Voicemail from DGS- Help!

[shibboleth]

I'm at work so I can't call him back, but I just go a voicemail from the DGS at one of my 'safety-ish' schools (I say "ish" because what school is really a safety these days?).

The message was very very encouraging. In fact, he says that the committee is "very impressed" with my application, and won't I please call back and have a chat about my interest in the program, etc, because they are considering nominating me for a university-wide fellowship. The departmental meeting is apparently tomorrow, and he implored me to return his call soon. He left both his office and cell #'s.

I know how these university-wide fellowships work. There is a pot of money set aside at the university level to leverage the attendance of top applicants, program by program. Almost always, each department is only allowed a set number of nominations. If those nominations fall through (ie- if the student decides not to attend), the department does not get to re-allocate precious funding to another student. So departments have a big interest in doing whatever they can to nominate people they believe will likely accept the offer - and once nominated, encouraging those people to attend. Hence the DGS's somewhat un-kosher request that he be able to (perhaps) grill me over the phone.

Here's the thing- this program is not a bad option, it's actually pretty well-ranked, but it is not my dream school. While I have not yet been accepted elsewhere, I can reasonably assume that I have a very good chance of doing so. It feels great to receive this attention, and being a top applicant to the program is certainly quite an honor. There are a few faculty there whose research interests are quite a good fit with mine. Indeed, I would like to cultivate some sort of relationship with these professors by way of future collaboration, job hunting, or just "not burning bridges."

I just don't know what to do.

If I call the DGS back, I will feel disingenuous lying about my great interest in their program. If I'm honest (ie- let on in perhaps not so many words that I'd go to a top school in a heartbeat when and if I am admitted), I'm guessing that I will likely not be awarded the fellowship. This would probably be all for the best (It could be awarded to someone who actually ends up using it), but I will have essentially sabotaged any chance that I will attend their program, or get to meet their faculty on visit day. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to be flown out, put up, wined and dined, and get the chance to network with a few very impressive faculty who may be my future colleagues. That in itself would be a positive career step. But having to call up this guy and imply that they have some chance at convincing me to attend their program would leave a seriously bad taste in my mouth.

What would you do?

[blackcoffee64]

The other students who received the same phone call may not get the same "bad taste" when inspiring false hope in the DGS.

Just a thought..

[brent09]

This is a bargaining game, and they know you face incentives to feign interest. My guess, based on absolutely nothing, is that they'll try to gauge your true interest in the program based on your answers, but won't be surprised if you choose your dream school in the end. In that situation, they will just give the fellowship to the next person on the list. (It's not like they'll lose the line if you go elsewhere.)

Fact is, you have to look out for your best interests. Without a better offer on the table, I'd think it silly to hurt the best chance you have right not. Just my take.

[Penelope Higgins]

As a faculty member in a department that has to play this game often because of lack of funding, here are my 2 cents. The DGS knows exactly what the situation is - they may lose the funding if they offer it to you and they go elsewhere, but they may decide to do it anyway. Tell him/her the truth about where else you have applied, and they will decide how to proceed. Any other talk is cheap talk and everyone knows it.

Edited to add: no need to reveal any information unless asked, or to be terribly specific about your other applications, but I would advise you not to be dishonest: tell them you are excited, but unable to commit until you hear from a range of other places.

Edited January 26, 2012 by Penelope Higgins

[kaykaykay]

Most schools know where they stand in the competition with the top schools. Also they know that you must have applied to other schools too.The schools play this game every year the professors will not hold it against you if you chose another school all you have to promise is serious consideration, and you should actually give them a serious consideration.

Some things to consider now: 1. you may not get other offers (I hope you do) 2. you may visit and like it if you only have similar offers or even offers from better schools if they dissapoint (not unheard of) 3. it will give you a peace of mind when you have to deal with the top schools.

[balthasar]

As a faculty member in a department that has to play this game often because of lack of funding, here are my 2 cents. The DGS knows exactly what the situation is - they may lose the funding if they offer it to you and they go elsewhere, but they may decide to do it anyway. Tell him/her the truth about where else you have applied, and they will decide how to proceed. Any other talk is cheap talk and everyone knows it.

Edited to add: no need to reveal any information unless asked, or to be terribly specific about your other applications, but I would advise you not to be dishonest: tell them you are excited, but unable to commit until you hear from a range of other places.

Dr. Higgins (well obviously this is not your name, but it sounds appropriate), it is a bit early to ask, but I would like to hear what advice you might have about negotiating funding packages.

[Penelope Higgins]

To be honest I don't have much insight on negotiating funding: I've never been involved on either side of the process. More to the point, the range of flexibility that a DGS has varies widely. Most top schools offer fairly similar and fairly standard packages to all admits but there may be wiggle room in some cases. I don't have any more specific thoughts than that. But I will say that there are a lot of factors in addition to funding that you should consider in choosing a grad program. And if it does come down to comparing packages, which it almost never should, there are a lot of dimensions on which packages can be compared, including not only amounts per year and number of years, but the nature of teaching, the existence of summer funding even if not guaranteed up front, etc. You can learn a lot by talking to current students when you visit departments. So things get complicated very quickly.

[balthasar]

Point taken. Thank you very much

[shibboleth]

The DGS knows exactly what the situation is - they may lose the funding if they offer it to you and they go elsewhere, but they may decide to do it anyway.

Penelope- This makes perfect sense. I'm wondering, in a general sense, why they bother to try to suss me out anyway? I don't really get the game. A definite answer from a prospective fellowship winner this early in the process is hardly likely, no matter who they are. I suppose the DGS might think there is some chance that I might give an unequivocal "No Thanks" (but, then, why would I have bothered to apply at all?). There is also the chance that someone in my situation could say "Absolutely, I commit to you! I will withdraw all my other applications!" - but really how big is that chance actually likely to be? If someone has stats stellar enough to be considered for your top fellowship, they're most certainly the kind of candidate who is going to be applying to multiple schools, and also likely to have the luxury of choosing a program based on multiple criteria. So the DGS probably assumes that there's a 95% chance I'll lie somewhere between these two extremes. Which I do. And, absent having my other offers on the table, I have no way of knowing how likely it actually is that I will attend their program. So what will they really gain from the conversation?

Most schools know where they stand in the competition with the top schools. Also they know that you must have applied to other schools too.The schools play this game every year the professors will not hold it against you if you chose another school all you have to promise is serious consideration, and you should actually give them a serious consideration.

The department in question is a great department, and I suppose it is possible that (for whatever reason) I will choose it in the end. Do any past applicants or adcomm participants have a sense as to the factors that are likely to contribute to them awarding me this fellowship even if I am noncommittal in my response to the DGS? If someone's application is seen as far exceeding the strength of the rest of the typical cohort, will that be seen as a red flag that the student most likely will not choose to attend, resulting in denial of the fellowship? Or is the converse true? (ostensably the purpose of the fellowship- that it be granted to the top applicants regardless of perceived propensity to attend).

I oscillate between:

A- being a little peeved that I am being evaluated not only on the strength of my application, but the strength of my percieved desire to attend. I assume when I return the call from the DGS, I will be asked point-blank which other schools I'm considering.

B- feeling badly that, on the big assumption that application season goes as planned, I will most likely decline the fellowship, and thus deprive this particular department of funding.

[Penelope Higgins]

I've only been on your end of this conversation, so I can't speak to what the DGS might be thinking. I was offered a couple of these when I sent out applications, and the phone call was simply to tell me that I had been nominated, they were excited about my application, and they would let me know how things progressed. I ended up turning both of them down.

Most likely they are calling not to evaluate your "perceived desire to attend" since as you point out, there is no way for them to get that information, but to start recruiting you since they can be fairly confident that you will be funded if they choose to nominate you. If you already had an offer that would trump theirs, that is useful information for them. If you tell them that you have not applied anywhere that would trump their offer, that is also useful for them. Beyond that, this is just a friendly conversation and a bit of recruitment - you need to get used to having those conversations over the next few months.

And in terms of hurting the department by declining a university fellowship, nobody is going to take it personally or hold it against you. And even if they can't roll down the list to another candidate in political science, the fellowship will roll down at the university level - it isn't like the money vanishes if you turn it down. Finally, the last thing you should be worried about in this situation is how the department or the DGS feels. Do what is best for you. This isn't license to be a jerk, but to be a bit selfish in this process is A-OK.

[grantman]

I agree with Dr. Higgins.

I feel if you sound disingenuous towards the director, he/she will see right through it. If you are open and honest with them, your conversation will become all the more fruitful and should you decide to attend this university in question you will be on a much better footing that by lying right from the get go. They understand that you have more than likely applied to other schools and they will understand that you wish to hear back from all the schools you have applied to, remember these professors went through this process themselves.

While I completely understand you would be nervous at this juncture, trust me I would be as well, just be yourself and remember my personal motto "Keep Calm and Carry On."

Best of luck to you in your future endavors.

[bodywithoutorgans]

Why are you overthinking this so intensely? Just have a genuine conversation with the DGS. It seems pretty obvious that you would not accept unequivocally almost any offer at this point in the process, and I'm sure they're aware of that. Congratulations on your accomplishment.

[rising_star]

OP, I was in your shoes more than once. My experience was like Penelope's in that they were calling to tell me about the nomination, to ask if I wanted to visit, and to put me in contact with others. In one case, they also pointed out that they were missing materials (a rec letter!) that they needed to send in with the nomination and asked me to have it sent ASAP. No one is expecting you to commit to a school without visiting. But, if you can't commit to giving the school a fair shake, then you should decline the fellowship nomination gracefully and probably withdraw your application altogether. No one wants to waste their time and money recruiting someone that has no intentions whatsoever of attending. If you want to go just to meet future colleagues, go to a conference, rather than wasting their valuable recruitment time and money.*

That said, I want to point out that a lot of things can happen when you start visiting, talking to current students, and talking to profs in more detail. The program that was your #1 can quickly plummet and your previous safety school(s) can rise to the top. The program that was my #1 choice when I applied to PhD programs is not the one I ended up attending, even though I got into both programs with excellent funding. It came down to personality, the other students, and various other factors.

balthasar, in addition to the excellent list of things Penelope gave to consider, I'd point out a few more. Conference funding (availability, how much), pre-dissertation fieldwork money (if that's something you'll need), language training funds (again, if you'll need it). Then there's the whole topic of tuition, fees, and benefits (ie, health insurance). To accurately compare packages, you need to know not only the cost of living, but also what's covered and what isn't. For example, is tuition $0, $25, or $1000 a semester? Are there any fees you have to pay on top of tuition and, if so, how much are these? (Example: We pay about $225/semester in fees at my PhD university. At my MA university, I was paying ~$600/semester. While I technically earn less money now, it comes out about the same because of the difference in fees and having health insurance for free, rather than having to contribute $75/month towards it.)

-------------

*Note: My PhD department explicitly chooses NOT to use the funds at its disposable for recruitment because of too many experiences where students visited and basically said they came for the weather and weren't really interested (hey, I'll admit we aren't top 10 but we also aren't chopped liver). Instead, we use that money to provide travel funds for conferences to the grad students. At least at our university, it's the same pool of money.