Learning languages

[Macrina]

How did you learn the requisite languages for your intended studies?

Classes?

Summer intensives?

Independent study?

What would you recommend for someone who 1) needs to improve their Greek and Latin and 2) should somehow get a paper trail for this?

I'm thinking of working on Greek independently over the next 10 months, then taking a course that requires intermediate level skills in the fall of 2014, and doing the Latin as a summer intensive. Is this enough? Should I do both a Greek and a Latin course (intermediate level) next fall?

[AbrasaxEos]

Begin by thinking carefully about what it is exactly you want to study, and the languages in which your primary sources are primarily going to be in, as well as the general geographical region that you are interested in (if applicable).  Then make some sort of list of the possible languages that you might need to know, it is ok if this list is long or seems really imposing.  Consider which of these languages are going to be crucial to your study, which it sounds as if you have already done regarding Greek and Latin.  Obviously these are going to be big ones for anyone looking to study in the area that you are. 

 

Have you done any Greek yet, or would you be starting from nothing in these next 10 months?  Trying to teach yourself Greek with no prior knowledge of the language can be quite difficult, though not impossible.  I just think it would take very serious commitment on your part, which can be hard to maintain while in school.  If you do decide to do it I would skip starting with "New Testament Greek" and go straight for Hansen and Quinn or some other type of Attic text.  They will be far more rigorous, but they will prepare you to read later, "Atticizing" authors like Eusebius far better than piddling through 1 John for 7 months will.  I think that you probably need, at minimum, some kind of demonstrable intermediate-level proficiency in these two languages (i.e. a "paper trail") when applying for PhD programs.  For best results? I would say advanced in one, intermediate in another, and one modern (reading-level).  This isn't possible for everyone though.

 

A short discourse on philology and the field in general, from my perspective.  You need to be able to work in some primary source languages, and work well in them.  However, it really depends on the kind of work you intend to do and the program in which you intend to do it.  Some programs put huge emphasis on lots of languages.  One thing to remember though, is that when you are going for a job, unless it is at a major research university, you will only be using your 10 languages you spent lots of time learning during your PhD program for your own research, and probably not all of them.  No one at East Jesus University will take your class on Old Church Slavonic, or even Coptic.  They probably won't even know if it was a language or math course that Visiting Assistant Lecturer X is offering.  It will never be offered.  You will however have to lecture to 275 partially interested undergrads about "Religions of the West," so if you spent your two years of PhD coursework taking classical Armenian so you could read a late recension of 4 Ezra, and then taught NT Greek for your TA/F years - it might be hard to convince a hiring committee made up of an English prof, a Sociologist, Anthropologist, and maybe one Religious Studies person who studies Central Asian shamanism that you can actually do this successfully.

[Macrina]

Thank you, AbrasaxEos.

I have an MDiv, but it's a few years old, and I did a short summer course of Greek, not for credit. I have one modern language at a high level of proficiency, and I've worked on Latin off and on for a few years.

I'm currently enrolled in a second masters program and I don't want to waste my classes on basic language credits - I would prefer to get myself up to a more advanced level, possibly with summer intensives, and then do courses that demonstrate proficiency and allow me to learn about a topic or area.

I've started working for just 20 minutes a day on the Greek, and might add in Latin as well once I get through my current essay/writing overload.

I *think* this allows me to learn the languages and demonstrate proficiency in them, with a paper trail of credits and grades to support future applications.

If anyone has any suggestions, either about the process of learning a language, or about my plans for how to demonstrate proficiency, I'd be glad to hear them.

[sacklunch]

What kinds of programs are you applying to? As Abrasax said, it really depends on what you want to do and thus the programs will have varying requirements. Some programs require a lot more language background, others do not. Some schools might not care that you have no Hebrew and study NT, for example, others may prefer applicants to have some (or Aramaic/Syriac).

 

When I did my MTS I had a friend who already had her MDiv from Emory and was basically doing another two years so she could get a really good foundation in some of the languages required for her subfield (NT). She ended up taking some advanced seminars, of course, but she also spent a lot of time (maybe half her classes) on continuing Greek and starting Hebrew. It might feel like you are starting all over again by taking Hebrew 101, but again, depending on the types of programs you are applying to, they might preference the solid paper trail of language classes. That said, if you do go back and take Greek, I would suggest brushing up over the first year of Attic and then enrolling in an intermediate Attic year long course. From my experience, the Koine classes at most seminaries are not terribly rigorous (again, my limited experience) and truly do not prepare students to read much of anything outside the NT.

 

cheers

[Kuriakos]

If you are going to self-teach Greek, I'd recommend Athenaze to you. 

[newenglandshawn]

So another question along those lines: how does knowing Biblical Hebrew correlate to doing Rabbinic/Talmudic Hebrew?

[sacklunch]

Do you mean how would a background in biblical Hebrew carry over to Rabbinic? In short, a lot, I think. I started with biblical Hebrew and after my first two years (1 yr intro/1 yr inter) I started taking Aramaic and Rabbinic. The big difference is the verbal prefixes/suffixes and later some new constructions (vis-a-vis BH, e.g. participle plus hwa, and so on). Words take on new meanings, some strikingly different. But overall, if you had a solid philological approach to BH, I think the transition isn't terrible. FWIW, I have since moved to Syriac in the last 1.5 yrs and found it to be comparable, too (of course, it is still Aramaic!). 

[newenglandshawn]

Do you mean how would a background in biblical Hebrew carry over to Rabbinic? In short, a lot, I think. I started with biblical Hebrew and after my first two years (1 yr intro/1 yr inter) I started taking Aramaic and Rabbinic. 

 

Thanks! This is helpful. It's exactly what I was asking.

[cadences]

Hi All,

I'm reviving this thread because I don't want to start a new one for my question (also about languages).

I am starting an education master's soon, in which I will have about 15-18 credits of electives. I'm planning to apply to programs in Patristics after, and an (Early Christianity) professor advised me to spend my electives on Greek and Latin courses in the university's classics department because I lack formal language courses. His rationale was: 'We prefer for students to arrive with advanced language preparation so that they can take courses from the beginning [of the program] that presuppose knowledge of the languages.'

My question, then, is: if I have already taught myself a language to an intermediate level, will a single third-year course be sufficient to produce paper proof of 'advanced language preparation'? I'm asking not because I want to be lazy about this, but if I can free one more elective to take, say, Intermediate Syriac instead of another third-year Greek course, wouldn't that be better?

Thanks, all! Hope to glean some wisdom from y'alls on this, haha.

-- cadences