Too late to get back in 'the game'? (SocPsych)

[Misty W]

So here's my sob story and question:

 

I graduated from my undergrad in 2008 with huge aspirations of going into a Social Psych program (emphasis in psych of religion). HOWEVER, couple of years prior to graduating, I was "blessed" with taking over the responsibility of raising my niece and nephews (long story that I won't go into). The gist of it was this - single woman, working full-time, going to school full-time, and raising 3 kids.

 

Now, 5 YEARS (long, long years) later, at age 37, the last child is 14 years old and I'm rotting away at my inner core because I am working a job for the paycheck (albeit a decent paycheck) and am missing psychology and research like a long lost first love.

 

In my previous life as an ambitious student, I hade an overall 3.8 GPA with a 4.0 in my core courses. I have a healthy amount of research experience, had great working relationships with a few professors who ooh'd and ahh'd about how well I would do, and still am the nerd that looks up research topics for fun, even to the extent of doing literature reviews related to the hypothesis and writing up reports. I'm even (re)learning German so I can read research in psych of religion in that language. I'm thinking of auditing some classes at my alma mater, re-connecting with my prof's, and maybe even an independent study.

 

Now, the whole reason for this blah blah blah: I'm looking for honest opinions about the reasonableness of my desire to get back into school due to age, time away, etc. Any other middle agers out there that have decided to swim out to the deep waters of knowledge again after walking along the shore for a long time? Any thoughts, experiences, warnings you'd like to share?

[BeingThere]

Hi Misty, I sent you a message.  :-)

[EastCoasting]

A friend got into a clinical doctoral program at age 47. I think if you are really good, and you can prove it with experience and good, testable ideas, that you have a decent shot. But then again I'm just an applicant myself (and check out Adam Cohen's work if you haven't seen it yet)

[Jon-Jon Johnson]

I also have a friend who was accepted into high tier clinical programs in her mid-30s, so it is definitely doable. From her journey, the biggest thing you will probably have to address is not your age per se but rather whether you are truly ready and able to start down that path given your other sidetracks. Non-traditional students can be seen as bringing a lot to the table that 22-year-olds cannot, but it is also a bit of a question mark along the lines of the programs wondering whether you will end up abandoning the whole thing a year or two in because you need and/or want to return to a job with a regular income (for instance).

 

The above is just an example, and it may be somewhat unlikely that anyone would ever ask or comment directly about it, but the idea is to put yourself in their shoes and think about what would potentially raise questions about your application, and then cut them off at the pass. If you can address them as part of your SoP narrative, that can be a good way to make a preemptive strike and nullify that issue from the get-go. Hopefully what I'm trying to say makes sense; I don't know how good my try is.

 

Oh, and there are more formal things like you needing to take GREs again since your last set of scores is (presumably) now more than five years old, so I would start looking into that as well.

Edited March 6, 2013 by Jon-Jon Johnson

[zapster]

The biggest challenge will be getting good academic LORs and ensuring your SOP convincingly addresses why you want to get into this program now (and in my opinion - should NOT dwell too much on personal reasons for why you did not get into this earlier). If you manage these two aspects, I would think you have as good a shot as anyone else with similar credentials.

 

As some of the other comments have said, there is a lot to be said for the experience and ideas that a non-traditional student brings to the table, and you should concentrate on highlighting those areas. Start your application process early and ensure you can tick off the right boxes on whatever is currently under your control - for example the GRE, meeting with your earlier professors to build a rapport for getting strong LORs, researching the programs that you want to get into in a great amount of detail - especially contacting potential POIs early on with a brief academic/professional background of yourself and a note on your research interests and why you are interested in their program. Ask (directly or indirectly - depending on what you are comfortable with) whether they believe you will be a good fit. Doing this early on will give you a good idea of which programs will be more suitable / accepting. Ensure you are familiar with recent research in your area of interest. Finally, in your SOP I would advise demonstrating strong specific research interests rather than leaving it very generic.

 

Best of Luck!

[magusvulgaris]

I don't know if you can generalize from Israel to US, but I know some people who started their PhD at their late-30s, and they are VERY successful. I think that the “black sheep” effect can play on your side, if you make the right impression. So yeah, I think that you should definitely try. I wish you the best, good luck!

[lewin]

Do you want an academic job or just some graduate education and then something related to research? The latter might be fine but, frankly, I'd discourage the former.

 

If I had a good job at age 37 I would never give it up and risk an academic career because A PhD is a hard slog with dim job prospects. If you spend next year reconnecting with profs to get letters and experience, it's still 5-7 years of graduate school and 1-3 years of post doc. Adding that up, you could be almost 50 before having a job again. I already feel like this process is taking forever and I'm "only" 30(ish).

 

There's a third option, which is find a different job that you like more.

[earl.palamino]

I am in my mid 40s and just applied to clinical psych programs for entry this Fall.  The biggest challenge for me is jumping through all the hoops that the programs require.  When you're an adult and when you have an informed opinion, you can challenge the status quo thinking (which is a plus and a credit to what you can contribute), but it's also a real challenge to institutions and their processes.  You may find yourself butting heads with systems you cannot change and following rules that you don't agree with.  There's a lot of learning to be had, but there's also a lot of useless, outdated, past-its-prime coursework that the system feels the need to cram into your skull to justify the length of its program and the tenure of its tired professors.  

[PsychGirl1]

I'm 26 and i just got into a PhD program for next fall :-). It happens! GO FOR IT. I think some professors actually prefer "mature" students.

[midwestgirl]

I am 31, graduated in 2005 with my undergrad and am applying to PhD programs for Fall 2013.  The biggest challenge for me was the time that has passed.  My GRE scores were not stellar, they were slightly above average.  It was also challenge to get strong LOR, I ended up with one academic letter and two from my career, I don't know if that will work against me, but it's the best I could do!  I'm hoping that my experience will be viewed in a positive light and work to benefit me but with other applicants who have 4.0 GPA, better GRE scores and stronger academic LOR I can't help but feel the odds are stacked against me.  I'm counting down the days till April 15th when this process will be over & I will at least know what the result is!  

 

It is encouraging to read that there are others who are "older" also applying to grad school.  If this round of applications doesn't end up with an acceptance I may re-take the GRE & audit some courses to get stronger LOR from professors.    

Edited March 6, 2013 by midwestgirl

[BeingThere]

Do you want an academic job or just some graduate education and then something related to research? The latter might be fine but, frankly, I'd discourage the former.

 

If I had a good job at age 37 I would never give it up and risk an academic career because A PhD is a hard slog with dim job prospects. If you spend next year reconnecting with profs to get letters and experience, it's still 5-7 years of graduate school and 1-3 years of post doc. Adding that up, you could be almost 50 before having a job again. I already feel like this process is taking forever and I'm "only" 30(ish).

 

There's a third option, which is find a different job that you like more.

 

These may be valid points, but you are going to be 50 anyway (if you're lucky.)  And you'll still have 20 years of work-life ahead of you.  I don't know about job prospects either way; there's no way to forecast what the outcome will be due to so many variables at play.  "Good job" is such a subjective concept, isn't it?

[Soc Cog]

I'm fairly old to be starting a PhD program, but I live simply and I'm easy to satisfy.  I took a huge pay cut and a gave up a steady research job to pursue experimental psych but I'm perfectly happy with that (for now).  In this case, job security and income aren't all that important to me - YMMV (will vary!!!).

 

Just make sure you are as honest with yourself as possible about what the likely outcomes of your switch will be and try to estimate if you will be satisfied with those outcomes!

[lewin]

These may be valid points, but you are going to be 50 anyway (if you're lucky.)  And you'll still have 20 years of work-life ahead of you.  I don't know about job prospects either way; there's no way to forecast what the outcome will be due to so many variables at play.  "Good job" is such a subjective concept, isn't it?

 

Oh, good is definitely subjective. I interpreted the OP's job as paying well but not very fulfilling, which is why I mentioned the third option of switching jobs. But unambiguously  the job prospects for academics are terrible; it's easier to make partner at a law firm than become a tenured professor. And with current trends in higher-education funding and online education, that situation is unlikely to change. If anything, it'll get harder to find a TT job in the next decade.

 

I'm not trying to be a dream crusher, I just want to make sure that the OP has a realistic perspective of what a social psychology PhD will bring, and one counterweight post to the flood of "Go to grad school, it's great!". If the OP can live with that then go for it,

 

Admittedly, I'm also colored by my own situation, which is feeling poor and sick of job-related uncertainty

[EastCoasting]

One can also use a social PhD to work in the industry.

[BeingThere]

Oh, good is definitely subjective. I interpreted the OP's job as paying well but not very fulfilling, which is why I mentioned the third option of switching jobs. But unambiguously  the job prospects for academics are terrible; it's easier to make partner at a law firm than become a tenured professor. And with current trends in higher-education funding and online education, that situation is unlikely to change. If anything, it'll get harder to find a TT job in the next decade.

 

I'm not trying to be a dream crusher, I just want to make sure that the OP has a realistic perspective of what a social psychology PhD will bring, and one counterweight post to the flood of "Go to grad school, it's great!". If the OP can live with that then go for it,

 

Admittedly, I'm also colored by my own situation, which is feeling poor and sick of job-related uncertainty

Lewin00, your input is certainly valued and respected by me.  And I don't doubt that decent positions in academia are scarce and hard to get.  I always appreciate your input in all of the posts I've read from you on these various threads.