Chances Biostatistics MS with low GRE

[statsgirl8]

I am a rising senior statistics major at a small state school in NJ, and am interested in getting my MS/Phd in statistics or biostatistics. I am extremely worried about my admissions chances, and if my GRE scores are too low. I am not the best standardized test taker and ended up discovering my profound passion for statistics my sophomore year. My GPA is primarily driven down by pre-med chemistry and physics classes I took in my freshmen year. All my math and stat classes are A's and B's. I would really like to apply to Rutgers, UMDNJ (Biostat) , Columbia School of Public Health (Biostat), Yale School of Public , Montclair, Lehigh, SUNY Stony Brook, and UPitt.

Being from NJ, my first choice would be the ms or phd in statistics from Rutgers University or UMDNJ due to proximity to my home. Do I have any chance of getting into the Rutgers MS statistics program with a concentration in biostatistics with my grades and scores? Thank you very much for your time

GPA: 3.464

GRE: 1200 total Q: 155 (69%) on the old scale this is a 710

V: 155 (56%) 490

AW: 5.5 (96%)

SIBS Program Experience

Shadowed Biostatistician in Industry

Expecting Excellent Reference Letters

ECs: Math Club 4 years

Alpha Phi Omega: Service Fraternity 6 semester member upon graduation. I held the executive board position of secretary for my junior year. I have dedicated hundreds of hours over the past three years to community service and chapter fundraising as well.

[ANDS!]

What is your math background?

Those are some pretty good programs; GRE might be a problem. How good are your LOR?

[statsgirl8]

I have taken calculus 1-3, discrete mathematics, linear algebra, statistical inference, probability theory, regression analysis, applied multivariate analysis, design of experiments, and mathematical statistics. During my senior year I plan to take data mining, non-parametric stat, and operations research as well as computer programming to boost my resume.

[statsgirl8]

I am mostly aiming to get into Rutgers or UMDNJ and am trying to determine if it is worth retaking the GRE or not. I know my GPA is mediocre at best. Do you have any recommendations of schools I could have a chance getting into?

[ANDS!]

BioStats has a low barrier of entry (of course the higher you go the more difficult it becomes - ie cross Johns Hopkins off). Public Health even lower especially having a good math background. I know nothing about the competitiveness of Rutgers. Is there any reason you're setting the bar so local?

[statsgirl8]

I am in the beginning stages of deciding where I want to apply. I have never been far away from home so I would prefer to be near myrelatives, but I wouldn't mind going 1-5 hours away for school if I have to. I am not aiming for Hopkins because I know it is far out of my league. I am wondering if there are any public health biostat programs that I could get into given my gre score? I want to retake it, but I took a class and prepped last summer only to do get a 1200. I don't know if I will be able to much better if I retook it. Thank you for all your help!

Edited June 14, 2012 by statsgirl8

[cyberwulf]

While a Q155 isn't great, I don't think it's disastrously bad, particularly if you're looking for an MS at a local place like Rutgers/UMDNJ. You might consider calling the departments you're interested in to see if they'll tell you what the mean/median GPAs and GREs of entering students are; this should give you a good idea of how high you can aim.

[Hanyuye]

I got a 158 in Q for my GRE, EVERY one of the grad advisors that I applied to told me the same thing, your QUANT is too low, retake it and hope at least for a 164. You're GPA is fine but if you can get A's in the rest of your courses, you'll finish strong and make an impact.

[statsgirl8]

Okay, thank you very much for your input! I truly appreciate it.

[ongtz]

There are a lot of differing opinions on the benchmark for GRE scores (definitely higher if you're talking about top notch institutes). But there's one thing statistics is really looking at: mathematics. A lot of professors are seeking for students who are able to understand the mathematical and theoretical reasoning behind the statistical methodologies. In the undergraduate level, we just take the methodologies right on the surface (touch-and-go kinda thing), whereas graduate level goes really in-depth with theories.

It may be true that some schools look more into your curriculum vitae than the GRE to assess your preparedness for the MS/PhD discipline. Your GRE scores are actually good to me. I am very bad at standardized test taking. I remember blanking out and ended up flunked badly in it (V 146 Q 160 A 4.0) (Being an international student is a bit tough at times). I feel the nausea thinking the 4 hour gruesome experience again. I believe what really saved me is the double major in mathematics and statistics.

I know I am not a great person in giving opinions but think of it; standardized test (standard already tells all) VS curriculum vitae. Which one would you think can be more unique? Retaking GRE or taking an assortment of related courses? That's your call.

If you are looking at courses; I strongly suggest REAL ANALYSIS (very fundamental and tend to be left out by a lot of statistics majors) and operations research. Courses that might be helpful too: abstract algebra; complex analysis

Hope that helps. By all means I am not an expert. I am still learning and will be moving to Chicago in fall for my MSc

[Shostakovich]

Might be slightly off topic here but for those of you guys that have taken the GREs, how different were your scores on the real ones compared to the practice exams?

I'd imagine math would be the most important indicator of judgment for Biostatistics admissions as far as GRE scores go, but I've been doing some research and in some Biostats programs located in the department of public health or school of medicine the avg verbal GREs seem to be pretty high also (but maybe not as high in quant). As a marker, Harvard which is consistently ranked in the top 5 released something like a 740Q/620V/4.5AW as the median score for 2011. For the 1-year accelerated pre-doctoral MS program at Columbia they recommend a 700+ in quant and 600+ in verbal for successful applicants. I guess those are stats from top programs so those avg scores will tend to drop as programs become less prestigious. But just a speculation, wish I knew...

[cyberwulf]

The scores you're quoting for Harvard have got to be for the MS program; I'd be very surprised if the median GRE Q for PhD admission at Harvard biostat is not 800.

Here's the deal on the GRE components, at least from one faculty member's (i.e. my) perspective:

- To be considered for most top departments, you're going to need a GRE Q better than 750 (roughly 158ish in the new system). Many people applying to good PhD programs will have GRE Q scores of 800 (> 167 in new scoring). You can't really help yourself that much with your GRE Q score, but a mediocre score can hurt your chances.

- The Verbal score doesn't matter very much. Many foreign students whose first language is not English score much better than U.S. students, so clearly it's possible to "study up" the material and perform well. That being said, a truly excellent verbal score (eg. one in the 95th+ percentile) may work in your favor as an indicator of general intelligence. Mediocre verbal scores are commonplace among biostat applicants (even at the best programs), so unless your scores are truly disastrous (think 30th percentile or below) I wouldn't worry about it.

- The Analytical Writing score has virtually no variability among typical applicants; almost everyone scores in the 3.5-4.5 range. Hence, it's essentially ignored. A 6.0 could help you stand out a bit, but not much.

[wine in coffee cups]

I'd imagine math would be the most important indicator of judgment for Biostatistics admissions as far as GRE scores go, but I've been doing some research and in some Biostats programs located in the department of public health or school of medicine the avg verbal GREs seem to be pretty high also (but maybe not as high in quant). As a marker, Harvard which is consistently ranked in the top 5 released something like a 740Q/620V/4.5AW as the median score for 2011. For the 1-year accelerated pre-doctoral MS program at Columbia they recommend a 700+ in quant and 600+ in verbal for successful applicants. I guess those are stats from top programs so those avg scores will tend to drop as programs become less prestigious. But just a speculation, wish I knew...

Here are some GRE averages for biostats programs that might help you ballpark, though these combine master's and PhD and are among the top programs so not a ton of added information:

• University of Minnesota, biostatistics, admitted students: 575V, 779Q, 3.8W, some more distributional info at the link
  
• University of North Carolina, biostatistics, admitted students: 580V, 780Q
  
• University of Washington, biostatistics (PDF): matriculated students 618V, 793Q; other accepted students 621V, 794Q; denied students 544V, 771Q
  
• UC Berkeley, biostatistics, admitted students: M.A. 680V, 790Q; PhD 620V, 790Q
  

[Shostakovich]

Here are some GRE averages for biostats programs that might help you ballpark, though these combine master's and PhD and are among the top programs so not a ton of added information:

• University of Minnesota, biostatistics, admitted students: 575V, 779Q, 3.8W, some more distributional info at the link
  
• University of North Carolina, biostatistics, admitted students: 580V, 780Q
  
• University of Washington, biostatistics (PDF): matriculated students 618V, 793Q; other accepted students 621V, 794Q; denied students 544V, 771Q
  
• UC Berkeley, biostatistics, admitted students: M.A. 680V, 790Q; PhD 620V, 790Q
  

ah thanks, makes a lot of sense. the stats i ran across for harvard may have been for their overall public health department which would include a lot of non-quantitative programs.