Berkeley vs Stanford (with family)

[phdreally]

Hi,

I wish to get some advice from people familiar with the areas/current students. I have admits in both Stanford and Berkeley. There are profs in both universities with who I would love to work. Given these as equal, I would like some feedback on which is a better place for a family situation. We have a newborn who would be a toddler by Fall 2015. All perspectives welcome!

[RP15]

I'm in a similar position (except I have no child). I can use some advice as well. 

My fiancée (who is south american) will be immigrating to the US around next Feb/March 2016. I'm deciding between UCB and Stanford (EE PhD, F15). It will take a few weeks, and probably a few months, before she can get a job. Thus, initially our only source of income will be what I get from UCB/Stanford. Which city has the cheapest salary to living cost ratio? Both universities have a salary of around $30K I believe... (that's not including summer salaries). Any help would be awesome!

Edited February 8, 2015 by RP15

[iphi]

Well, it depends on what is important to you. Do you want to own a home? How about a car? Are you worried about school districts for when your kid is older? Does your SO need a job in the area?

 

I spent several years living and working in both areas (Berkeley 3 years, Palo Alto 1 year), with an SO who is a grad student, so I am familiar with the schools and cities. I would say first off that overall Stanford has a lot more money, and their campus definitely reflects that. However, I think it's easier to get around (both in the town itself and in the area more generally) when you live in Berkeley. I would think that cost of living would be slightly lower in Berkeley, but that's really just a guess. I think both places offer family housing, if that's something you want to look into.

 

Generally my impression as a non-native is that PA is a little "glitzier" and Berkeley is more understated. But you can get out of them whatever you want!

Edited February 8, 2015 by iphi

[TakeruK]

Would you need childcare? Have you compared the childcare facilities at these schools? I did a check of waitlist/financial support policies of schools in California and I believe the UC system has better support than Stanford. Also, check out family leave policies in case you plan on expanding your family in grad school! There are often big differences between a big state school and a private school on these issues.

[phdreally]

Palo alto might be a bit more glitzy and expensive, but the Stanford stipend is 25% higher than berkeley as well (~2400 vs ~3000 per month). It also appears that lot more graduate families use the housing at Stanford than at Berkeley, so a bigger/better community, especially for a growing child (more friends and play mates etc). Stanford housing is in campus, Berkeley housing is a couple miles away. I am feeling Stanford is a better option. Am I missing some major point? (Schools?)

[Chubberubber]

I'm in a very similar situation (newborn and all), and have lived in the area in the past. Berkeley is a bit cheaper than palo alto and a more fun city to live in. However- the cost of living is offset by the difference in stipends. I'm not sure about childcare at sranford, but I know that you can add your child to your healthcare plan at a reasonable price. I would imagine Stanford has more of a "grad community", especially ones with babies, however PA as a city is probably a bit less family friendly than berkeley (but not by much). It ultimately comes down to where you feel more comfortable rasing a family- a rich suburb (PA) or a small city. I do like Berkeley as a city better, and we're looking into the option of living there and me attending stanford (if i'll get in), but a lot of it is because we have family in berkeley...

[justastudent]

I love Berkeley. They were offering a student parent grant of $8000 a year so ask about that. The local public schools are great as well. Also, they have strong community functions for the city and the student parent community. Lots of people drive in the bay area, so please do consider that factor. Berkeley has somewhat good transportation, but with a newborn it would be nice to have a carseat etc. Best of luck!  I don't subscribe to this listserv, but it might be helpful for you. http://parents.berkeley.edu/

[isilya]

Palo alto might be a bit more glitzy and expensive, but the Stanford stipend is 25% higher than berkeley as well (~2400 vs ~3000 per month). It also appears that lot more graduate families use the housing at Stanford than at Berkeley, so a bigger/better community, especially for a growing child (more friends and play mates etc). Stanford housing is in campus, Berkeley housing is a couple miles away. I am feeling Stanford is a better option. Am I missing some major point? (Schools?)

If you're feeling like Stanford is a better option, then go for it! Palo Alto is extraordinarily expensive -- I did a summer research program there last year and it was incredibly hard to find housing I could afford on my stipend (but we weren't allowed to sublet grad housing). However, I've heard most grad students live in the on-campus housing their whole time, so you probably wouldn't have to worry about that. The one thing I will say is that Palo Alto is extremely boring. There's basically nothing to do there unless you want to go to expensive restaurants or high-end furniture stores...so if you need to get out, you're looking at a 1-hour train ride to SF.

[Chubberubber]

I also heard that there's a direct bus (possibly a stanford bus?) that goes from Berkeley to Stanford, which might make it easiyer to live in the better town and still attend the university you fell fits you more. Also- does anyone know if there's any kind of subsidized childcare at Stanford? Or anything like the grant justastudent said that UCB has?

[justastudent]

I forgot to comment on the Berkeley housing. We never lived in the housing in Albany, but we had friends who did and they liked it. It was very new and well-maintained. The biggest complaint is the price, which is why many people live off-campus with kids. Also, you have to take a city bus to campus and it doesn't run frequently enough during the middle part of the day. Some people drove from the housing. I took a city bus from within (off-campus) Berkeley, but you could easily take Bart (train) from other cities. My husband rode bikes with our daughter to school. (lots of bikes in Berkeley) If I had to do it for the long-term 5+year PhD I would live in El Cerrito and rent a bigger apartment. I'm sure there is a reason why I didn't do that, but I can't remember why. 

Basically, as a parent, it boils down to what kind of parents do you want to spend time around? You will find yourself dragged into these play dates, classes, birthday parties etc. and you want to be around people who validate your experience and point of view. The last thing you want to be doing is constantly defending your choices as a parent. If possible, take a visit to get a sense of the "vibe." good luck!

[thr0waway]

Stanford has married student housing.  It's in a nice quiet part of campus and seems like a good place to raise kids (if you can afford it).  You can probably see it during visit weekend if you walk around the school.  They also make an effort to have healthy on-campus dining options, a lot of vegetarian food etc.

 

The Stanford CS department is a shithole though.  The professors are okay, but the department itself doesn't really care about its students.

 

>There are profs in both universities with who I would love to work.

 

There is no guarantee that you will be able to work with the professor you want to work with.  I assure you, if you want to work with someone, so will 8 other people.  And since the CS department does rotations, you will spend your entire first year trying to be better than everyone else.

 

Note that some people do not have advisors at the end of rotation (this happened to two of my friends), and those people are encouraged to switch to the master's program.

[phdreally]

@thr0waway - can you provide some more specifics about how the department doesn't care about students? I understand the "risk" with rotation program (the risk you describe is with the rotation strategy itself, less about the department I feel). Other than the risk, any details on possible "red flags" most appreciated.