Fall 2017 Applicants

[cokpala]

On April 8, 2016 at 9:50 PM, Lisha said:

Hi everybody!

My name is Lisha, I live in India and I'm also applying to International Ed programs for Fall 2017-2018. Currently looking at almost all the same programs you guys have mentioned, with a particular interest in UPenn, Harvard and NYU.

Haven't heard great things about the ICE and CIE programs at Columbia, but would love another opinion if anyone would like to share.

Giving the GRE on July 17th, after which it's SOP season all the way. Again, any advice is always welcome.

Excited to be here

Hi Lisha! 

I agree, UPenn, Harvard, and NYU seem to have solid programs. I don't know enough about the programs at Columbia. 

For the GRE, I'd be no help for the quant section, but for for the verbal and writing, if you need any help, let me know. Welcome!

[Mochi-]

Hey everyone,

I recently just started looking at education graduate schools and am looking for a little guidance. 

Currently, I'm at a top 15 US News institution and have a 3.93/4.00 (I have a 3.94/4.00 in the area that I would be getting my certification). In addition, I belong to student government and a few international social advocacy (where I hold a couple leadership positions). On top of that, I'm also a resident assistant and have summer experience being a program assistant at a non-profit that served K-6 students. 

My primary interest is working with 9-12 students (secondary education). So far, I think I am going to apply to Harvard (TEP), Stanford (STEP), Penn (Urban teacher program), and Columbia (TESOL maybe?). 

Am I reaching too high or will I be a competitive applicant? I haven't taken the GRE yet, but my standardized test scores (ACT/SAT/LSAT) have all been in in the 97th+ percentile, so I'm hoping for a decent score. 

I'm just really not sure what I'm doing right now and there seems to be so much less concrete advice out there for education graduate school than there is for law school/medical school. 

I would really appreciate any advice. If you want to point me at programs to look at or drop a reality check on me, either would be appreciated! 

[Vulpix]

7 hours ago, Mochi- said:

Hey everyone,

I recently just started looking at education graduate schools and am looking for a little guidance. 

Currently, I'm at a top 15 US News institution and have a 3.93/4.00 (I have a 3.94/4.00 in the area that I would be getting my certification). In addition, I belong to student government and a few international social advocacy (where I hold a couple leadership positions). On top of that, I'm also a resident assistant and have summer experience being a program assistant at a non-profit that served K-6 students. 

My primary interest is working with 9-12 students (secondary education). So far, I think I am going to apply to Harvard (TEP), Stanford (STEP), Penn (Urban teacher program), and Columbia (TESOL maybe?). 

Am I reaching too high or will I be a competitive applicant? I haven't taken the GRE yet, but my standardized test scores (ACT/SAT/LSAT) have all been in in the 97th+ percentile, so I'm hoping for a decent score. 

I'm just really not sure what I'm doing right now and there seems to be so much less concrete advice out there for education graduate school than there is for law school/medical school. 

I would really appreciate any advice. If you want to point me at programs to look at or drop a reality check on me, either would be appreciated! 

Your GPA and scores will be just fine, and your experience seems right.  There's no reason you wouldn't get into some or all of these schools.  If you want to be a public school teacher (or private for that matter), I really think you should consider financially your situation and how these very expensive programs may or may not match your needs.  It's my opinion that you should go to a school like Stanford or Harvard if they offer a program that is rare or unique in some way that you cannot experience elsewhere.  (For example, I wanted to be a teacher, so I did my masters at a very affordable CUNY while I was teaching full-time.  It was only at the end of that experience I realized I wanted to study something different that only a few schools offered).  I do not see any reason to go into debt for a professional teaching certification.

[Mochi-]

6 hours ago, Heather1011 said:

If you want to be a public school teacher (or private for that matter), I really think you should consider financially your situation and how these very expensive programs may or may not match your needs... (For example, I wanted to be a teacher, so I did my masters at a very affordable CUNY while I was teaching full-time.  It was only at the end of that experience I realized I wanted to study something different that only a few schools offered).  I do not see any reason to go into debt for a professional teaching certification.

Thanks for the feedback; I really appreciate it and completely agree! I have no intention of taking on a large amount of debt for my master's + licensure/certification. From what I understand, all of the schools I listed giver merit aid (to varying degrees). My preferred program would be Vanderbilt, which also happens to be the cheapest (and which I have a much higher chance at a scholarship). I'll also heed your advice and send out an application to my state flagship. Do you have any other advice that you think might be useful in my search for schools? My long-term goal would DEFINITELY be to return for my PhD/EdD after 5+ years of teaching to pursue administrative positions at K-12 schools or professorship positions at universities. 

[Vulpix]

2 hours ago, Mochi- said:

Thanks for the feedback; I really appreciate it and completely agree! I have no intention of taking on a large amount of debt for my master's + licensure/certification. From what I understand, all of the schools I listed giver merit aid (to varying degrees). My preferred program would be Vanderbilt, which also happens to be the cheapest (and which I have a much higher chance at a scholarship). I'll also heed your advice and send out an application to my state flagship. Do you have any other advice that you think might be useful in my search for schools? My long-term goal would DEFINITELY be to return for my PhD/EdD after 5+ years of teaching to pursue administrative positions at K-12 schools or professorship positions at universities. 

Very smart to seek out the best financial decision, and yes, merit aid can go a long way (especially at Vanderbilt compared to the rest of these... NYU and HGSE are a longshot in terms of significant aid).  If you are certain that you want a doctorate later, then going to one of these schools is more worthwhile than if you didn't, because the name will stick out for you later (but your undergrad institution will presumably stick out also, so that shouldn't be the biggest factor).

This probably isn't what you want to hear, but the best decision I accidentally ever made was to work (teaching) for 3 years before doing my Harvard masters.  I didn't plan any of it this way, but in those three years I managed to save up enough to pay for my degree without going into much debt (just a little bit of loans for next year).  This makes me confident that even in the highly unlikely event that the program is a bad fit or not worthwhile, I won't have traumatically screwed over my future income.  Although getting a masters over with quickly is very appealing (which is why I jumped into one I didn't want at the CUNY), working and saving up money was inadvertently the best thing to happen to me, and something I would wholeheartedly recommend to anyone who wants to go to an expensive school.

[Mochi-]

7 hours ago, Heather1011 said:

This probably isn't what you want to hear, but the best decision I accidentally ever made was to work (teaching) for 3 years before doing my Harvard masters.  I didn't plan any of it this way, but in those three years I managed to save up enough to pay for my degree without going into much debt (just a little bit of loans for next year).  This makes me confident that even in the highly unlikely event that the program is a bad fit or not worthwhile, I won't have traumatically screwed over my future income.  Although getting a masters over with quickly is very appealing (which is why I jumped into one I didn't want at the CUNY), working and saving up money was inadvertently the best thing to happen to me, and something I would wholeheartedly recommend to anyone who wants to go to an expensive school.

Ughhhhh, I completely agree with you on this point too, except here is the hitch. I'm on an accelerated graduation track (3 years instead of 4). Since I just started looking into education now, I won't be able to graduate from my current institution with licensure (and thus can't teach directly after undergrad). I NEED to enter a MA/M.Ed program to get licensure (or at least do some form of continuing studies for a year). I unfortunately cannot stay another year; my parents said they would pay for three years of college (hence why I worked my ass off to graduate a year early), so I'd either face full cost of attendance at my current institution ($65,000+) by staying another year or graduate early and get into (hopefully) Vanderbilt/H/S/my state flagship and pay either the same price (and simultaneously diversify my education background and networking opportunities) or get a scholarship and it'll be even cheaper. 

I really appreciate all the advice so far. I'm specifically looking at the higher tier schools, because I'm interested in the Phd/Ed.D route (with 100% confidence), so I want to have the strongest background when applying to those programs in the distant future. Your advice has been really great so far and again, I really appreciate it. Now that I've shared a bit more with my weird graduation situation, do you have any other advice, or should I just go forward with caution? 

[Vulpix]

18 hours ago, Mochi- said:

Ughhhhh, I completely agree with you on this point too, except here is the hitch. I'm on an accelerated graduation track (3 years instead of 4). Since I just started looking into education now, I won't be able to graduate from my current institution with licensure (and thus can't teach directly after undergrad). I NEED to enter a MA/M.Ed program to get licensure (or at least do some form of continuing studies for a year). I unfortunately cannot stay another year; my parents said they would pay for three years of college (hence why I worked my ass off to graduate a year early), so I'd either face full cost of attendance at my current institution ($65,000+) by staying another year or graduate early and get into (hopefully) Vanderbilt/H/S/my state flagship and pay either the same price (and simultaneously diversify my education background and networking opportunities) or get a scholarship and it'll be even cheaper. 

I really appreciate all the advice so far. I'm specifically looking at the higher tier schools, because I'm interested in the Phd/Ed.D route (with 100% confidence), so I want to have the strongest background when applying to those programs in the distant future. Your advice has been really great so far and again, I really appreciate it. Now that I've shared a bit more with my weird graduation situation, do you have any other advice, or should I just go forward with caution? 

It sounds like you don't have any existing debt, which is huge, and that you definitely want to go the PhD route.  So I say go for it.  I would add though that there are MANY teaching jobs (or other jobs, of course) available without licensure.  I was certified after college, but I wound up working a public charter school where my certification did not actually matter. At least half of the teachers I work with do not have education licenses/degrees. (And we get paid 10% above the department of education).  Just another option.

[Mochi-]

3 hours ago, Heather1011 said:

It sounds like you don't have any existing debt, which is huge, and that you definitely want to go the PhD route.  So I say go for it.  I would add though that there are MANY teaching jobs (or other jobs, of course) available without licensure.  I was certified after college, but I wound up working a public charter school where my certification did not actually matter. At least half of the teachers I work with do not have education licenses/degrees. (And we get paid 10% above the department of education).  Just another option.

Yeap, you're correct. I'll leave UG with $0 in debt. I'm very thankful for that. 

I didn't know that there are teaching jobs out there that do not require licensure! I have to ask, are those jobs still respected by other teachers/would taking those jobs be in any way a hindrance to my future as an administrator? Also, did teachers at your charter school ever have to worry about your school deciding they wanted only licensed teachers and possibly getting the boot for not having their licenses? 

[Vulpix]

20 hours ago, Mochi- said:

Yeap, you're correct. I'll leave UG with $0 in debt. I'm very thankful for that. 

I didn't know that there are teaching jobs out there that do not require licensure! I have to ask, are those jobs still respected by other teachers/would taking those jobs be in any way a hindrance to my future as an administrator? Also, did teachers at your charter school ever have to worry about your school deciding they wanted only licensed teachers and possibly getting the boot for not having their licenses? 

Well, I was a certified teacher working with uncertified teachers, and what I learned INSTANTLY was that my certification in no way prepared me to be a better teacher/more qualified than them.  It's a job you can only learn by doing, and is mostly based on your interpersonal skills, none of which can be improved by earning an education degree.  So, as soon as I realized I was not as good of a teacher as my uncertified friends, any "looking down on" them went out the window.  But, more to your point, all of these teachers were *pursuing* a certification through some kind of alternative track (TFA, a masters degree).  They weren't going to lose their jobs or be replaced, the school just expected all of them to *get* certified while they were teaching.  

[cokpala]

On April 14, 2016 at 6:19 PM, Mochi- said:

Yeap, you're correct. I'll leave UG with $0 in debt. I'm very thankful for that. 

I didn't know that there are teaching jobs out there that do not require licensure! I have to ask, are those jobs still respected by other teachers/would taking those jobs be in any way a hindrance to my future as an administrator? Also, did teachers at your charter school ever have to worry about your school deciding they wanted only licensed teachers and possibly getting the boot for not having their licenses? 

Mochi,

Echoing what Heather1011 already said, I think having some time to be teach and be sure you want to be in a classroom before paying a lot of money makes a lot of sense. I graduated from undergrad in 3 years, like you will (it sounds like), and I knew I wanted to be in education but wasn't entirely sure if I wanted to be a classroom teacher so I worked at two different schools without being certified for a year after graduating. After a year, I was more certain that I enjoyed teaching and wanted to be in a classroom and then enrolled in a credential program and took night classes for a year and a half, while working full-time as a classroom teacher. I originally planned to get my MA with my credential but after paying over $25,000 and not feeling like the program was amazing or that I learned as much as I wanted to, I decided to hold off to wait to apply to a MA program until I was certain about what I wanted. And now I feel like I am ready and know what I want, after having worked full-time for five years. 

I also agree with Heather that I realized very quickly that with teaching, so much of the learning happens while doing it. Even after I got my credential, I has colleagues without college degrees that were 150% more qualified than myself to be teaching in a classroom (private elementary school)I think getting the experience to work in classroom, without going into debt (if you're not entirely certain) makes a lot of sense. 

That being said, you can also get a great classroom experience being part of a student teaching program in a great credential program, so it definitely depends on the program and what you're looking for, too.

[nta920]

I'm in the (very) early stages of considering a PhD in Education. I am wondering how much GPA matters when applying after nearly a decade of work experience. My undergraduate GPA (Political Science @ competitive US research university) was a 3.5 and my Masters (Elementary Education, Ivy) was a 3.75. I have not taken the GRE yet. My research interests and professional background are varied. I have five years of teaching experience and five years of various roles within philanthropy and child/education related non-profits. The types of programs that are initially appealing to me are multidisciplinary social science programs such as Berkeley Social and Cultural Studies, Stanford Race, Inequality and Langauge in Ed and NYU Urban Ed. I do not have formal (published) research experience.

Based on this sketch, how competitive is my application at top tier schools? Again, I know this is early, but just trying to get a sense of feasibility

Edited April 15, 2016 by nta920

[Levon3]

@nta920, my undergrad gpa was lower than yours, though my grad gpa was higher. I have about the same amount of work experience and also no publications, and I still managed to get into the school I wanted. 

The whole package is assessed, so I worked really hard on my SoP, asked strategically for LoRs, and studied for a few months for the GRE. 

[nta920]

6 hours ago, Levon3 said:

@nta920, my undergrad gpa was lower than yours, though my grad gpa was higher. I have about the same amount of work experience and also no publications, and I still managed to get into the school I wanted. 

The whole package is assessed, so I worked really hard on my SoP, asked strategically for LoRs, and studied for a few months for the GRE. 

Thanks Levon3, helpful insight! 

[zmv30]

Oh deary, I feel inadequate now... but I guess since I'm not looking at the super competitive programs I should be fine. I'm looking to go into Higher Education, and focusing on programs that have a mental health counselling objective, like the College Student Personnel Administration program at JMU. I have a 2.89 GPA... yeah I know, there's way to much backstory behind that. I switched majors from Applied Mathematics to Psychology at the beginning of this year and my new major/semester GPA is 3.75. I'm scheduled to take the GRE at the end of June and have no worries about doing well on it, but have enough time to take it again before I start filling out applications. Between the GRE, my personal statement, and experience I hope I'll make up for the first two years of advanced math courses. 

[Vulpix]

12 minutes ago, zmv30 said:

Oh deary, I feel inadequate now... but I guess since I'm not looking at the super competitive programs I should be fine. I'm looking to go into Higher Education, and focusing on programs that have a mental health counselling objective, like the College Student Personnel Administration program at JMU. I have a 2.89 GPA... yeah I know, there's way to much backstory behind that. I switched majors from Applied Mathematics to Psychology at the beginning of this year and my new major/semester GPA is 3.75. I'm scheduled to take the GRE at the end of June and have no worries about doing well on it, but have enough time to take it again before I start filling out applications. Between the GRE, my personal statement, and experience I hope I'll make up for the first two years of advanced math courses. 

JMU is a great school for education, I know a few excellent teachers who went there!!

[Cat Time]

3 hours ago, zmv30 said:

Oh deary, I feel inadequate now... but I guess since I'm not looking at the super competitive programs I should be fine. I'm looking to go into Higher Education, and focusing on programs that have a mental health counselling objective, like the College Student Personnel Administration program at JMU. I have a 2.89 GPA... yeah I know, there's way to much backstory behind that. I switched majors from Applied Mathematics to Psychology at the beginning of this year and my new major/semester GPA is 3.75. I'm scheduled to take the GRE at the end of June and have no worries about doing well on it, but have enough time to take it again before I start filling out applications. Between the GRE, my personal statement, and experience I hope I'll make up for the first two years of advanced math courses. 

 I have seen many cases of people with low GPAs in one major getting into graduate programs in other fields after having switched majors and showing that they can excel there, and your focus on mental health issues is much more strongly linked with your new major than your old one. Be sure to make it clear in your applications that the 2.89 doesn't represent what you'd bring to the program!

[zmv30]

2 hours ago, Cat Time said:

 I have seen many cases of people with low GPAs in one major getting into graduate programs in other fields after having switched majors and showing that they can excel there, and your focus on mental health issues is much more strongly linked with your new major than your old one. Be sure to make it clear in your applications that the 2.89 doesn't represent what you'd bring to the program!

That's what I'm planning to do, and if I keep up my grades like I have been I should break 3.0 before I graduate. But the story of how I got my act together and the people who helped out was what got me interested in Student Affairs and my grades have never been so bad that I couldn't hold leadership positions. So I think I bring enough to a program because of it.

[Cat Time]

Does anyone have an idea of what the GPA's/GRE scores of admitted POLS students tend to be? I know this isn't published, but info often has a way of getting out somehow!

 

[Cat Time]

8 minutes ago, zmv30 said:

That's what I'm planning to do, and if I keep up my grades like I have been I should break 3.0 before I graduate. But the story of how I got my act together and the people who helped out was what got me interested in Student Affairs and my grades have never been so bad that I couldn't hold leadership positions. So I think I bring enough to a program because of it.

That's good to hear---it sounds like you've got a strong narrative for your applications and that's very important.

[t_ruth]

On 4/15/2016 at 6:35 PM, nta920 said:

I'm in the (very) early stages of considering a PhD in Education. I am wondering how much GPA matters when applying after nearly a decade of work experience. My undergraduate GPA (Political Science @ competitive US research university) was a 3.5 and my Masters (Elementary Education, Ivy) was a 3.75. I have not taken the GRE yet. My research interests and professional background are varied. I have five years of teaching experience and five years of various roles within philanthropy and child/education related non-profits. The types of programs that are initially appealing to me are multidisciplinary social science programs such as Berkeley Social and Cultural Studies, Stanford Race, Inequality and Langauge in Ed and NYU Urban Ed. I do not have formal (published) research experience.

Based on this sketch, how competitive is my application at top tier schools? Again, I know this is early, but just trying to get a sense of feasibility

Your GPA seems fine. But as many of us have stated on this board, for PhD programs it isn't about the school, but about the PI. You shouldn't be choosing a PhD program based on the school--you should be finding five to ten PIs at various schools that you want to work with and contacting them.

I suppose this does depend on what you want to do after graduation. If you want to go into academia, you will be entering into a community based on your sub-field, and if you go to a "top tier" school that has no one in your sub-field, it isn't going to help you much.

[rockrmoose]

Hi everyone!

I'm applying to International Education MA programs and from the Bay Area in California (like @cokpala) and planning to stay in the area for financial and family reasons. As a result, my choices are limited and I can only apply to University of San Francisco's International/Multicultural Education MA, Stanford's ICE/IEPA MA, and Monterrey Inst. of International Studies International Education Management MA. I think my chances into USF and MIIS are good, but I want to know if I should even consider Stanford. 

My GRE scores are really average. 155 Verbal and 154 Quant, yet my AWA was great, scored a 5! This was already my second time taking it and I don't want to take it again.

I graduated from UC Santa Cruz in 2015 majoring in Language Studies with a concentration in Chinese and Spanish. Minored in Modern Chinese History. My major GPA was 3.69 and my cumulative GPA was 3.65.

I feel like my average GRE score and average GPA could made up for through my experiences the past couple of years.

I've been heavily involved in K-12 education - volunteered in a 2nd/3rd grade classroom for 2 years, taught ESL to adult immigrants for 1 year, TA'd in an Algebra 1 class, and taught my own Geometry summer school course. This past year I was a Fulbright English Teaching Assistant in Taiwan.

I have experience doing research, although in the humanities rather than the social sciences. I've done archival research at Stanford and Yale campuses after being awarded a Humanities Undergraduate Research Award by UCSC for a Chinese history paper. 

I was a leader for 2 years in a student organization known for community service.

I studied abroad in Argentina one summer doing intensive language study.

What do you guys think? Do I stand a chance or should I just apply to USF and MIIS?

Thanks

Edited June 9, 2016 by rockrmoose

[day_manderly]

On 24/04/2016 at 5:56 PM, t_ruth said:

Your GPA seems fine. But as many of us have stated on this board, for PhD programs it isn't about the school, but about the PI. You shouldn't be choosing a PhD program based on the school--you should be finding five to ten PIs at various schools that you want to work with and contacting them.

Five to ten?! Isn't it a bit excessive?!

[day_manderly]

On 21/04/2016 at 1:10 AM, Cat Time said:

Does anyone have an idea of what the GPA's/GRE scores of admitted POLS students tend to be? I know this isn't published, but info often has a way of getting out somehow!

 

I think what you have to do is go to the Results page and search POLS. Info on GPAs can sometimes be found there. Also, I found this information out there in the open for UPenn, maybe other universities also post it.

[so_it_goes]

3 hours ago, day_manderly said:

Five to ten?! Isn't it a bit excessive?!

@day_manderly Truthfully, no, because other factors (location, other academic opportunities, etc.) will likely deplete that list before you even considering applying. The other reason this is helpful is because you can contact PIs directly and (some) can be rather straightforward in telling you if they plan on taking new students next year.

Considering you're looking at higher ed programs, this advice is especially important because of the significant variation in coursework/specialty of programs nationally. For example, if your interested in policy, some better known programs (ex: UConn, UCLA, UMD) may not be as good of a fit as others (ex: UVA, UIowa, FSU), strictly because of the faculty in the department.

[day_manderly]

8 hours ago, so_it_goes said:

@day_manderly Truthfully, no, because other factors (location, other academic opportunities, etc.) will likely deplete that list before you even considering applying. The other reason this is helpful is because you can contact PIs directly and (some) can be rather straightforward in telling you if they plan on taking new students next year.

Considering you're looking at higher ed programs, this advice is especially important because of the significant variation in coursework/specialty of programs nationally. For example, if your interested in policy, some better known programs (ex: UConn, UCLA, UMD) may not be as good of a fit as others (ex: UVA, UIowa, FSU), strictly because of the faculty in the department.

Oh, ok. For some reason I thought you meant 5-10 in one university. Do you think reaching out to one Pl per university is enough? That is what I am busy doing.