Looking for wisdom and insight

[Joanne1018]

At 18, I applied and was accepted into NYU, but was discouraged to attend by my parents. At 28, I still feel a sense of urgency to fulfill this dream. I'm currently attending USC online program pursuing a Masters degree in Social Work. Upon this completion, I intend to pursue another Masters degree in Creative Writing, hopefully at NYU. My best friend lives in Brooklyn, she was born and raised in NY. I've been to the city 4 times to visit, so I'm aware of what it's like, although I'm sure there's a lot I'm unaware of. I guess I'm just looking for any advice to make this process less difficult....I come from a VERY unsupportive family, so decisions like this have always been tough to make. Anyway, I know this isn't a psychology forum so back to the point here, those living in NYC, what are my chances of not being homeless if I move? Honestly, just wise advice, opinions, suggestions, from those with more insight and experience is greatly appreciated.
 

[ExponentialDecay]

...your chances of not being homeless when you move are exactly proportional to your ability to afford rent in and around NYC.

 

my best friend lives in brooklyn too! she fucking hates all the hipsters that have gentrified the neighborhood.

[Pol]

What's your goal in life again?

[GeoDUDE!]

Well Joanne. Your chances of being homeless is directly correlated to how much money you have. I hope you can figure that out. What do you hope to achieve with a degree in creative writing? I've thought the idea of paying for graduate school to not be a good idea unless it directly leads to a job ( Engineering, Law, Medical School) unless you can fully pay for it without going into debt. Even then, I feel the amount of money it would cost for a 2 year degree (in some cases, 100k) would be better getting 5% interest in very safe investments unless the person really has a strong grasp of how their degree would substantially lead to them doing what they want. Happiness is another factor. 

 

 

As for the family issues, I can't really help you there. No one is going to be able to tell you what you really want to do except yourself. I understand family pressure, but not doing something just because your parents say so isn't a good idea. Wisdom comes with age, but not all people with age have wisdom. 

[Vader Was Framed]

I can answer questions about hipsters. I'll hang up and listen. 

[Guest Gnome Chomsky]

 

...your chances of not being homeless when you move are exactly proportional to your ability to afford rent in and around NYC.

 

my best friend lives in brooklyn too! she fucking hates all the hipsters that have gentrified the neighborhood.

She probably lives in the hipster parts. Go to the hood. I'm from Coney Island. Haven't been back in like 5 years but anything west W 6th St was all black and Korean. A lot of crime. No hipsters. 

[deci:belle]

I've been living here all my life, minus the 4 years I went away for undergrad. To be honest, it is really, really expensive to live here. Especially if you choose to live in certain parts of Manhattan and Brooklyn. However with that said, if it is really your dream to live out here - go for it. Many people make that huge jump everyday, so why not you? It will take some hard work if you do not have your family's support. You may need multiple jobs to support yourself. But if you can move in with your friend until you get on your feet go for it! 

Also, as an FYI - NYC isn't all as glamorous as people make it out to be. So just keep that in mind, don't want you to be disappointed by all the expectations you might have. But on the other hand, it is one of the greatest places on earth in many different aspects.

[Guest Gnome Chomsky]

Do you want to do a MA in Social Work before doing a MFA in Creative Writing? If that's the case, you could always work on your writing while you're doing the MA in Social Work. There are a lot of writing groups, workshops, competitions, spoken word slams, etc in NYC. Like others have said, a MFA in Creative Writing puts more people in debt than in mansions. And if you have money problems already, it might be better to get established first. I'm not telling you to give up on writing. I'm a writer too. I was considering a MFA in Poetry a few years ago, but then I decided to study Computer Science to add onto my Linguistics background. But I still practice my writing. I'd suggest doing your MA in Social Work first, getting to know NYC, finding opportunities to write, meeting fellow writers, and if you still want to do a MFA in Creative Writing after you finish, then do it. 

[ExponentialDecay]

Well Joanne. 

 

I'm going to be sanctimonious with you now, Joanne, maybe remind you that you should be inventing the Theory of Everything or curing cancer or building schools for African children or something, throw some percentages in that shit. Blah Blah wisdom. Here's something I wrote in my poetry journal. Wisdom.

 

 

 

She probably lives in the hipster parts. Go to the hood. I'm from Coney Island. Haven't been back in like 5 years but anything west W 6th St was all black and Korean. A lot of crime. No hipsters.

 

Yes, Honorary Oppression Olympics Committee. Her family's lived there ever since they immigrated 15 years ago. 

Edited March 24, 2014 by exponentialdecay

[Lifesaver]

You and I are living a similar life, just flipped. I was born and raised in NYC, went to LSU for undergrad, and have recently been accepted to a handful of MSW programs, one being an ivy. My hope and dream was to go to Tulane for my MSW and thought the ivy was a pipe dream. Until I got in, that is. So now I'm stuck between Tulane and Penn. My father claims that choosing Tulane would be the biggest mistake and I would regret it for the rest of my life. Anyway.. enough about me.

 

How far along are you in your MSW program? If you're about to graduate and will be able to get a job in NYC, I can't imagine why you'd be homeless. Rent is out of this world, but if you have a roommate, it's managable. My brother (who goes to Cooper Union) is paying somewhere in the neighborhood of $900 for his shoebox, which is ridiculously cheap for the neighborhood, but again, it's a shoebox.

 

What is your career goal? Do you plan to use your MSW? Is the masters in creative writing just an excuse to go to NYU? If you're dying to go to NYU, why not just apply to their social work program and call it a day, rather than spending however many more thousands upon thousands of dollars to get a second masters? I get the unsupportive family thing, since my parents didn't talk to me for 3 months when I told them I was going to LSU. But they got over it and your parents will, too. If you want to go (and it'll make financial sense), then go.

[Joanne1018]

I'd like to pursue both my MSW and MFA actually. I'm halfway in my 1st year for my MSW. I've been writing for over a decade, particularly poetry, so I'd like to grow my skills in that area, maybe write a book, after finishing my MSW and working in that field or doing both.The MFA at NYU is somewhat of an excuse to attend, but also they have a great program that excites me to think about.

[Pol]

Where do you see yourself in 5 years and how what ever you want to do will help you achieve it?

 

Pragmatism be rad, yo'

[St@rdust]

Instead of jumping straight into NYU, just go and live there for a few years first.

[m-ttl]

I wanted desperately to move to NYC as well -- until I saw how much the school I applied to was going to charge me to attend, not to mention the cost of living there. Perhaps at 28 you have a better savings than I do, though! I've got UG debt to worry about, etc. Even a small move can run you thousands of dollars in a relocation.

In terms of practicalities, do you have a nest egg to live off of? When you finish your MSW, can you get a job in social work in NYC and then take a year to transition yourself? Can you manage a temp job, if you don't get a social work job? Roughly your options/steps are:

* Have money saved up

* Rent in a temporary sublet, couch surf, find a roommate (you'll need to be on a lease for that which is more difficult)

* Find a job immediately: social work, or temping until you make enough money to be a roommate or get a longer sublet of a few months

*scrape by your NYC expenses - no splurging

*Get accepted to NYU. If you get loans, see if they cover enough for having a roommate, splitting a studio, etc.

* If you lack a guarantor, which I'm going to guess you don't make 30-40x your rent, and it sounds like your parents won't do it (which would likely raise the amount to 120x+ the rent) -- find an institutional guarantor. Which means finding a place which will accept this from you, some apartments don't. (I don't think you'll necessarily need one if you're becoming a roommate but that varies)

*Budget roughly $1,400k per month on rent. I was able to find a scant amount of places (studios, mostly) going from $1-$400k, but they could be hell holes for all I know. From what I've learned about the NYC rental markets, you have to be ready to jump *that day* not a month down the line. Many people use agents and the like.

* Don't live in manhattan unless you're prepared to spend at least that much. If you're spending less, you probably have a roommate, which looks recommended anyways. Still, ask yourself if you can live in a studio with a roommate -- and in a six floor walkup without a real stove.

So say you do find a place for $1400 a month, you need, minimally, $16,800 just on rent. Ideally, you should be making roughly $56,000 a year. http://www.nakedapartments.com/blog/rent-to-income/ ...which is why so many people get roommates. Footing that bill on your own will be wildly stressful. Would you end up homeless? I don't know. Do you have enough money saved to start in a sublet? Do you think you can handle another roommate, or two? Are you willing to work other jobs to make rent? If you get accepted to NYU, how will you pay for it? With loans? Will the loans also help you with rent? How much debt will you take? How will you pay it back? If the loans pay for your rent, how will you pay after your MFA is completed?

Why pay for the MFA -- what purpose does it serve for you and your career? I am sure there are dozens of classes, salons, etc for NYCers who write. So what purpose will the NYU degree serve, other than to give you closure on something you wanted at 18 (ten years ago), and get you to New York, which can be done in a myriad of other ways?

[nugget]

Is the program available part time? If it is, I'd consider working full time as a social worker in New York while doing an MFA part time. 

[stella_ella]

I wanted to move to NYC before I got accepted into my grad program. But I wanted to go for naive reasons, mainly because I thought living in the city would be so glamorous. Anyways, my friend who works for a consulting firm there told me that getting paid 60K would be considered a low salary and advised me to go once I had more job experience so that I didn't have to get an entry-level position. I don't want to put a damper on your dreams, but maybe consider working and going to the MFA program part time, so that you'd actually have some money to enjoy the Big Apple once you're there.

[Joanne1018]

Thanks everyone for your great responses! Very helpful insight. I appreciate it.

[bsharpe269]

The second masters seems like a waste of money to me and I would only recommend considering this option if 1) you have a ton of money in savings to blow 2) You get an external fellowship that will pay for your degree + living expenses.

 

You will probably spend nearly 100k to get a 2nd masters when you could get into writing via other routes up there. With degrees in social work and writing, I don't see how you would be able to afford paying of that debt. You would probably be in a horrible financial situation for the rest of your life.

 

I recommend you just move to new york and find a social work job there and do some freelance writing. Once you live there for a while, save up some money, and get some connections in writing, then you could consider doing a class a semester if you really feel like the MFA will benefit your career. My guess is that you education will be suffient to fufil your writing dreams without the 2nd masters though!