U of T MA History Acceptance

[Bana81]

Hello everyone, 

I have a rather unusual question... hoping you can give some advice from your end. I have applied for my MA in History at U of T for fall 2018. Applications actually just closed less than a week ago Jan 7th, 2018.  What do you think the chances are of me getting in giving that 

• I graduated from my undergraduate studies at U of T in 2005 ( joining specialist History and Political Science) so its been 12 years since I have been in school. The past 10 years I have been working as a Communications professional - point being no links with academia and research etc since 2005. 
• My GPA is pretty damn low. 2.7 CGPA. ( U of T expects a 3.3 to get into the program) Though my history GPA is 3.1 
• I went and spoke to the Admissions Committee who said to go ahead and give it a shot but to try again for next year as well. ( not very encouraging but honest at least)
• My area of interest is South Asian History for which the Munk Centre offers a collaborative studies program. The point in brining this up is, it is a fairly new department within U of T and I think they are eager to engage students in this discipline.

So first question : Simply looking at these facts above what do you think are my chances of getting in ? Has anyone had a similar background and working with the premise that you put together a really robust thesis/research question, were you able to gain acceptance ? Or do you know if anyone who who has ? 

Now my second question. My husband has just been offered a job in Europe and we need to make a decision soon. If i got into the Masters program we would stay in Toronto but acceptances do not come in until March and we need to make a decision on the job by the beginning of Feb. Do you think it would harm me if I asked them to review my application early due to this potential move explaining to the Admissions Committee that I would actually ask my husband to refuse the job based on my application decision but I just need to know by Feb rather than mid March ? 

I realize these are really random questions and a lot is based on speculation. I have just been out of the academic circle for so long that any advice, ideas or ways of looking at this situation would be really helpful. 

[khigh]

Honestly, if I were on the adcomm and someone that wasn’t the best in the field asked for early decision like that, I would make the decision right there to reject. They may wonder what other accommodations and special treatment you would like. 

[Warelin]

From reading the page:
 

• The 3.3 gpa minimum is held by many departments. As such, it very well could be a graduate school admissions policy. The department could recommend you for admission but the graduate school might say no. As a worse case scenario,  your app might not be considered. There have been cases though that other departments have fought for an applicant and have been able to offer a conditional admission.
• Do you have 6 credits in history with a B+ average in history?
• Did you earn a "mid-B" average during your final year of your undergraduate studies?
  
  The department may or may not be willing to review your application early. It is likely to be a huge-turn off though because admission committees are mostly formed by professors. As such, they have certain times they meet to discuss applicants.

[Bana81]

18 minutes ago, khigh said:

Honestly, if I were on the adcomm and someone that wasn’t the best in the field asked for early decision like that, I would make the decision right there to reject. They may wonder what other accommodations and special treatment you would like. 

Thanks for this honest advice. This is my fear as well.. and I am glad you are also thinking the same. Thanks for your comments. Appreciate it. 

[Bana81]

15 minutes ago, Warelin said:

From reading the page:
 

• The 3.3 gpa minimum is held by many departments. As such, it very well could be a graduate school admissions policy. The department could recommend you for admission but the graduate school might say no. As a worse case scenario,  your app might not be considered. There have been cases though that other departments have fought for an applicant and have been able to offer a conditional admission.
• Do you have 6 credits in history with a B+ average in history?
• Did you earn a "mid-B" average during your final year of your undergraduate studies?
  
  The department may or may not be willing to review your application early. It is likely to be a huge-turn off though because admission committees are mostly formed by professors. As such, they have certain times they meet to discuss applicants.

I have a B- in at least 6 History Credits. and no I do not have a mid B during my final year. Which is a 2.5. 

Thanks for pointing to the fact that it may bug professors, I did not even think that for them it would be extra work to schedule in a certain time etc. 

On that note another quick question. Does anyone know what the process of the admission committee is at U of T or other Uni's ? Is there an initial screening process taken by an administration representative where applications are shortlisted in a first round of sorts ? (maybe screening on the basis of 3.3 or something like that) Because if my application doesn't even get through round 1,  then i wonder if it would still be an inconvenience to any of the professors to inquire for an early decision ? 

[dr. t]

Based on what you've given here, and without any real sort of turn-around story for an adcom to latch onto, I don't see any real likelihood of you getting in, and am somewhat puzzled by your application in the first place. I would plan on the answer being "no."

[Bana81]

I guess I’m just asking if anyone has had any experiences where your application is accepted on your research topic and  10 year of work experience in a field which requires writing , research and communications skills all of which are also needed in an MA program. My point is do ppl get into masters program on credentials other than their grades ? Or does U of T ONLY look at grades. It’s not like I have no training in historical wiring - I did complete my undergraduate specialization in history from U of T which is an extremely tough environment. I know it’s probably the case but seems kind of silly to base everything about a person and their capability based on a grade they achieved 12 years ago - so again any out of the ordinary experiences out there ? I know the traditional reaponse is a big fat NO 

[dr. t]

Most MA programs are more than willing to take your money; UoT's is no exception. And yes, that sort of long work experience is precisely what I meant by a story for the adcom to latch onto.

Let me put it this way: whether it's fair or not, your grades strongly suggest you weren't a particularly engaged or motivated undergraduate. Was your application able to make a strong case that this is no longer true? An interesting research question is nice, but it doesn't substitute for a coherent argument about why the person who was content to average a B-/C+ is not the person applying to the program.

And yeah, this sort of thing is possible. I have an MA from Harvard (and am now in a PhD program at Brown) after failing out of my first attempt at college with a friggen 0.86 and a final cumulative undergrad GPA of 3.0. But you have to tell a compelling story

Edited January 10, 2018 by telkanuru
Grammar is hard.

[khigh]

3 hours ago, telkanuru said:

Most MA programs are more than willing to take your money; UoT's is no exception. And yes, that sort of long work experience is precisely what I meant by a story for the adcom to latch onto.

Let me put it this way: whether it's fair or not, your grades strongly suggest you weren't a particularly engaged or motivated undergraduate. Was your application able to make a strong case that this is no longer true? An interesting research question is nice, but it doesn't substitute for a coherent argument about why the person who was content to average a B-/C+ is not the person applying to the program.

And yeah, this sort of thing is possible. I have an MA from Harvard (and am now in a PhD program at Brown) after failing out of my first attempt at college with a friggen 0.86 and a final cumulative undergrad GPA of 3.0. But you have to tell a compelling story

My GPA ended up being 3.457.  I was a Criminal Justice undergrad about, oh, 14 years ago.  I started all over, but my CGPA was affected by this.  I can see that if OP has something like that that it would help. 

[Guest1101]

go to Europe, find an MA program there.

[frenchlover]

Echoing what @ba1dp said. Many universities in the Netherlands offer courses in English for an MA, for instance. But Europe is too broad, and we'd need to know where. Even places that charge tuition, like the Charles University in Prague, are quite affordable imo.

[Bana81]

17 hours ago, telkanuru said:

Most MA programs are more than willing to take your money; UoT's is no exception. And yes, that sort of long work experience is precisely what I meant by a story for the adcom to latch onto.

Let me put it this way: whether it's fair or not, your grades strongly suggest you weren't a particularly engaged or motivated undergraduate. Was your application able to make a strong case that this is no longer true? An interesting research question is nice, but it doesn't substitute for a coherent argument about why the person who was content to average a B-/C+ is not the person applying to the program.

And yeah, this sort of thing is possible. I have an MA from Harvard (and am now in a PhD program at Brown) after failing out of my first attempt at college with a friggen 0.86 and a final cumulative undergrad GPA of 3.0. But you have to tell a compelling story

I did provide an explanation of why my grades were so low and why these low grades do not represent the person I am today. Additionally, U of T does not even ask for a personal statement only a statement of interest, the instructions of which clearly state to provide details on one's research topic.  I took the liberty of providing a statement of interest, which provided contextualization of my low GPA and all my achievements since then to provide a compelling story. 

Anyway, I am not keeping my hopes up. I know how low my chances are. Still, I am taking two credit course this semester in an attempt to bring up my GPA and to hopefully by scoring highly in these classes, it will exhibit my potential and capabilities.

Thanks for your comments and time. Appreciate your perspective.

[Bana81]

I was looking into that. but in Europe it seems most of the MA are in the Sciences. I will potentially be moving to Copenhagen Denmark and thats the case with the MA's there. Though maybe I will start another thread asking what the best MA Programs in History in Europe are. Thanks for this idea ! 

[dr. t]

52 minutes ago, Bana81 said:

I did provide an explanation of why my grades were so low and why these low grades do not represent the person I am today. Additionally, U of T does not even ask for a personal statement only a statement of interest, the instructions of which clearly state to provide details on one's research topic.  I took the liberty of providing a statement of interest, which provided contextualization of my low GPA and all my achievements since then to provide a compelling story. 

Anyway, I am not keeping my hopes up. I know how low my chances are. Still, I am taking two credit course this semester in an attempt to bring up my GPA and to hopefully by scoring highly in these classes, it will exhibit my potential and capabilities.

Thanks for your comments and time. Appreciate your perspective.

No problem! I'm going to add another thing here, mainly directed at those finding this thread in the future or if you decide/have to apply again after this season. After all, it's unlikely that any classwork you're currently doing will impact this application cycle.

Your second paragraph is important, and I want to emphasize it because my advice has very little to do with the SoP vel sim. After all, anyone can write about how they're turning over a new leaf; what you actually need to give is proof that you have already done so. In my own case, I had a major grade surge (0.86 to 3.8) in the final 3 years of my (9 year long) undergraduate career, and I also had to take a year of post-graduate coursework. This also gave me strong LoRs that could talk very positively about my capacity for graduate-level work. Plus, because I've talked a lot about prestige networks elsewhere, I would be remiss in not pointing out that finally getting my undergraduate degree from Harvard (albeit its night school) was also a substantial factor, both for the name and for the reputation of my recommenders. 

In short, show, don't (just) tell.