FLASHCARDS! When I was preparing for the GRE, I made probably over 1000 flashcards with words from the Barron's word list, and my scores improved a great deal from my first practice tests (400s to 700s). It seems ridiculous that rote memorization should play a role in graduate school admissions, but sadly it does. And this kind of studying can be done pretty passively and is not too stressful.

When you are eventually writing the GRE, try not to worry too much about how you're doing while you write it - just focus on the question at hand. This might sound easier said than done, but when I was writing, I was convinced that I had ruined my chances of attaining a high score by messing up on some of the first questions. I could have lost my composure, but I was determined to at least "finish strong", and to my great surprise, I did pretty well.

Good luck, and remember that you can do it!

[thepoorstockinger]

Not exactly related to question but something that just occurred to me:

I just noticed that you're a junior in college, when are you planning on writing the GRE?

If you're not planning on taking it until the fall then I would stop thinking about it until the summer. Giving yourself that much time to worry about it is a recipe for disaster. The other thing to keep in mind is that the test format is undergoing major changes on August 1st. This means that studying for it now is likely going to be a waste of time since the format will change. The other thing it means is that if the current format is giving your major problems then you may want to consider waiting until the new version of the test is available since the new format may be more favourable to you.

[Mike271828]

Not exactly related to question but something that just occurred to me:

I just noticed that you're a junior in college, when are you planning on writing the GRE?

I was sort of planning on doing it by March at the latest. I need to have it done before October so I can have plenty of time to get my scores and whatnot back, and also so I can have some time to put together applications; but I'd like to have it done earlier rather than later so I can stop thinking about the stupid thing.

[Tdearr]

I was sort of planning on doing it by March at the latest. I need to have it done before October so I can have plenty of time to get my scores and whatnot back, and also so I can have some time to put together applications; but I'd like to have it done earlier rather than later so I can stop thinking about the stupid thing.

I would just like to note that the GRE is changing to a different format starting in August of this year. The new test (i.e. anything taking after July 31, 2011) will be fairly different, so if you are studying materials for the current GRE March is a good target date. You want to make sure you get to take the test you are studying for so aim to finish before August. I would even suggest taking it by May so that if things don't go as well as you'd like on the first test, you have a chance to take it again in June or July before they institute the new test. I hope that helps. Good luck with your studies!