0-10!

[MarketingPhD2012]

Looks like I have been rejected from every school. I am so angry and depressed. I don't know what I am going to do. Don't even know if I am going to even waste my time or money reapplying next year. Looking at the previous classes, seems most universities are only interested in foreign students for the program I was hoping to get into.

To be perfectly honest, it is a little disheartening to not even be able to get into a school, in my own country, for a Marketing PhD. I am so through with this whole process. Guess I need to start looking for a job now! Whatever! F it!!!

--Out

[Sigaba]

M--

If you can stand to do it, try to contact all the departments to which you applied and ask for a thorough debriefing on why you were not admitted this time around, what were the strong points of your applications, and what you can do to improve your standing for the next time around.

You might also profit from digging into the GradCafe's archives using the full search feature. There have been a number of members who have been through the process two or three times. Their posts may provide useful information as well as the inspiration to persevere.

Even if you decide not to reapply, you might still get some information that can help you in other endeavors.

[Bones]

For what programms have you applied? (i.e., how where the schools ranked?) And what is your GRE, etc.?

Edited April 15, 2012 by Bones

[We regret to inform you]

I had a round of all rejections a few years back. It's a pretty miserable experience, but you can learn from your mistakes and you can take this extra year to improve your apps for next time:

1. Apply to more safety schools next time.

2. Retake the GRE.

3. Rewrite your SOP.

4. Try to start up a dialogue with more professors at the schools you are applying to.

5. In the mean time try to get a job in the field.

[verdalantreas]

I was rejected by all schools I applied to two years ago. Was a terrible experience. All the time and effort, and almost $1000 in application-fees just to get 10+ confirmations that I sucked.

Then I applied for a masters, and I got in and did well. And this time round I have been admitted to my (Ivy-level) dream-school. Just don't give up if it is what you want to do.

[3point14]

The same thing happened to me last year. Rejected by about 10 schools (mix of Masters and PhD programs), and didn't even get an interview anywhere. I was crushed and immediately decided that meant I wasn't good enough for grad school. It was a terrible and disheartening experience, especially because all my friends were accepted to PhDs/med school/law school. In retrospect, I'm glad I didn't get in. I did another summer research program, spent a lot of time on my new SoP, and, most importantly I think, I spent a lot of time carefully selecting which POI's/programs would really fit my interests. This year, I managed to get accepted at my top choice PhD program. So don't lose hope! There are hundreds of other applicants in the same situation; I'm sure you've heard it before, but it really is incredibly competitive right now...if you look at most schools' admissions statistics, the number of applicants has shot up tremendously in the past three years, while the number of accepted students has either dropped or hasn't changed.

[Andsowego]

Looks like I have been rejected from every school. I am so angry and depressed. I don't know what I am going to do. Don't even know if I am going to even waste my time or money reapplying next year. Looking at the previous classes, seems most universities are only interested in foreign students for the program I was hoping to get into.

To be perfectly honest, it is a little disheartening to not even be able to get into a school, in my own country, for a Marketing PhD. I am so through with this whole process. Guess I need to start looking for a job now! Whatever! F it!!!

--Out

A random thought - I see in your signature that you were waitlisted at one school. Have you tried calling them and personally following up on the status of the waitlist? It might make a difference!

Edited April 16, 2012 by Andsowego

[MarketingPhD2012]

A random thought - I see in your signature that you were waitlisted at one school. Have you tried calling them and personally following up on the status of the waitlist? It might make a difference!

Updated my signature! Now off to find a really tall building!!!

[TeaGirl]

Updated my signature! Now off to find a really tall building!!!

I wouldn't just yet I've seen plenty of people on these forums who are on their 2nd or 3rd round of applications. Sometimes our luck just plain sucks. I'm sure if you try again next year, with all the time you've got to improve your application, get some additional research done, you'll see better results!

Edited April 16, 2012 by TeaGirl

[MarketingPhD2012]

I wouldn't just yet I've seen plenty of people on these forums who are on their 2nd or 3rd round of applications. Sometimes our luck just plain sucks. I'm sure if you try again next year, with all the time you've got to improve your application, get some additional research done, you'll see better results!

Everyone keeps saying I need to get some research experience, but I have no idea how to go about doing so. I am a 35 year old male who is the sole provider for my wife and 3 children. I am stuck in a piss ass Law Enforcement job that I can't stand and so desperately want out of this career. No one is hiring and the marketing jobs that do see want you to have tons I experience. I did graduate with my MBA in 2007 within that top 5-10%, but that doesn't mean shit! Since research experience is so important to these schools, I really don't see the need to even waste my time or money reapplying to something that obviously will never accept me!!!!

[TeaGirl]

I'm afraid I can only offer advice on the research thing. You could try to get in contact with some professor in a nearby college/univeristy, and offer to help out with research (for ex. during the summer) in return for experience and a solid recommendation letter. You could email them to introduce yourself and if you get a reply try and arrange a meeting to discuss it further.

Even better would be if you still know some professors from your MBA degree, if you still live in the same area. You can call them up, remind them of yourself, and ask if they have sometime to meet with you since you want to apply for PhD and would be very grateful for their advice. Meet up with them, ask them if they can offer advice on how to make your application stronger, whether you can do research with them and if not, to recommend someone with whom you could work, or how to go about it, etc.

This would generally be unpaid, and you would need to somehow find some time for it on top of your job. I don't imagine it will be easy if you can manage for a few months, I guess you will need to make the decision on that.

I really wish you luck with whatever you decide to do!

[Ladril]

Also, aren't these marketing PhD programs among those that only accept 2 or 3 students each year? If that's the case, the odds of getting into one are very small. Why be disheartened?

Side note: I would have viewed your post with more sympathetic eyes if you had not felt the need to make snide remarks about foreign students. It is well known that American universities are always more reluctant to admit foreign students than domestic ones. Xenophobia won't help you solve your problems.

Edited April 16, 2012 by Ladril

[cafeaulaitgirl]

Ditto what TeaGirl said! Making connections is really a valuable piece of getting into many schools.

[sonya87]

Dont worry - it is my first time applying... and I have been rejected from 3 out of the 5 programs I applied to. The other two programs I did not even hear back from yet - but have a feeling that it will be big fat rejections!

I know how you are feeling! Trying not to let it get me down too much.

[MarketingPhD2012]

Also, aren't these marketing PhD programs among those that only accept 2 or 3 students each year? If that's the case, the odds of getting into one are very small. Why be disheartened?

Side note: I would have viewed your post with more sympathetic eyes if you had not felt the need to make snide remarks about foreign students. It is well known that American universities are always more reluctant to admit foreign students than domestic ones. Xenophobia won't help you solve your problems.

First of all, let's get a few things straight...

1. I am not looking for sympathy from anyone; especially not you!

2. My remarks about foreign students were not snide...they were simply facts! I have looked at the profiles of current Marketing PhD students at various programs, and a vast majority of the students are simply foreign. Not to mention, after seeking some advice from a Marketing professor, without me even mentioning foreign students, he even said a lot of Business Schools are electing to admit more and more foreign students because they pretty much come with their own means of financial support. That equates to less money the schools have to dish out. I was not putting foreign students down, but I was mentioning what is blatantly obvious!

Also, I, in no way, fear foreign students...what the hell is there to fear? That was just a dumbass comment from an obviously dumbass individual. Sorry! I didn't really want to go there, but you kind of brought it upon yourself!!!

Adios, Ciao, Au revoir, good bye....

[3point14]

My remarks about foreign students were not snide...they were simply facts! I have looked at the profiles of current Marketing PhD students at various programs, and a vast majority of the students are simply foreign.\

You may be/probably are entirely right in saying that the programs you applied to prefer foreign students. I'm not disputing that, you would certainly know better than me. However, it's unfair to look at the profile of current students and, just because the majority are foreign, claim that the program prefers foreign students. My dad is a professor, and currently the entirety of his lab (7 grad students) is foreign and the majority of the students in his particular program are foreign. This is certainly not because they prefer foreign. Quite the opposite in fact. They would prefer to have more American students, and given two candidates with identical qualifications, would choose the American student over the foreign student. The fact is (again, in his program) there are simply not enough qualified American students applying.

[Ladril]

1. I am not looking for sympathy from anyone; especially not you!

I can see that; you were mostly looking for a chance to take potshots at foreigners. How can I tell? Not once in your postings have you said: "how can I prepare a better application"? No, it's way easier to blame the foreigners for your situation. FYI I'm also 35 and married with children.

[MarketingPhD2012]

I can see that; you were mostly looking for a chance to take potshots at foreigners. How can I tell? Not once in your postings have you said: "how can I prepare a better application"? No, it's way easier to blame the foreigners for your situation. FYI I'm also 35 and married with children.

Perhaps my original post came off wrong. I certainly WAS NOT trying to take a potshot at foreign students. Again, I was going off what I have seen with my own eyes, and heard with my own ears. It is just apparently the way it is in the field. Am I mad at foreign students??? Absolutely not! I have nothing against them...never have...never will. Getting, yet, another rejection was just devastating to me. I probably should have taken a moment before I posted anything on here. It was/is not my intention to "attack" foreign students at all!!!!

As far as asking how to improve my application, well, I have asked the programs where I was rejected how I can move forward and improve my application for the next time. I feel the advice of the individuals that actually reviewed my application is very valuable and I am taking what they said and running with it. I have already received the information on how to improve my application from actual Marketing Professors, so I did not see a reason to ask the same question again on a public internet board. I did; however, ask (on this forum) how I can go about getting the research experience I keep being told I need to get in order to really improve my application.

Again, I did not come here to cry for sympathy. I was only venting just like lots of other folks have done on here. Nothing more...nothing less.

[MarketingPhD2012]

You may be/probably are entirely right in saying that the programs you applied to prefer foreign students. I'm not disputing that, you would certainly know better than me. However, it's unfair to look at the profile of current students and, just because the majority are foreign, claim that the program prefers foreign students. My dad is a professor, and currently the entirety of his lab (7 grad students) is foreign and the majority of the students in his particular program are foreign. This is certainly not because they prefer foreign. Quite the opposite in fact. They would prefer to have more American students, and given two candidates with identical qualifications, would choose the American student over the foreign student. The fact is (again, in his program) there are simply not enough qualified American students applying.

My feeling that the programs I applied to tend to admit more foreign students was not based on me looking at the current PhD student profiles. This is just something that I was told by a Marketing Professor. It is no secret that a lot of schools are facing unprecedented budget constraints/cuts. Unfortunately, this has led to smaller than normal class sizes. Universities are using whatever measures they can to assure the continuation of their various business programs. What my professor was trying to convey is the fact that foreign students are blessed in the fact that their countries/families/businesses back them 100% financially. This, in turn, allows schools to admit students into their classes and not have to spend a dime. Can you blame them? I certainly can't. One of the schools I applied to (Rice) decided not to admit anyone because of budget constraints.

Please do not think I am generalizing my belief/perception of a harsh reality of a great deal of American students seeking to gain admittance into a business school. In the economy we are in right now, it is just a little harder to get into a decent school. Again, I am not trying to belittle, talk about, take a cheap shot at, or anything to foreign students. I only wish America took such an interest in the education of its citizens that sought to pursue such an advanced degree such as a PhD. I can guarantee you, if I would seek acceptance into a foreign university, the good USA would NOT back me financially. I was just upset and was venting.

Finally, I apologize to any foreign student I may have offended, upset, or whatever. Again, it WAS NOT my intent!!!!!!! I am very sorry!

Edited April 17, 2012 by MarketingPhD2012

[3point14]

Please do not think I am generalizing my belief/perception of a harsh reality of a great deal of American students seeking to gain admittance into a business school. In the economy we are in right now, it is just a little harder to get into a decent school. Again, I am not trying to belittle, talk about, take a cheap shot at, or anything to a foreign students. I only wish America took such an interest in the education of its citizens that sought to pursue such an advanced degree such as a PhD. I can guarantee you, if I would seek acceptance into a foreign university, the good USA would back me financially. I was just upset and was venting.

Finally, I apologize to any foreign student I may have offended, upset, or whatever. Again, it WAS NOT my intent!!!!!!! I am very sorry!

Hey, no worries! Like I said, you know way more about the programs you applied to than I do (especially as my field is not marketing). I really didn't interpret your original post as belittling to foreign students, I just didn't want you to think that a majority of foreign grad students definitely meant the program preferred foreign students (even thought that appears to be true in your case). Obviously it's different in every field--in my dad's program it's grant money funding his students (foreign or domestic), so they'd really like to get a few more American students in who, after completion of their degree, are more likely to stay in the country and contribute to American science. Good luck next round!

[kaykaykay]

" What my professor was trying to convey is the fact that foreign students are blessed in the fact that their countries/families/businesses back them 100% financially. This, in turn, allows schools to admit students into their classes and not have to spend a dime. "

All the foreign students that the university takes with money will not ruin your chances at all because they are not competing for your spot!, if they do not cost for the university they are extra to the class size. On the other hand if foreign students do not come with their own money cost more for public universities than American students= it is HARDER for them to get in. I am a foreign student and I am not "blessed" with any of the stuff you list, and it was harder for me to get in and I was competing for one of the actual fully funded spots. You can be angry or whatever with me or someone like me but not with the funded foreign students.

BUT Jesus, where do you live? 98% of the scholarships are for American nationals only and American students can take out loans/ work part time while in school (not us!). YOU should look around for a scholarship and apply to universities with your own money!!!! It is much easier for you than for foreign students. Be proactive!

Edited April 17, 2012 by kalapocska

[Ladril]

I seriously doubt there is some conspiracy afoot to favour foreign students over American students at some programs. I also cannot think of any rationale for doing it. In fact, the opposite tendency is the usual situation. If there is really an overrepresentation of foreign students at some programs, this is likely to be something contingent and temporary, probably as a result of the recession.

But Jesus, man, what the heck? It's not like you lost an eye or a limb. Your current job may be tedious and unfulfilling, but at least you and your family have an income you can fall back on. Go check the unemployment statistics in Europe and consider yourself privileged. I guess you're not one of those wondering what your children will have to eat tomorrow. There is always time for polishing your application or thinking about an alternative plan. There are lots of great things to do in life besides becoming a university professor. There is no need to start a thread with a tirade about how others are taking opportunities from you. You tried and you failed. Very well, now do something about it.

Edited April 17, 2012 by Ladril

[CHOCTICK]

Get some applicable job experience then try again. Or go become a teacher, public employee, or soldier for awhile then apply again once your resume gains some heft. Just my .02. I've always wanted to use the .02--this was my first time.

God Speed.

[imonedaful]

Also, aren't these marketing PhD programs among those that only accept 2 or 3 students each year? If that's the case, the odds of getting into one are very small. Why be disheartened?

Almost any business PHD program is like this. Even at large universities they do not accept more than 5 students into any one concentration. They generally take on 1-5 students. There is a small group of people that sit on the committee that make these decisions. It is all about if that group of people decides to pick you out of a large pool of applicants. It is quite a gamble. It is true that a good number of these programs accept mostly foreign students. The program I applied to was 64% international students and 66% male. I am definitely a minority in my field being American and a woman!

[AbaNader]

Looks like I have been rejected from every school. I am so angry and depressed. I don't know what I am going to do. Don't even know if I am going to even waste my time or money reapplying next year. Looking at the previous classes, seems most universities are only interested in foreign students for the program I was hoping to get into.

To be perfectly honest, it is a little disheartening to not even be able to get into a school, in my own country, for a Marketing PhD. I am so through with this whole process. Guess I need to start looking for a job now! Whatever! F it!!!

--Out

I was in your same position the last time I applied. I am now holding an offer from one of my top schools. What did I do? Well after I got over my anger, blame, depression, etc., I sat down calmly and did some pretty thorough research on students who got accepted to the schools I wanted to go to. Where did they do their undergrad? What was their GPA? What was their GRE score? How many/what type of publications did they have? Who probably wrote their recommendation letters? After doing that, I then researched what professors typically look for (they is a surprisingly large amount of information on this online - written by professors). I then looked at my own profile, and circled all my weakness. I then gave myself 2 years to overcome all those difficulties. I don't want to talk about specifics about how approached the problems in my application but I'd be happy to share my experiences over PM. Bottom line: you can do it if you want but you need a ton of patience and a ton of determination.