merry night wanderer

FYI, I'm going to go ahead and email the Boston U DGS.

I haven't thought about applications in a stressful way in like four days and this is an absolute benediction from the universe. I've never been so grateful to live in a place that celebrates Mardi Gras. Apparently what it takes to get it off the brain is a whole city going out of its mind for the weekend. I'm guessing Ash Wednesday is going to be really rough, though, between Lent and whatever schools are doing/not doing. (Seriously, Harvard, put us out of our misery-)

Honestly, it sounds like it depends on how good of a research project your sample is, for the most part. If you can prove, through the sample, that you have solid research, my impression is you'll be fine. Though most of the schools I applied to asked about my research experience. In full disclosure, I did a summer research fellowship in undergrad, but that was my only research experience. I did a bunch of research solo for my sample. I wonder if there are particularly flexible funded MAs (that is, with not very rigid course requirements, that might let you work on theory and languages and whatever else you're interested in) that could help you out? Either in the English or Comp Lit spaces, or even in French.

Regarding the MFA: I'm assuming you want to do creative writing. I would say for your particular set of interests - no. Some MFAs are very studio-centric. Others have strong lit requirements (I took five lit seminars, overall, myself). However, the focus is very much on your writing output. I loved my MFA experience, but workshop is a pretty brutal time in most programs, and juggling serious investigation of your interests and deepening your knowledge base with that is going to seriously split your attention and I doubt you'd have time to pursue other languages on top of those pursuits. My lit seminars definitely helped prepare me to write at a higher level than my BA, but because I never undertook an extended academic research project, I think I am going to basically come into grad school as a slightly-ahead undergrad, if that makes sense. I wouldn't try to focus on both creative work (especially if you're not actually interested in that as a career) and academic work when you're in the exploration phase. On top of that, applying to MFAs is, if you can believe it, even worse than applying to literature schools! It is very common to apply to 12-20 schools and be shut out for two cycles at a time. They basically only care if they like your writing. I wouldn't put myself through that if I had a choice!

Having seen the PM, I definitely think the case can be made. ? And that story is cringe inducing on absolutely so many levels.

I have to ask: which one?? lol

Nobody is arguing that at later stages the papers aren't read in full, and your initial statement that writing samples are "definitely read in their entirety" doesn't capture what WildeThing and others of us have heard about the first/last introduction paragraphs being vitally important because of skimming. It also doesn't capture what you just said - that if they are initially cut, they are not read in their entirety. That may be for many reasons, but adcoms give the advice to work on the beginning/ending paragraphs this frequently, it is clearly a factor. Even if a specific person's load is a couple dozen apps (as I said) rather than a hundred, that's still a great deal of work on top of personal research and teaching. I know some committees work by subfield, some have a set group doing it, and in a rare few (like JHU) everybody reads them. Of course no one piece of advice is going to apply to every school's process, but generalized advice is all we have to go on, and I'm sure the workload is intense for most readers. Again, I'm not arguing that writing an abstract is necessary, because obviously it isn't, but personally, having basically done an abstract in the introduction in philosophy many times, I find it can turn out overwritten and overconstrained, and have met numerous profs that agree. An abstract can be an elegant way of including the summary without sacrificing some of the grace and flow of an essay. You may adjust my suggestion to "make sure your opening paragraph is very clear about your full argument" if that's what you agree with more, but I feel like this is ultimately splitting hairs since we basically all admit that the initial page or so of a WS is very important. Also, again, abstracts are going to be required of everyone as a scholar so I'm just not sure why there's such hostility voiced to the suggestion.

^ Right, I have heard this from too many places, and from too many professors and adcom types, to discount. And the operative word to both of those points is "this is what I'd suggest." I definitely am not pretending like I stand in a position of authority here! Just as an applicant with thoughts about how their cycle is going, and what they would have done differently.

It's not bad faith at all to acknowledge that they have a huge reading load, in the least - god knows I'd find it excruciating to read dozens of apps on top of teaching! - and might not read more than introductory or closing paragraphs, at very worst, which is definitely something profs have told me happens at some schools if your work doesn't catch their eye. They have a great deal to do, and making your argument as transparent as possible from the beginning isn't selling out or catering, it's just being practical. It's also the way articles are written, right? It's definitely not going to sacrifice your work to practice writing abstracts, which you'll have to do all the time as a scholar anyway.

To be clear, it's not that an abstract is necessary, but I could have done one myself (in my philosophy major, in the way I was asked to write, the introductory paragraphs of an essay were basically an abstract) and I think it would have helped my case. You can never underestimate how little people, even literary scholars, will read. And also, if it's part of what you show others for feedback, they can help you refine it as well. I find summarization like that can really clarify your argument as well as prep readers to understand where you're going. I haven't read a lot of WSes myself - unfortunately nobody MFA cohort applied to lit at all - but I definitely haven't encountered it as common either! I just thought it was a good idea. (BTW, while I'm thinking about it: for whatever it's worth, if anyone wants to read some of my materials, I would be happy to share. The ones I was able to get my hands on were through this forum, and they helped a lot!)

I definitely feel this, it's a flaw of mine and the story of my life in plenty of ways other than literary criticism, and was part of what I was trying to articulate in the other thread. I did so well in my lit seminars because, in effect, my term papers were a massive attempt to make my research and arguments a collaboration between the ideas that came up in class, the professor's thinking, and mine. The challenge for me was always to address an issue I was interested in, in my own way and with my own frameworks, but with a full understanding of the class and professor's perspective. Great way to learn, but that's not what writing samples are about, exactly. In the case of my acceptances, and particular JHU, I think I got quite lucky because their particular faculty just got it. Their email to me just point by point listed everything I was going for. (Seriously, that email was so beautiful and specific and gracious.) I honestly still totally stand by my writing sample, and plan on submitting it to conferences, but I think I should have framed and approached it differently. I think it will always be helpful to learn how to provide context; it'll make you a better writer, and it's something I'm going to seriously work on. But it's also worth remembering that the WS is a bit of a weird setting to have your work read, in and of itself, and will not necessarily be the setting of future presentations, articles, etc., so the feedback here (while something to think about and take to heart) might not be completely representative of your reception as a scholar. When I give advice to future applicants I am definitely going to suggest they 1) write an abstract at the beginning of the WS (which was an idea someone else proposed here and which I didn't know to do) and 2) give the paper to a broad array of professors, not just ones in your specialty and ideally not ones who are already on your side, to make sure that context is there, since I think the feedback of professors who are already your allies (however brilliant and wonderful they may be) might not be enough. And in the future I may ask friends in other fields to read my work to make sure I'm getting my ideas across.

Letting go of Oregon today in the hopes that they can meet the next deadline for my 6k fellowship and give it to someone else in English.

The Creative Writing equivalent of GC is a Facebook group called the MFA Draft, and there's also a Creative Writing PhD draft. It functions basically like here - discussing programs, alerting to notifications, pooling knowledge (or perhaps rumor-mongering!), blowing off steam, occasional flamewars, meeting strangers (I met a bunch of people I still know during my time in Draft). There's a literary arts forum on here but it's not as lively.

I'm pretty much realistically just waiting on UC Santa Barbara (maybe BU?). This whole experience has felt like a choose your own adventure novel, complete with plenty of death in the form of rejections lol

Getting an MFA was one of my best decisions! Fingers crossed for your funding!

It's a fantastic school! And I've found that the schools who have shown interest in me have consistently talked up MFA/CW community as a bonus, even though I applied for literature everywhere else. It seems like I can join readings, informal writing groups, gatherings etc. wherever I end up, which will be great for balancing scholarship with creative work, even if I'm not taking CW coursework. Maybe Irvine is similar.

@AtlasFox - I'm in the same boat, and for the sake of your heart, I wouldn't bank on it. Sometimes notifications come in waves, and this is a program for 3 per genre we're talking about, some of which were notified weeks ago. They do have a waitlist, but I'm sure they don't need a big one. I honestly considered this the longest shot of every school I applied to (and I suspect I don't fit the ivy applicant profile at all). The people I know who have gotten in are ridiculously accomplished, as in, one has a book deal, is working on his second book, and just got an NEA accomplished. I don't know if that helps or hurts, but remember that Creative Writing is an even crazier lottery than literature, and the CW Ph.D is isn't at all necessary to succeed there. @spikeseagulls - The good news is, Irvine has a fantastic MFA, right? You'll have a wonderful community of writers right where you're moving.

You'd think I'd learn out of all my rejections, but I do not have a healthy amount of outcome-detachment from one of my remaining schools. (It's not an Ivy, which somehow makes it even more dangerous.) I keep finding myself staring out the window during work going, "But the interdisciplinarity...." honestly I can't wait to be an actual sufferable person again lol

I've also been dreaming these bizarre dreams about having an apartment alone, for the first time in my life. (I mean, in my case, I might be moving closer to my partner, but we wouldn't live together at first.) I'm just so ready to get to work. I'm going to miss my friends and family terribly, but I just want to be an unrepentant workaholic with few social ties for awhile lol

There just aren't any easy answers when it comes to juggling a partner and a selective career that often requires relocation (or an artistic career, for that matter). This last summer I was a conference/workshop drinking with a bunch of novelists and the topic of "how do you both achieve your dreams when you're both ambitious" came up and the answers were just... crickets. One person takes the lead while the other waits for their turn? Taking backseat while your partner takes the lead? Long distance? (It's doable. I did it for 8 months at a time once! And 5 years overall. It is also the very worst.) Sticking together and turning down opportunities but hustling twice as hard to make it? All are valid; all have downsides. And if not now, it might be an issue when it comes to job hunting. These are excruciating decisions and they are no one's to make but yours, no one should feel pressured into any one path. Lots of solidarity, as I also have to make decisions on this basis soon...

Three years of fellowship! And friends of mine on the CW end say they also have tons of research travel opportunities, grant opportunities, etc. as well (some of which are even underapplied to). It's an excellent situation. Good luck with your decision @Lblack.

So lovely MichelleObama!

Oh don't get me wrong: it was unbelievably ill advised and born of heartbreak! I mean, it was the beginning of a serious case of burnout. I'm always overambitious, but here especially, Do Not Recommend. I'm proud of how I did with Medea and the philosophy seminar, but I got an incomplete that semester that took me a whole year to finish because it I was so exhausted. Still wish I'd gotten the minor though. I totally feel you on feeling proud of your at-home translations and seeing them ripped apart. I feel like that's par for the course - there's just so much context that goes into all of these ancient languages. I also had a grammar fiend Greek prof, though thankfully in the first semesters, which was a good basis for everything else, but he'd totally shut down any attempt at embellishment or stretching the meaning of things. I don't envy translators' jobs - ideally you are a fantastic poet as well as a language boss and fully versed in the context. Makes me admire Anne Carson all the more.

Joining the classics major club: I would have triple majored if I'd gone to my undergrad with any credit whatsoever! I got to advanced level in Ancient Greek, at least, though translating the Medea during a ridiculous semester where I was dealing with a breakup by taking 18 hours (including a grad philosophy course and Logic II) and TAing at the same time broke my brain and I stopped lol. It was a wonderful experience, but I distinctly remember looking at a choral passage (where a lot has to be translated based on inference) and my teacher going, "Yeah, we still have no idea how to really translate this" and going I can't handle another semester. But I wish I had just gone through with it; I was a class away from a minor. I think because the number of classics majors tend to be so small, and the language requirements are so stringent, they tend to be some of my favorite people. Just a lot of intellectual curiosity.

Oh and also: someone on the Facebook drafts contacted USC, and acceptances are going to be rolling out... until mid-March. *deep sigh, I mean, take the time you need adcoms but... ughhhh the wait is going to suck*