ne4810 Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 Who's already started working on their list? Where are people thinking about? Come out all you 2010'ers... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
georgica1 Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 I applied for 2009 and wound up 0 for 4, so I already know where I'm definitely applying, but there are a lot of maybes. The thing I'm somewhat unsure about is "safeties", if such a thing can even be said to exist at the PhD level (let's just call them "less impossibles" for the moment.) I know what the top programs are in my field (post-war/contemporary) but don't have a very good sense of the 2nd tier. What about you? Field, list, etc? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fullofpink Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 I've started on my list a long time ago, am on the fence about which program I want to do (a fun masters or just shoot for Phd?), and those stupid GREs. I'm 1700-1900 European/American paintings with a special interest in collections and the history of the museum. You can imagine the difficulty of THIS search. haha. It sucks because the professors at my alma mater are interested in the same topics I am but my DGS told me I'm not allowed to apply there. lol. I already know some professors at top tier schools I'm interested in, but I'm also interested in some MA specific courses of studies like Williams and Courtauld. Also, I refuse to go to school in the South so most of the schools I look at are in the Northern part of the country across the border Maine -> Seattle. This is going to be an interesting process. right now, how many schools do you think you will end up applying to? I'm hoping to narrow down to 8. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fullofpink Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 I applied for 2009 and wound up 0 for 4, so I already know where I'm definitely applying, but there are a lot of maybes. The thing I'm somewhat unsure about is "safeties", if such a thing can even be said to exist at the PhD level (let's just call them "less impossibles" for the moment.) I know what the top programs are in my field (post-war/contemporary) but don't have a very good sense of the 2nd tier. What about you? Field, list, etc? This will be difficult since almost every school has a department on post-war/contemporary. What may help is figure out an artist who you REALLY love, or a movement, and find through the art bibliography modern people interested in your topic. I've found some crazy professors who like what I like in smaller schools I've never heard of but I'm sure would be interesting to attend. Another thing I did was just go to wikipedia and look for a list of universities per state and just check them off (this is easy since a lot do not offer a grad program, or even Art history). I had a good friend of mine tell me, she's in her 3rd year on a Phd track, that attending an ivy league or whatever does not really matter since getting your PhD already puts you in a small category of specialists. I've taken that advice to heart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ne4810 Posted April 16, 2009 Author Share Posted April 16, 2009 I applied for 2009 and wound up 0 for 4, so I already know where I'm definitely applying, but there are a lot of maybes. The thing I'm somewhat unsure about is "safeties", if such a thing can even be said to exist at the PhD level (let's just call them "less impossibles" for the moment.) I know what the top programs are in my field (post-war/contemporary) but don't have a very good sense of the 2nd tier. What about you? Field, list, etc? Wow georgica, that is tough. I am pretty scared by the number of you 2009 people (yes that was me lurking throughout the process) who were shut out this year. I've been out of academia since getting my masters a while ago, and I went through that process like a babe in the woods, I applied to three programs, got in to all three, and went to the one that offered the most money! I wish this time would be so easy, but judging by everyone's experience here, I am getting pretty nervous. Plus my area of interest is slightly more offbeat, I'm into 19th and 20th century architecture and design history; which really limits my options. Also, because of personal reasons, I would prefer not to stray to far from NYC (though I will be applying elsewhere to get enough programs onto my list). Obviously the big ones are attractive, Columbia, NYU, and CUNY all have people I'd love to work with. I too am worried about the safety situation. What connotes a safety if EVERY Phd program is competitive? I think Fullofpink has a good point about looking for even more specific correlations with professors, especially in a field as hot as Mod/Coms. Find the one who wrote "the" monograph on your artist and track them down, no matter the caliber of their institution because at the end of the day the Phd itself is prestigious and this world is so small. People who were repeat appliers in 2009 seemed to suggest asking the programs why they rejected you and following that advice when reworking a packet. Basically I am shooting for a list around 8 as well, both combined art history and architectural history programs and some just architectural history stand alones (most top schools combine them). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedPotato Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 since getting my masters You think you are nervous? I'm scared. I'm going to also be applying for fall 2010, straight from undergrad. I want to go directly from undergrad into a PhD program, but against everyone with a masters, I have no idea what will happen. I have 2 internships at well-known-in-the-museum-world museums and a double major of studio art and art history, but the masters people, make me go oh noes! :shock: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abner Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 ne4810--you might have already considered it, but based on your interest and location preference, you might want to look at bard graduate center. not sure where your interest lies within 19th and 20th century architectural/design history or if there's a prof that would be a good advisor for you, but they seem to have a pretty unique approach and focus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fullofpink Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 You think you are nervous? I'm scared. I'm going to also be applying for fall 2010, straight from undergrad. I want to go directly from undergrad into a PhD program, but against everyone with a masters, I have no idea what will happen. I have 2 internships at well-known-in-the-museum-world museums and a double major of studio art and art history, but the masters people, make me go oh noes! :shock: Actually, for some programs (esp. 5 year PhD programs that offer masters in the second year) I can see already holding a masters as a deterrent. Many of these programs seem to gear undergrads for their strict line of study and it seems to be a worse deal for people with their masters. For instance, some of these phd programs are five years with strict guidelines and they talk about master applicants as an afterthought. Most students spend two years on a masters, but are only granted one year residency (if) in a phd program. And, I've seen many people with masters being rejected and I've seen many with only BAs accepted. If you have a strong application, you should feel confident! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedPotato Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 Thanks for your confidence. I am kinda confident - Im an out going and persistent person too, so I think that goes a long way showing initiative. To articulate more though, what makes me nervous, is that I don't really have a specific focus. I like modern/contemporary art (except performance pieces) and I KNOW I want to work in a museum, but I'm torn on Art History GS or Museum studies with a focus on Art history. Also, I think one of the questions asked about was tier 2 (or 3) schools and I was wondering if we could all collaborate on a list. If Harvard/Yale/Princeton is tier 1, what is tier 2? 3? Where do places like Tufts and Ubuffalo fall? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fullofpink Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 RedPotato said: Thanks for your confidence. I am kinda confident - Im an out going and persistent person too, so I think that goes a long way showing initiative. To articulate more though, what makes me nervous, is that I don't really have a specific focus. I like modern/contemporary art (except performance pieces) and I KNOW I want to work in a museum, but I'm torn on Art History GS or Museum studies with a focus on Art history. Also, I think one of the questions asked about was tier 2 (or 3) schools and I was wondering if we could all collaborate on a list. If Harvard/Yale/Princeton is tier 1, what is tier 2? 3? Where do places like Tufts and Ubuffalo fall? I don't know what I'd call Tier 1/2/3 - I mean, most people think Ivy League is all Tier 1 but I found Cornell's Art History program to be the weakest of the bunch and a program like NYU IFA to be MUCH better than it. I think the most competitive programs are in Tier 1, you know the ones that everyone really really wants and some think that are just a bit too far out of reach. Here are some of my ideas; I like the idea of a list. Tier 1: Harvard, Princeton, Columbia, UC Berkeley, UM Ann Arbor, Upenn, NYU, WUSTL Tier 2: Northwestern, John Hopkins, UCLA, UChicago, Williams, SUNY, Tier 3: Most state schools that offer a Phd (not if they only offer masters), Penn State, Duke, UMD, Georgetown, UW, Texas schools, ... Ones I'm not familiar with at all (mostly because they don't have strong professors in my region) Tufts, Rutgers, Courtrauld (does it have a great reputation?- I think so) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ne4810 Posted April 17, 2009 Author Share Posted April 17, 2009 Don't be nervous RedPotato, when I was getting my masters (which I did straight from undergrad) I had a much easier time of it then some of my "returning" classmates. You are coming from the undergrad trenches, and your study skills are sharp etc, and the admin people know that. And abner thanks for the suggestion, I know the BGC faculty, and they don't really have anyone I'd like to work with, but the program itself is very good. In terms of a list, I definitely think that Courtauld can be on the top rung there, the program is seen very well in the museum and academic communities both here and abroad. I like the idea of a list, one of the reasons I thought we should start our 2010 discussion earlier this year was for this kind of application support! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paperclips Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 One thing to keep in mind is that these "tiers" COMPLETELY depend on what field you're in. For my field, Princeton, Columbia, Berkeley, Penn, and NYU are all definitely 2nd Tier schools. I would definitely not consider all the Ivies to be "top tier." This is not college, so having an Ivy League name does not guarantee anything. As you said, Cornell in particular does not have a great reputation. Finally, consider how happy you would be at these places. Columbia & NYU have the reputation for being very competitive and having unavailable professors. I almost went to Columbia, but decided I would be very unhappy there. Think about where you would do your best work, because ultimately what matters is not whether your school was ranked #5 or #7, but how good your scholarship is, how much your advisor can do to help you while you study under him/her, and how much s/he can help you make connections and find a job. Pythia 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fullofpink Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 I also suggest this time around that everyone put into their signatures what specialty they are in/look for. I think it helps everyone and it doesn't require you to keep saying "I'm interested in modern Chinese/Warhol/Mideval Manuscripts from Russia..." etc. The list I was providing is just a general list of what schools are generally recognized. I think a lot of schools often go unnoticed because people don't think to even look there. I started out by researching schools in like, Alabama (first state in the alphabet) and found most of them possibly completely useless. A lot didn't offer masters, and if they did the program looked really weak - maybe a school gallery with a few prominent names but nothing in regards to a major museum, excellent library collection, travel possibilities, etc. What *I'd* really like to see on the list of school's I've never heard of that seem awesome (I just recently heard of courtauld, for example) that does not require me to dedicate 40 minutes on wikipedia to find. lol. Not only that, but my subject area isn't really a "popular" subject right now so finding ANY interested parties is tough and I'm not opposed to going to a smaller school for a PhD/Ma if I get a better chance at funding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ne4810 Posted April 17, 2009 Author Share Posted April 17, 2009 Thank you paperclips for that. This is definitely true, and speaks to finding the place with the professor thats right for you, AND the environment thats right. All important things to keep in mind as we move forward thanks! Fullofpink, is there a particular country or type of painting you are interested in 1700-1900? As paperclips mentioned, the specialty really defines the list! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fullofpink Posted April 17, 2009 Share Posted April 17, 2009 Thank you paperclips for that. This is definitely true, and speaks to finding the place with the professor thats right for you, AND the environment thats right. All important things to keep in mind as we move forward thanks! Fullofpink, is there a particular country or type of painting you are interested in 1700-1900? As paperclips mentioned, the specialty really defines the list! Lol. I was scared someone was going to ask me this - that's why I'm being a bit broad. Right now, I'm really interested in the intense period between 1770s-1830s France. Collection practices in France took a spin in the 1780s and after the fall of the ancien regime the entire system changed, again, and then transformed AGAIN after the Restoration. I really like Neoclassicism and the difficulties that it faced as time progressed over the 19thc (i.e. Impressionism). Also, 17th and 18th century French art has a lot of adaptations and commentary from Netherlandish art. I think it's really important to know ALL aspects. HOWEVER, I'm also studying English sporting art right now and that will be my slight obsession for the next half year, and I've been dabbling in some 19th c. photography and looking at Watteau. Although I haven't mentioned any American work but American art is really close to my heart especially since everything about it was so different from what was going on in Europe until the late 19th c. I'm a cultural nerd. I'll end now; it only gets more complicated. LOL. Right now, I'm looking for anyone that does Neoclassical (in the least) and possibly people who dabble in 18thc. They are so rare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
staccato Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 Hi everyone! I am also looking to apply for 2010. I feel like art history grad school is really hard to get into now. Its just so competitive and I'm really nervous. My area of interest is Roman art and archaeology, particularly the period between Augustus and Hadrian. I have been following posts on this site for a while now and there don't to be many interested in this area, unless they are all hiding like I was!! Looking forward to keeping in touch with everyone throughout the process! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sydney Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 just thought i would throw this out there, as someone who got accepted to their dream school with funding this year... find the individuals you want to work with, and decide where to apply based on that. tiers and such, as already mentioned, are variable based on concentration (and not necessarily the best way to "rank" your choices). as far as "finding" these individuals - you should have a sense of who the foremost scholars in your field are. find out where/if they teach; where they went to school; younger/lesser known scholars who cite/rely heavily on these "primary scholars"; etc. etc. it is a lot of work, and ultimately it comes down how well you (individually) fit with the faculty - so rankings and such can only help so much. and good for all of you for starting out early. i have my fingers crossed for all of you! (b.t.w. my field is modern / contemporary) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
georgica1 Posted April 19, 2009 Share Posted April 19, 2009 just thought i would throw this out there, as someone who got accepted to their dream school with funding this year... find the individuals you want to work with, and decide where to apply based on that. tiers and such, as already mentioned, are variable based on concentration (and not necessarily the best way to "rank" your choices). as far as "finding" these individuals - you should have a sense of who the foremost scholars in your field are. find out where/if they teach; where they went to school; younger/lesser known scholars who cite/rely heavily on these "primary scholars"; etc. etc. it is a lot of work, and ultimately it comes down how well you (individually) fit with the faculty - so rankings and such can only help so much. and good for all of you for starting out early. i have my fingers crossed for all of you! (b.t.w. my field is modern / contemporary) If you don't mind my asking, where are you headed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tommyzero Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Right now, I'm looking for anyone that does Neoclassical (in the least) and possibly people who dabble in 18thc. They are so rare. Have you considered Satish Padiyar at the Courtauld Institute? I studied with him last year and he's a great teacher. http://www.courtauld.ac.uk/people/padiyar-satish.shtml Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
void Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Have you considered Satish Padiyar at the Courtauld Institute? I studied with him last year and he's a great teacher. http://www.courtauld.ac.uk/people/padiyar-satish.shtml Also Nina Kallmyer, University of Delaware. Really great mentor too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fullofpink Posted April 24, 2009 Share Posted April 24, 2009 Thanks guys! I've been developing an interest in Courtauld but I can't decide if it would be better for me to pursue a MA in Art History, or in curating the art museum. Decisions!! Also, I'm really familiar with Nina Kallmyer's work, I just didn't know what university she was at. Thank you for the info! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ristastic Posted May 6, 2009 Share Posted May 6, 2009 Hey everyone! Just thought I'd introduce myself...I'm also applying for art history phds for fall 2010. My concentration is medieval, though I also love early Renaissance. I'm finishing up my MA in NYC right now, and looking at mostly "top tier" schools because I'd like to stay on the east coast, with a few "second tier" schools. I'm wondering when people started contacting professors, and what the proper etiquette is for that whole process? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
socialcomm Posted May 8, 2009 Share Posted May 8, 2009 Hi everyone! I'm interested in visual studies and communication so I'm introducing myself in both forums. I'm most interested in studying advertising associated with social change issues at UCI's Visual Studies program (art history/film studies focused, which is why I'm in this forum). In regards to contacting programs, I've found both programs I'll be applying to very open to answering any questions I've had. For these particular programs, you don't need an advisor coming in, but I've asked profs about future research and their availability to take on new advisees in the coming years. I'm not entirely sure it's proper etiquette though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonbudgie Posted May 28, 2009 Share Posted May 28, 2009 Hi everyone, I am currently a rising senior at Boston College, and I have decided to take the plunge and apply for an MA/PhD program. I am interested in Renaissance art, specifically art created in Florence during the Medicean period, and am contemplating where to apply. I am not sure what schools are realistic options and which are completely out of my league. I am a good student (G.P.A. is 3.8 ) and a member of the Honors Program here, as well as a recipient of several prestigious awards... however, I have no clue how competitive graduate school admission is especially since many applicants have already completed Masters programs. Any advice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
georgica1 Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 Hi everyone, I am currently a rising senior at Boston College, and I have decided to take the plunge and apply for an MA/PhD program. I am interested in Renaissance art, specifically art created in Florence during the Medicean period, and am contemplating where to apply. I am not sure what schools are realistic options and which are completely out of my league. I am a good student (G.P.A. is 3.8 ) and a member of the Honors Program here, as well as a recipient of several prestigious awards... however, I have no clue how competitive graduate school admission is especially since many applicants have already completed Masters programs. Any advice? My best advice is apply to a wide range of programs. Grad school admissions are in many ways a total crapshoot -- most programs will accept max 10-15 applicants, often far fewer, and that's across all specialties (i.e., they may only be taking 1 or 2 Renaissance people per year.) When it comes to PhD programs, the most important thing is to find potential advisors -- figure out who is doing research that interests you, and apply to their departments. The prestige of the university as a whole is often not as important at the graduate level; my field isn't Renaissance, so I don't know what the really top programs are, but if you're interested in an academic career, the reputation of your advisor and your department is going to be more important than reputation of the university, and there are a number of non-Ivies with top art history programs (NYU is probably the most obvious example.) I would suggest speaking to your advisor and/or a professor in your area who you have a good relationship with and asking he/she for program recommendations. They'll have a better sense of which programs are best for your field and may be able to give you a sense of which ones are within your reach. Lastly, having an MA doesn't necessarily increase your chances of getting into a PhD program. Many sequential programs encourage applicants to apply with a BA only Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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