Composition & Rhetoric - GRE low Q, high V

[snickus]

Hi, I'll be applying soon to doctoral programs in Composition and Rhetoric. I actually posted for the first time a few months ago with the plan to apply to lit programs. Someone mentioned looking into C&R. In time I did, and I decided that's a better fit for my academic interests and background. So thanks already for the helpful advice!

I just took the practice timed GRE that ETS offers. I scored 169(V) and 151(Q).  I know my Q is on the low side, but to be honest I was pleased it wasn't worse! I'm in my 30s and haven't studied math in about 15 years. I'm beyond rusty. As far as V goes, years back I scored similarly on the SATs and LSAT, so I think that's an accurate score for me, give or take.

I'm studying right now for the math section, but I'm scheduled to take the GRE in exactly two weeks and realistically I'm not expecting much of an improvement there. I'm just hoping I don't do worse on the real deal.

My question is for those who know about C&R admissions...Do you think my low Q score will hurt me? Would Q be a decisive factor when choosing between me and someone with similar stats, or is it pretty much V and other aspects of the application that drive their decision?

Thanks in advance for your insights.

[ashley623]

Absolutely not. I have seen some rhet/comp programs outright state they do not consider the quant score at all. 

[snickus]

That's reassuring!

[Warelin]

I think it's important to note a few things here:

• For the most part, only the V is important but only to make it pass the cutoff. One is not likely to get admitted just because they have a 169V vs another person who has a 166V. Grad School admissions in the humanities does not value test scores as much as an LSAT committee would.
• The Grad School might have specific requirements in order to be eligible for certain fellowships. These decisions are made after the individual program decides to admit you.
• Generally speaking, Rhetoric and Composition programs don't value the Verbal score as much as English Literature or Philosophy programs do.
• Some programs such as Penn State, Illinois, Wisconsin (Madison), only admit 1-2 external candidates with an MA in hand.  There were other schools like this but they have moved away from this model.
  
  On a side note, I think you mentioned an interest in Epistemology? Without knowing too much more about your interests, I'd consider looking into Berkeley's Rhetoric program, Louisiana State University, Duquesne's Rhethoric Program, UT Austin's Program in Communication Studies (One if their main areas of study are Rhetoric and Language studies)
  
  If you're considering adding Literature programs, Johns Hopkins, Buffalo, UC-Davis have faculty members interested in the subject; Princeton's Comp Lit Program also has faculty interested in it,
  
  Best of luck with your application season!

Edited November 4, 2017 by Warelin
Added departments within each school

[renea]

I highly, highly doubt an average Q score would eliminate you when your V is so high. Many programs are moving away from using the GRE as a qualifier, but most do not really pay much attention to the quantitative. I personally wouldn't put forth any effort to improve the Q score and would put that effort towards your writing sample, personal statement, or just getting to know the programs you're planning to apply for. And I'm saying that as someone who currently is applying to PhD rhet/comp programs with a 161 V/152 Q and haven't even considered retaking because after talking with so many people in the field the GRE does not rank high in concerns of admission decisions.

[snickus]

@Warelin - Thank you so much, I'll check out those programs you named! You're good at this: I was indeed attracted to Berkeley's program! I quickly wrote them off as a pipe dream though. It's hard for me to shake the idea that top English programs won't even consider me because I didn't attend a prestigious undergrad. Won't I just be throwing away my money on the application?   I've gotten it into my head that top programs care most about: undergrad prestige and letters of rec, then writing sample--statement of purpose--GPA...and then waaay at the bottom, GRE. I've been thinking that programs outside of, say, the top 20 in US News, care less about undergrad prestige so value the other factors more, meaning they'll give me more of a chance (even though it's still a tiny chance!). Why must I love a field with infinitesimal odds?  Thanks again for your response and suggested programs. I'm off work tomorrow and can't wait to research them then.

@renea - I see the wisdom in your advice. It would be more rational for me not to spend any more time studying math...Yet it feels hard to stop! Scared, I guess, and trying to create a guarantee where it feels like I have the most control. Thank you! I'll keep the math study to a minimum so that I can focus on the more important factors. 

 

 

Edited November 7, 2017 by snickus

[xolo]

I wouldn't worry too much. Most of my fellow grad students study literature so they are in the humanities and many of them are not native speakers of English. Their GRE scores can be pathetic and it doesn't seem to matter much. BTW, your scores are pretty impressive I would think, a combined 320, where the cutoffs I've seen have been around 300 if I recall correctly.

Edited November 8, 2017 by xolo

[eilonwy21]

169 is a near perfect Verbal score - you really don't need to worry. I mean, if the program is Comp & Rhetoric, quant doesn't matter very much and is nowhere near an indication of your qualifications for such a program, so likely they don't care.

[snickus]

Thanks @xolo and @eilonwy21!

All of your comments have helped me see that if I'm measured against a similar candidate, Q is the last thing they'd use to decide (since its score doesn't even matter to them in the first place lol).

In my case, one of the schools I'm definitely applying to requires a combined 313 to be eligible for a fellowship. Thanks to the practice test, I think my odds are good that I'll hit that on the real deal. I'll see next week! 

[LuluBell]

With regard to UW-Madison, a masters (not necessarily in English) is required for admission to the PhD with a Comp-Rhet emphasis. If you have a BA/BS and an interest in Afro-American studies you can apply to the Afro-Am MA/Comp-Rhet PhD Bridge program.

The Ph.D. in literary studies does accept applications from people with the BA.

[Daenerys]

My understanding is, as long as you have a 160 V or higher, a combined score of 300 or higher, and a 5 or better on the writing portion, you will be in good shape for the competitive programs.  

[snickus]

21 minutes ago, Daenerys said:

My understanding is, as long as you have a 160 V or higher, a combined score of 300 or higher, and a 5 or better on the writing portion, you will be in good shape for the competitive programs.  

Oh, I hope so! I ended up with a 324, 167(V) 157(Q) and 5.5 on the writing. Even so, I'm still scared that I won't get in anywhere. I'll try to stay optimistic!