MA vs PhD

[Kitkat]

Is there a major difference between what you can do with a MA vs a PhD? Is an MA in a geosciences or environmental field any use other then another method to get a PhD?

I am sure that this is also dependent on the field/ career that you want to go into. I hear that when you want to go work for an oil company or something like that you are better off just going for a masters (but at the same time I have seen PhD's working for them as well ... ). Academia of course it is almost always better to get a PhD.

I guess what I am wonder is if it is looked down on if you get an MA first and then a PhD, if you eventually want to end up in academia?

[NoNO]

This is something i am struggling with to... I've been offered a funded MS with a dept that really fits me well.

[Kitkat]

That's the thing. I was advised by one of my letter writers(old school) to apply to more MA's to give myself more options later for PhD's, so that I don't get too specific too soon. At the same time, he is an older prof and says so, and that a lot of stuff is much more focused these days. He would like to see more general acknowledge of all info, as well as specific knowledge, which he thinks a lot of programs seem to ignore these days. I can see his point, but I don't want to loose out on a job in the future if I want to go into academia due to a lack of focus in topic (which is where my current PI(new school) is academically).

[parable151]

I looked at a lot of CV's of different profs when I was looking at where to apply and even at Stanford and Berkeley there are profs there that did the MS first and then the PhD. I really think it is what you make of it. In the end, I believe you will be judged on the merits of your research.

[Kitkat]

A lot of the people as undergrad's also fear being 'over-educated' as far as say jobs for working for oil companies. Does anyone know how that works? (I personally am looking for academia so it is good to hear that for the most part either/or in the long run might not be a problem) but if you want to work in a more practical field, how does it work?

[Marshall]

There are quite a few people in my department (all master's students) who are here purely because they'll be more marketable. They have no intention on going on to get a Ph.D. I don't think you'll be over educated. I do know that in both environmental and the industry (from what I've seen personally) they prefer those with at least a master's. there are 3 of us finishing up our master's and going on to Ph.D's.

I thought it more common (maybe just with paleo?) to not go straight from undergrad into a Ph.D program in the geosciences. That's how it is in my department and with the top paleo schools, they prefer students who already have masters. I don't think it's looked down upon at all. There's a huge mixture of professors here who did a master's first and then a Ph.D and of those who went straight into a Ph.D program. I

also, all 3 of us who are going on to Ph.D programs intend to go into academia.. so idk if that means anything, lol. it's common.

[Kitkat]

Now you are making me concerned. I am looking at paleo, but I was getting the impression that with paleo that it was better to go straight for the PhD with paleo, especially since there is not much you cannot due with much in paleo with just a masters in the field. I mean, don't get me wrong, I applied to a few MA programs as well, but did I just cripple myself in comparison to my compeition by applying to straight PhD programs?

edit: I mean is it just the best of the beat of the undergrads who can go straight to a PhD or is it more like a 50/50 kind of a thing?

Edited February 24, 2012 by Kitkat

[Marshall]

I don't think you crippled yourself at all. I prefer having had the opportunity because it allowed me to find out exactly what I wanted to do in paleo. It really just depends on the department as to whether or not they prefer to accept students with master's.

What do you want to do? academia? no, you definitely cannot do anything with a master's. Industry? Yeah, you can make a decent penny with just a masters in paleo. What specifically are you looking at doing?

[Kitkat]

The long run is to go to academia, but one can argue that with most academic positions you are going to need a PhD. But I didn't know that there was much to offer job wise for people with an interest in paleo if they just had a MA.

[NoNO]

The long run is to go to academia, but one can argue that with most academic positions you are going to need a PhD. But I didn't know that there was much to offer job wise for people with an interest in paleo if they just had a MA.

there is a difference between MA and MSc though Kitkat. Usually MSc is research/thesis based... while MA is very much class heavy. i would be weary of getting an MA over an MSc unless its thesis based

[sansao]

there is a difference between MA and MSc though Kitkat. Usually MSc is research/thesis based... while MA is very much class heavy. i would be weary of getting an MA over an MSc unless its thesis based

Some schools only offer the MA and no MSc, if they let you apply to a free-standing master's program at all. Its's often a benchmark within the PhD program, and they may or may not award the actual master's degree, often as a master's in passing, at the same time as the PhD. In this case, the only ways to get just an MS or MSc (or sometimes the MA too) is to either fail quals and end up in a terminal master's program (strictly a result of the qualifying exam score), withdraw from the PhD program after completing the master's level work, or complete the PhD and take both degrees at graduation.

On a side note, I am absolutely terrified of quals.

[Marshall]

I didn't realize anywhere offered MAs in geosciences. Shows what little I know.. or at least how small the group of schools I've looked at/applied to in the past 3 years. LOL. 2 of the schools I'm applying to now for my Ph.D are 2 of the schools I applied to for my master's.

[hope4fall2012]

For what its worth, I applied to PhD programs after going through a 2 year Masters program.. One of the biggest ways in which it helped me was by helping me form a definitive research interest. I don't really know whether it'll be something that I'll work on for my PhD research, but I think looking at a particular area and analyzing the current open problems in that area definitely helps..

Of course, you don't really need a Masters to do this, but my undergrad was in Electrical Engineering and I was applying for programs in atmospheric science.. So it helped me a ton to first get my Masters

[LCBucky]

@hope4fall2012: Thanks for the input. That was my thinking....I applied to 3 Masters programs and 1 PhD. Got rejected from the PhD program so its looking like i'll be getting my masters first. But I almost would rather do that so I can nail down exactly what I am interested in researching before dedicating 4-5 years of my life to an "eh sure that sounds interesting" research topic.

[sansao]

@hope4fall2012: Thanks for the input. That was my thinking....I applied to 3 Masters programs and 1 PhD. Got rejected from the PhD program so its looking like i'll be getting my masters first. But I almost would rather do that so I can nail down exactly what I am interested in researching before dedicating 4-5 years of my life to an "eh sure that sounds interesting" research topic.

I guess I probably should have applied to a couple masters programs too, but a couple of my profs advised against it due to a lower "return on investments" for the POIs. I've narrowed down what I want to do pretty clearly, not necessarily to the point of a thesis proposal, although after a year of research, I could probably put a solid one together. I have this crazy idea about using hidden Markov models too, but that's for a post-acceptance debate.

[LCBucky]

I guess I probably should have applied to a couple masters programs too, but a couple of my profs advised against it due to a lower "return on investments" for the POIs. I've narrowed down what I want to do pretty clearly, not necessarily to the point of a thesis proposal, although after a year of research, I could probably put a solid one together. I have this crazy idea about using hidden Markov models too, but that's for a post-acceptance debate.

Haha I hear you. I think if I could go back in time, I'd throw in a couple more PhD programs. The thought of going bachelors degree straight to PhD didn't cross my mind until the very end.

I also have this problem of being quite a nomad, so the thought of living in one place for 5 years is a little unsettling (at least right now). I've never lived somewhere for that long before.

[sansao]

I also have this problem of being quite a nomad, so the thought of living in one place for 5 years is a little unsettling (at least right now). I've never lived somewhere for that long before.

I've lived in Arizona my entire life. I never did acclimate to the Summers here (or for that matter, the Sun in general). The idea of 5-6 years elsewhere, and preferably further North, is incredibly appealing. Especially now that it's the end of February and we could be looking at 90 degrees soon.

[LCBucky]

I've lived in Arizona my entire life. I never did acclimate to the Summers here (or for that matter, the Sun in general). The idea of 5-6 years elsewhere, and preferably further North, is incredibly appealing. Especially now that it's the end of February and we could be looking at 90 degrees soon.

Ahh I hear you. Very understandable. I'm living in South Carolina and we didn't have a winter this year. The humidity is killing me....i'm hoping I end up going to school somewhere much much colder...to the North it is!

[hope4fall2012]

I live 13 degrees north of the equator.. Any place I move to in the US would most probably be too cold.. .. Except maybe Texas or Florida or California..

I hope Im not going to regret moving to the east coast!!!

[LCBucky]

I live 13 degrees north of the equator.. Any place I move to in the US would most probably be too cold.. .. Except maybe Texas or Florida or California..

I hope Im not going to regret moving to the east coast!!!

You're going to love the east coast I promise! Have you decided on a school?

[hope4fall2012]

Its probably going to be Yale I think..

I've never even come close to seeing snow in my life!!!!

PS: Apologies to the original poster for digressing this far from the orginal topic..

Edited February 29, 2012 by hope4fall2012

[Kitkat]

Its probably going to be Yale I think..

I've never even come close to seeing snow in my life!!!!

PS: Apologies to the original poster for digressing this far from the orginal topic..

That what happens this time of year.

Snow is fun, and it should be nice at least for a little while if you go to Yale. Here in NYC it gets dirty real quick. But then agian, there hasn't been that much snow this year.

[hope4fall2012]

But then agian, there hasn't been that much snow this year.

Yeah, wierd isn't it.. Europe and parts of Asia have had colder than usual winters..

[XXF]

I live 13 degrees north of the equator.. Any place I move to in the US would most probably be too cold.. .. Except maybe Texas or Florida or California..

I hope Im not going to regret moving to the east coast!!!

As a life long East Coaster IT IS IMPOSSIBLE TO REGRET MOVING TO THE EAST COAST!!!!!!!

I am having trouble considering leaving it even if I get into a better school elsewhere.

[hope4fall2012]

Really?? That's good to hear

What's most appealing about it from your point of view?? I have to convince another person that the east coast is not so bad after all, what with the snow and everything..