Rejection thread

[wildc4t]

The Texas rejection is mine.

[stressedout]

The Texas rejection is mine.

 

What's up with this trickling Texas rejection shite?

[wandajune]

Still waiting on a Riverside rejection. My name is toward the middle-end of the alphabet, are they coming out in alphabetical sets possibly? 

[dgswaim]

The Texas rejection is mine.

Expecting mine any day now.

[Edit_Undo]

An Ohio State University rejection via website.

[SamStone]

Still waiting on a Riverside rejection. My name is toward the middle-end of the alphabet, are they coming out in alphabetical sets possibly? 

I just got one just now, and my name is at the very beginning of the alphabet, so i don't think that's their order...who knows!?

[philosophe]

I don't really know where to put this, but CUNY just sent me an email inviting me to their M.A. program in Liberal Studies. Somewhat personalized email, surprisingly.

Very strange, and I have no interest in it (in at great PhDs), but I'm wondering if they are just sending this out to all of their rejected applicants.

 

I got this too. It would be one thing if they just admitted us to a different MA program, but there's no way in hell i'd start a new application in March. 

[philstudent1991]

Did they email Texas rejections or did you check site?

[wildc4t]

Did they email Texas rejections or did you check site?

I emailed someone in the dept. My status wasn't updated.

[TheVineyard]

Everyone's still waiting to hear rejections/waitlists from UCLA right?

[logos0516]

OK, so as you may know I am in the Master's program in philosophy at CUNY. I applied to the Phd program at the same school--and was rejected. I was talking to one of my recommenders, call him John, and he said that one of my other recommenders, call him Peter, was very powerful and influential in the department. John said that basically what Peter wants, Peter gets. He said I should talk to Peter and tell him my situation, and that despite already being in the program and getting all A grades, and despite having recommendations all from professors in the department, I got rejected, and that nobody will even talk to me to tell my why I was rejected. He said to ask Peter point-blank if he would be willing to talk to the chairman of the department, who makes the final admissions decisions, and tell him to reconsider my application. John said that if Peter agrees to do this, I will be admitted. John said Peter may agree to do it, or may not, even though it wouldn't cost him anything to do it, and given he knows me and likes me well enough to have written a recommendation for me. What do you think the chances are that Peter will agree to talk to the chairman for me and get me admitted? 

[Establishment]

OK, so as you may know I am in the Master's program in philosophy at CUNY. I applied to the Phd program at the same school--and was rejected. I was talking to one of my recommenders, call him John, and he said that one of my other recommenders, call him Peter, was very powerful and influential in the department. John said that basically what Peter wants, Peter gets. He said I should talk to Peter and tell him my situation, and that despite already being in the program and getting all A grades, and despite having recommendations all from professors in the department, I got rejected, and that nobody will even talk to me to tell my why I was rejected. He said to ask Peter point-blank if he would be willing to talk to the chairman of the department, who makes the final admissions decisions, and tell him to reconsider my application. John said that if Peter agrees to do this, I will be admitted. John said Peter may agree to do it, or may not, even though it wouldn't cost him anything to do it, and given he knows me and likes me well enough to have written a recommendation for me. What do you think the chances are that Peter will agree to talk to the chairman for me and get me admitted? 

Better than the chances where you don't ask Peter? There is literally nothing else to speculate on.

[wandajune]

OK, so as you may know I am in the Master's program in philosophy at CUNY. I applied to the Phd program at the same school--and was rejected. I was talking to one of my recommenders, call him John, and he said that one of my other recommenders, call him Peter, was very powerful and influential in the department. John said that basically what Peter wants, Peter gets. He said I should talk to Peter and tell him my situation, and that despite already being in the program and getting all A grades, and despite having recommendations all from professors in the department, I got rejected, and that nobody will even talk to me to tell my why I was rejected. He said to ask Peter point-blank if he would be willing to talk to the chairman of the department, who makes the final admissions decisions, and tell him to reconsider my application. John said that if Peter agrees to do this, I will be admitted. John said Peter may agree to do it, or may not, even though it wouldn't cost him anything to do it, and given he knows me and likes me well enough to have written a recommendation for me. What do you think the chances are that Peter will agree to talk to the chairman for me and get me admitted? 

 

It seems that you don't have anything to lose. Might as well ask.

[TheVineyard]

OK, so as you may know I am in the Master's program in philosophy at CUNY. I applied to the Phd program at the same school--and was rejected. I was talking to one of my recommenders, call him John, and he said that one of my other recommenders, call him Peter, was very powerful and influential in the department. John said that basically what Peter wants, Peter gets. He said I should talk to Peter and tell him my situation, and that despite already being in the program and getting all A grades, and despite having recommendations all from professors in the department, I got rejected, and that nobody will even talk to me to tell my why I was rejected. He said to ask Peter point-blank if he would be willing to talk to the chairman of the department, who makes the final admissions decisions, and tell him to reconsider my application. John said that if Peter agrees to do this, I will be admitted. John said Peter may agree to do it, or may not, even though it wouldn't cost him anything to do it, and given he knows me and likes me well enough to have written a recommendation for me. What do you think the chances are that Peter will agree to talk to the chairman for me and get me admitted? 

 

The adcom knew who you were, saw who you were recommended by, and rejected you. That's not the kind of environment that I would beg to get into. You would only be setting yourself up for second-class citizenship.

Edited March 27, 2014 by TheVineyard

[PhiPhiPhi]

The adcom knew who you were, saw who you were recommended by, and rejected you. That's not the kind of environment that I would beg to get into. You would only be setting yourself up for second-class citizenship.

I'm actually going to agree with this. Staying at your MA program despite just a wait-list would be okay only if you've picked out a couple of people who are really excited to work with you and willing to stick up for you for the next 5 years. If you don't have at least 2 of those people, you should get out of there.

[PerpetualApplicant No More]

The adcom knew who you were, saw who you were recommended by, and rejected you. That's not the kind of environment that I would beg to get into. You would only be setting yourself up for second-class citizenship.

While there's something very right about this sentiment, I'm going to disagree for OP's current situation. CUNY is a big department (perhaps the biggest in the US?) and it doesn't matter if some random faculty member you'll never work with doesn't like you--what matters is whether your advisers/dissertation committee thinks of you. I'll grant that it's never ideal to have anyone on the faculty who has anything against you, but how important a factor that should be to your decision is dependent on who that person is, how much you would work with him/her, how big the program is generally, etc.

 

Now, OP has no idea why he/she was denied. It may be for a variety of reasons, including but not limited to 1) his/her letters weren't as strong as he/she thought, and 2) his/her letters were sufficiently strong, but were overruled because someone on the admissions committee said so.

 

If 1) is the case, then Vineyard and Phi3 are right; it won't be a geat place for you. If 2) is the case, I'm not sure what the big deal is. And you have no idea why you were denied, so the least you can do is ask your prof in the know about what happened.

 

PS If you want to disguise the identity of your writers, you should probably use first names that are not those of actual faculty at your school.

 

Edit: Not sayiing I'd do this in your shoes--I think there's something really important about making sure you're at a place that wants you, but that's my personal bias. I guess I'd say that Vineyard and Phi3's advice is right but only to an extent--it's not that you should categorically never go to a place that doesn't want you, but you should take that in to account and figure out exactly how much it does or doesn't matter that someone doesn't want you there.

Edited March 28, 2014 by perpetualapplicant

[logos0516]

While there's something very right about this sentiment, I'm going to disagree for OP's current situation. CUNY is a big department (perhaps the biggest in the US?) and it doesn't matter if some random faculty member you'll never work with doesn't like you--what matters is whether your advisers/dissertation committee thinks of you. I'll grant that it's never ideal to have anyone on the faculty who has anything against you, but how important a factor that should be to your decision is dependent on who that person is, how much you would work with him/her, how big the program is generally, etc.

 

Now, OP has no idea why he/she was denied. It may be for a variety of reasons, including but not limited to 1) his/her letters weren't as strong as he/she thought, and 2) his/her letters were sufficiently strong, but were overruled because someone on the admissions committee said so.

 

If 1) is the case, then Vineyard and Phi3 are right; it won't be a geat place for you. If 2) is the case, I'm not sure what the big deal is. And you have no idea why you were denied, so the least you can do is ask your prof in the know about what happened.

 

PS If you want to disguise the identity of your writers, you should probably use first names that are not those of actual faculty at your school.

 

Edit: Not sayiing I'd do this in your shoes--I think there's something really important about making sure you're at a place that wants you, but that's my personal bias. I guess I'd say that Vineyard and Phi3's advice is right but only to an extent--it's not that you should categorically never go to a place that doesn't want you, but you should take that in to account and figure out exactly how much it does or doesn't matter that someone doesn't want you there.

Thank you for your thoughts. I think too much emphasis is being put on a few admissions committee members' opinions as representing the unanimous view of 'the place', rather than the view of just three faculty members and two graduate students. Now, I could care less whether the two graduate students on the admissions committee want me there or not. They have absolutely no power over me and I don't need them for anything in my graduate career, and so I have the luxury of ignoring their opinion. 

 

Also, I think that since I am really rejected, and since as one of my recommenders said, there is nothing that will change over the upcoming year that will increase my chances of getting into CUNY, I really have nothing to lose by asking my other recommender to go to bat for me. The very worst that can happen is that he flat out refuses, and/or I really piss him off. That's it. Nothing else. And since if he doesn't speak up for me, I really don't intend on applying to CUNY next year. 

 

Besides, my recommender said I should talk to him, and that neither he nor I have anything to lose. 

 

I agree someone should ideally not be at a place that doesn't want them. But CUNY philosophy department has over 40 faculty members, and again, the views of three of them do not, in my humble opinion, represent the views of 'the place'. The vast majority of faculty members are not on the admissions committee, don't know who the applicants are, who has been admitted, etc. They only find out when the new faces start showing up in their classes. 

 

Also, nobody at CUNY has any ill will toward me (as far as I know!), and if my acceptance were the result of some acrimonious struggle, then yeah, I would seek life elsewhere. But that's not the case here. 

[logos0516]

Besides, I have no other acceptances, and only a waitlist at University of Virginia. And I hear their waitlist is big. So I have nowhere else to go.

[PerpetualApplicant No More]

Besides, I have no other acceptances, and only a waitlist at University of Virginia. And I hear their waitlist is big. So I have nowhere else to go.

In that case, I'd like to say that your adviser's suggestions are mostly right. But I'd like to make an important caveat. You have nothing to lose going to "Peter" (again, really, use a different name. I'm pretty sure I know who you're talking about) IFF you do not, as you say, "piss him off."

 

That is, be sure that if he were to say to you "Look, I gave you the letter I thought you earned. It didn't cut it according to the adcom. Sorry." then be sure you're not going to explode at him (I'm not trying to be presumptuous--though I may be failing--but you kinda did do this when I suggested the possibility last month on this board). It'll suck (a lot--I know) but grin and thank him for the information and his time, and that's it.

 

Because if you do not get in anywhere this round then you will either be 1) applying again) or (inclusive) 2) applying for jobs. In either case, you'll need a letter (well, you *may* only need a letter from your profs for jobs if you've been unemployed while in school...but you get the point). And pissing him off basically means you need to go find another letter writer. And I'm assuming you chose "Peter" over some other profs you've taken a class or two with because you thought Peter's letter was the best.

 

So....don't piss him off. But as long as you avoid doing so, I'd say yeah, go ahead. The points you raise about CUNY being large and the adcom being small are spot on.

[logos0516]

In that case, I'd like to say that your adviser's suggestions are mostly right. But I'd like to make an important caveat. You have nothing to lose going to "Peter" (again, really, use a different name. I'm pretty sure I know who you're talking about) IFF you do not, as you say, "piss him off."

 

That is, be sure that if he were to say to you "Look, I gave you the letter I thought you earned. It didn't cut it according to the adcom. Sorry." then be sure you're not going to explode at him (I'm not trying to be presumptuous--though I may be failing--but you kinda did do this when I suggested the possibility last month on this board). It'll suck (a lot--I know) but grin and thank him for the information and his time, and that's it.

 

Because if you do not get in anywhere this round then you will either be 1) applying again) or (inclusive) 2) applying for jobs. In either case, you'll need a letter (well, you *may* only need a letter from your profs for jobs if you've been unemployed while in school...but you get the point). And pissing him off basically means you need to go find another letter writer. And I'm assuming you chose "Peter" over some other profs you've taken a class or two with because you thought Peter's letter was the best.

 

So....don't piss him off. But as long as you avoid doing so, I'd say yeah, go ahead. The points you raise about CUNY being large and the adcom being small are spot on.

A ha, yes, I do well remember 'last month'. Stressful time! I appreciate your advice and posts. I know this is an impossible question to answer, but what do you think the odds are that he actually WILL speak to the chairman of the department--at least speak to him, whether or not I get in?

[PerpetualApplicant No More]

A ha, yes, I do well remember 'last month'. Stressful time! I appreciate your advice and posts. I know this is an impossible question to answer, but what do you think the odds are that he actually WILL speak to the chairman of the department--at least speak to him, whether or not I get in?

Giving you a number would be wild speculation on my part--sorry. But I agree with Establishment and WandaJune's earlier posts that they are nonzero if you ask, and zero if you don't.

Edited March 28, 2014 by perpetualapplicant

[logos0516]

Giving you a number would be wild speculation on my part--sorry. But I agree with the earlier post that they are nonzero if you ask, and zero if you don't.

Yeah, sometimes academics are really flaky and can't be bothered to lift a finger for someone, that's the only thing I am mildly worried about.

[TheVineyard]

Giving you a number would be wild speculation on my part--sorry. But I agree with Establishment and WandaJune's earlier posts that they are nonzero if you ask, and zero if you don't.

 

Shouldn't this mean that we ought to ask every school that rejected us for a second chance?

Edited March 28, 2014 by TheVineyard

[PerpetualApplicant No More]

Shouldn't this mean that we ought to ask every school that rejected us for a second chance?

Iff 1) you are ridiculously lucky enough to have a letter writer who actually stands a significant nonzero chance of swaying the committee and 2) your school makes unfunded offers and you'd be happy with one then, sure, I'll bite that bullet.

[logos0516]

Iff 1) you are ridiculously lucky enough to have a letter writer who actually stands a significant nonzero chance of swaying the committee and 2) your school makes unfunded offers and you'd be happy with one then, sure, I'll bite that bullet.

Yes on both counts. This professor is probably the most influential one in the department. And yes, my school makes unfunded offers.