Clinical Psych Masters in the UK --> US

[RebeccaPsych]

Hi all,

 

A similar question was asked way back in 2013, but that thread is (understandably) dead at this point. Does anyone know how an MSC or MA from the UK would translate in the US? Could you, for example, get an MSC in the UK and then get licensed in the US as a counselor/social worker/something? See: https://www.qmul.ac.uk/postgraduate/taught/coursefinder/courses/121472.html as an example. 

 

OR, where would I be able to find answers to these types of questions? 

 

Thanks! 

[Psyche007]

UK national living in the US here.

You should look at the particular state you want to reside in and talk to someone at their licensing board. Each state has different requirements for licensure, which typically includes earning an approved degree, passing a licensing exam, and accruing a certain number of supervised internship/practicum hours.

When individuals with a US Master’s degree move from state to state, they sometimes have to take additional courses or have additional supervision hours to meet different requirements for licensure eligibility. From the link you posted, it’s difficult to tell if that degree is equivalent to the average US Clinical Social Worker/Mental Health Counselor Masters degree.

As an example, I live in Florida. Here’s the licensing site: https://floridasmentalhealthprofessions.gov/licensing/

Here is an education assessment sheet: https://floridasmentalhealthprofessions.gov/forms/MHC-EDU-worksheet.pdf

You might be required to pay for your degree transcripts to be assessed by a third party and submitted to the board.

Email a licensing board and they should be able to guide you.

Also, think about the type of work you want to do. Some ‘social work’, such as case management or child protection/investigation only requires a Bachelors degree. The same can be said for some substance use disorder counseling positions.

I hope this is helpful.

 

 

[RebeccaPsych]

On 4/13/2019 at 11:06 PM, GDW said:

UK national living in the US here.

You should look at the particular state you want to reside in and talk to someone at their licensing board. Each state has different requirements for licensure, which typically includes earning an approved degree, passing a licensing exam, and accruing a certain number of supervised internship/practicum hours.

When individuals with a US Master’s degree move from state to state, they sometimes have to take additional courses or have additional supervision hours to meet different requirements for licensure eligibility. From the link you posted, it’s difficult to tell if that degree is equivalent to the average US Clinical Social Worker/Mental Health Counselor Masters degree.

As an example, I live in Florida. Here’s the licensing site: https://floridasmentalhealthprofessions.gov/licensing/

Here is an education assessment sheet: https://floridasmentalhealthprofessions.gov/forms/MHC-EDU-worksheet.pdf

You might be required to pay for your degree transcripts to be assessed by a third party and submitted to the board.

Email a licensing board and they should be able to guide you.

Also, think about the type of work you want to do. Some ‘social work’, such as case management or child protection/investigation only requires a Bachelors degree. The same can be said for some substance use disorder counseling positions.

I hope this is helpful.

 

 

Thank you!! This is definitely helpful information. 

[Jaclyneb]

Oops! wrong forum.

Edited April 15, 2019 by Jaclyneb

[RebeccaPsych]

Update

 I've contacted a few licensing boards, but they've been pretty vague and unhelpful. The summary is: Get the degree and then we'll see if it works in this state. 

 

Has anyone gotten a master's abroad and used it in the US? OR not been able to use it in the US? 

[Psyche007]

I'd also consider looking at some of these resources:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/overseas-degree-equivalency-table-and-methodology

https://www2.ed.gov/about/offices/list/ous/international/usnei/us/edlite-visitus-forrecog.html

https://www.wes.org

https://www.thedegreepeople.com

https://tea.texas.gov/Texas_Educators/Certification/Out-of-State_Certification/Foreign_Credential_Evaluation_Services/

It's going to be difficult for you to make a decision based on someone else's experience. You'd have to compare your programme to theirs and then see if any of the state regulations have changed for licensure. 

It seems as though this is a request to validate a solution to an unknown problem.

What is your current situation and what are your plans? That information would be really helpful, if you're willing to disclose.

For example, if you are a UK citizen and want to emigrate to the US one day, perhaps you would be better served looking at an online US Master's degree that accepts international students (if such a programme exists). You'd have access to a full curriculum and have that parsed by a UK governing body if you wanted to practice in the UK first. Then, all you might have to do after you move is complete internships or supervision hours plus take the licensing exam. 

If you are a US citizen and like the idea of graduate studies abroad, you may be complicating things for yourself, in terms of US licensure.

Edited April 23, 2019 by Psyche007
Added clarification.

[Psyche007]

If you haven't already, ask these people, too:

http://www.cacrep.org/template/index.cfm (CACREP accredits master’s and doctoral degree programs in counseling and its specialties that are offered by colleges and universities in the United States and throughout the world.)

https://www.counseling.org

http://www.amhca.org/home

https://www.ncda.org/

http://www.iamfc.org

https://www.aamft.org

https://acesonline.net

I'm shotgunning this but sometimes you just have to ask as many different people as possible. There's bound to be a lead somewhere.

If not, you may just have to accept that the consequences of your choice may not be fully predictable. 

Edited April 23, 2019 by Psyche007
Added CACREP.

[RebeccaPsych]

On 4/23/2019 at 11:27 AM, Psyche007 said:

I'd also consider looking at some of these resources:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/overseas-degree-equivalency-table-and-methodology

https://www2.ed.gov/about/offices/list/ous/international/usnei/us/edlite-visitus-forrecog.html

https://www.wes.org

https://www.thedegreepeople.com

https://tea.texas.gov/Texas_Educators/Certification/Out-of-State_Certification/Foreign_Credential_Evaluation_Services/

It's going to be difficult for you to make a decision based on someone else's experience. You'd have to compare your programme to theirs and then see if any of the state regulations have changed for licensure. 

It seems as though this is a request to validate a solution to an unknown problem.

What is your current situation and what are your plans? That information would be really helpful, if you're willing to disclose.

For example, if you are a UK citizen and want to emigrate to the US one day, perhaps you would be better served looking at an online US Master's degree that accepts international students (if such a programme exists). You'd have access to a full curriculum and have that parsed by a UK governing body if you wanted to practice in the UK first. Then, all you might have to do after you move is complete internships or supervision hours plus take the licensing exam. 

If you are a US citizen and like the idea of graduate studies abroad, you may be complicating things for yourself, in terms of US licensure.

Thanks very much for sharing all of these resources!! 

I'm a US citizen. I'm interested in attending school in the UK, but then returning to the US. When I was in college, I spent a semester in England. I'd love to go back, but wouldn't want to go permanently because all of my family is here in the states. So, really, I'm looking for a way to incorporate England into my 10-year plan. 

Were I to go to school in the US (which is the default), I'd be applying primarily for PhDs. I'd throw a couple of Master's programs in to cover my bases and test the waters. Were I to go to the UK, I'd be more interested in Master's Degrees--again, just because I wouldn't want to be away from my family for so long. 

As far as I know, a Master's in the UK wouldn't shorten a PhD in the US, so it's not a great stepping stone--unless I want to pay a lot of money for experience. So, my thought is: Would I be able to get a short degree from the UK (1-2 years), come back to the states to use it for a couple of years (in some way or another), and then decide if I want to pursue a PhD in the US? 

A PhD in the UK has seemed more feasible. One program I've looked at is the NIH Accelerated Scholars Program: 2ish years in US and 2ish years in UK = PhD. That would be PERFECT except for the fact that it's incredibly competitive. I'm not sure if other comparable programs exist, but that's the dream. 

Another factor that could influence things: I may be getting German citizenship in the next few years. But, at this point, who knows how everything is going to play out. 

 

[Psyche007]

21 minutes ago, RebeccaPsych said:

Thanks very much for sharing all of these resources!! 

I'm a US citizen. I'm interested in attending school in the UK, but then returning to the US. When I was in college, I spent a semester in England. I'd love to go back, but wouldn't want to go permanently because all of my family is here in the states. So, really, I'm looking for a way to incorporate England into my 10-year plan. 

Were I to go to school in the US (which is the default), I'd be applying primarily for PhDs. I'd throw a couple of Master's programs in to cover my bases and test the waters. Were I to go to the UK, I'd be more interested in Master's Degrees--again, just because I wouldn't want to be away from my family for so long. 

As far as I know, a Master's in the UK wouldn't shorten a PhD in the US, so it's not a great stepping stone--unless I want to pay a lot of money for experience. So, my thought is: Would I be able to get a short degree from the UK (1-2 years), come back to the states to use it for a couple of years (in some way or another), and then decide if I want to pursue a PhD in the US? 

A PhD in the UK has seemed more feasible. One program I've looked at is the NIH Accelerated Scholars Program: 2ish years in US and 2ish years in UK = PhD. That would be PERFECT except for the fact that it's incredibly competitive. I'm not sure if other comparable programs exist, but that's the dream. 

Another factor that could influence things: I may be getting German citizenship in the next few years. But, at this point, who knows how everything is going to play out. 

 

If your goal is to earn a US PhD, in clinical psychology or counseling, perhaps a research-focused non-clinical UK Master's degree would serve you well, equipping you with both the quantitative skills and research experience necessary to make you a great candidate for a US funded clinical programme. In terms of work, unless you're dead set on working clinically, you'd have to look at fields that would utilize that eduction and experience, such as research coordinators. You might end up in a great setting that could provide you with very strong letters of recommendation. 

That accelerated programme sounds amazing! Why not make that your focus and go for it?

If that doesn't work out, it may come down to choosing a priority: experience (studying abroad) or expedience (studying in the US to efficiently obtain clinical licensure). Either option will have a financial impact.

Good luck with whatever you choose! I hope it works out in the best way possible!

[RebeccaPsych]

On 4/30/2019 at 4:42 PM, Psyche007 said:

If your goal is to earn a US PhD, in clinical psychology or counseling, perhaps a research-focused non-clinical UK Master's degree would serve you well, equipping you with both the quantitative skills and research experience necessary to make you a great candidate for a US funded clinical programme. In terms of work, unless you're dead set on working clinically, you'd have to look at fields that would utilize that eduction and experience, such as research coordinators. You might end up in a great setting that could provide you with very strong letters of recommendation. 

That accelerated programme sounds amazing! Why not make that your focus and go for it?

If that doesn't work out, it may come down to choosing a priority: experience (studying abroad) or expedience (studying in the US to efficiently obtain clinical licensure). Either option will have a financial impact.

Good luck with whatever you choose! I hope it works out in the best way possible!

A non-clinical Master's makes sense in terms of being a stepping stone for a PhD in the US. While I suppose I'm not dead set on clinical work, it is an important piece for me. But that's definitely an option to consider. Thank you for the suggestion! 

The accelerated program does sound amazing!  I'll definitely be throwing my hat in the ring, but I don't think I can get my hopes up too much. You have to get into both the program and either Oxford or Cambridge. So, it's competitive for sure. I'd love to discover other similar programs. 

Thanks very much for all your help! 

[Psyche007]

8 hours ago, RebeccaPsych said:

A non-clinical Master's makes sense in terms of being a stepping stone for a PhD in the US. While I suppose I'm not dead set on clinical work, it is an important piece for me. But that's definitely an option to consider. Thank you for the suggestion! 

The accelerated program does sound amazing!  I'll definitely be throwing my hat in the ring, but I don't think I can get my hopes up too much. You have to get into both the program and either Oxford or Cambridge. So, it's competitive for sure. I'd love to discover other similar programs. 

Thanks very much for all your help! 

You’re more than welcome, and I hope it was helpful. It can’t hurt to brainstorm and get other perspectives!

I wish you the best of luck!

[psychapplicant21]

18 hours ago, RebeccaPsych said:

A non-clinical Master's makes sense in terms of being a stepping stone for a PhD in the US. While I suppose I'm not dead set on clinical work, it is an important piece for me. But that's definitely an option to consider. Thank you for the suggestion! 

The accelerated program does sound amazing!  I'll definitely be throwing my hat in the ring, but I don't think I can get my hopes up too much. You have to get into both the program and either Oxford or Cambridge. So, it's competitive for sure. I'd love to discover other similar programs. 

Thanks very much for all your help! 

Hi Rebecca, I am a UK citizen and completed a two year research masters in the UK, this program I believe is one of the best if not the top masters programs currently available in the UK. Feel free to private message me if you would like to know more about this program I would be happy to help.

[RebeccaPsych]

On 5/8/2019 at 10:43 AM, psychapplicant21 said:

Hi Rebecca, I am a UK citizen and completed a two year research masters in the UK, this program I believe is one of the best if not the top masters programs currently available in the UK. Feel free to private message me if you would like to know more about this program I would be happy to help.

Hi, @psychapplicant21

Thank you for your offer, and sorry for the delay! I postponed my applications by a year, so here I am again. 

In addition to PhD programs in the US, I'm now looking at DClinPsy programs in the UK. Do you happen know anything about international (non-EU) students attending postgraduate programs? I'm struggling to understand the logistics a bit, because I've never had to do anything like this before (visa--definitely, BPA accreditation, etc.). Then, after whatever I work I put in, is anyone even likely to accept me if I come with the responsibility of sponsorship? I know full well that a US PhD would be the easier route, but it would be so exciting to study in the UK. 

[PsyDuck90]

2 hours ago, RebeccaPsych said:

In addition to PhD programs in the US, I'm now looking at DClinPsy programs in the UK. Do you happen know anything about international (non-EU) students attending postgraduate programs? I'm struggling to understand the logistics a bit, because I've never had to do anything like this before (visa--definitely, BPA accreditation, etc.). Then, after whatever I work I put in, is anyone even likely to accept me if I come with the responsibility of sponsorship? I know full well that a US PhD would be the easier route, but it would be so exciting to study in the UK. 

Just FYI, a DClinPsy from the UK will not be an equivalent degree to a PhD/PsyD in clinical or counseling psychology in the US. If you intend to return to the US to practice, you will more than likely not be able to be licensed as a doctoral level psychologist. There have been a few threads about this on StudentDoctorNetwork, and that has been the consistent answer. 

[psychapplicant21]

14 hours ago, RebeccaPsych said:

Hi, @psychapplicant21

Thank you for your offer, and sorry for the delay! I postponed my applications by a year, so here I am again. 

In addition to PhD programs in the US, I'm now looking at DClinPsy programs in the UK. Do you happen know anything about international (non-EU) students attending postgraduate programs? I'm struggling to understand the logistics a bit, because I've never had to do anything like this before (visa--definitely, BPA accreditation, etc.). Then, after whatever I work I put in, is anyone even likely to accept me if I come with the responsibility of sponsorship? I know full well that a US PhD would be the easier route, but it would be so exciting to study in the UK. 

You can do the DClinPsy programs in the UK as an international student but you have to self-fund and the fees are approx $35-40k per year (for 3 year training program) whilst you will get good clinical training, I think it is very difficult to get a job as a Psychologist in the UK after your training is completed. Almost all qualified trainees apply for Psych jobs in the NHS and the NHS will not hire anyone without a valid visa and it's difficult to get this after training. I'm sorry I can't be more help because I really don't know the process of working or getting a visa in the UK as a US citizen since I'm a UK citizen. My advice would be to get in touch with current trainees who are non-UK citizens and will be able to give you much better advice!

[RebeccaPsych]

@PsyDuck90 Unfortunately, I've seen that This has been something I've wanted to do, so I'm trying to view the pros/cons. If I need to get re-licensed, then that may just be an issue I tackle when it comes up. I'm also not entirely opposed to just staying in the UK (if they'll have me). 

 

@psychapplicant21 "I think it is very difficult to get a job as a Psychologist in the UK after your training is completed. Almost all qualified trainees apply for Psych jobs in the NHS and the NHS will not hire anyone without a valid visa and it's difficult to get this after training."

Yikes!! The visa issue seems to be one of the biggest stumbling blocks. People study in the UK--I'm just not sure how they do it! 

I've also seen that a large number of schools aren't accepting self-funded students. Honestly, PsyDs in the US are a good chunk of money (and longer than the ClinPsyD), so I'd be alright with a self-funded option. 

 

 

[PsyDuck90]

2 hours ago, RebeccaPsych said:

@PsyDuck90 Unfortunately, I've seen that This has been something I've wanted to do, so I'm trying to view the pros/cons. If I need to get re-licensed, then that may just be an issue I tackle when it comes up. I'm also not entirely opposed to just staying in the UK (if they'll have me).

 

It's not about being re-licensed. You would most likely have to go through another doctorate in the US in order to get licensed, or a masters to get licensed as an LPC or LCSW. 

Also, there are funded PsyDs in the US, and balanced PhD programs are typically funded as well and have the same balance of research and clinical as solid, university-based PsyDs. Just some things to consider when making your decisions.