Has anyone here gotten into top MTS/MA or PhD programs with good-but-not-great GRE scores?

[Isaac32]

By "good-but-not-great" I mean 163 or less on Verbal, 5 or less on AW.  

If so, could you explain the factors you think led to your acceptance?

[colormelovely]

I was under the impression that GRE scores mattered less at the MA level (even at top schools; Yale doesn't accept them, for instance). At least I hope since my Quant. score was pretty bad.

[newenglandshawn]

By "good-but-not-great" I mean 163 or less on Verbal, 5 or less on AW.  

If so, could you explain the factors you think led to your acceptance?

 

I think you will find a number of people who have gotten into programs - even PhD programs - with scores lower than this. It seems to me that someone I interacted with recently on here got into a program with something like 160 V and 138 Q. But, these are more the exception rather than the rule, of course!

 

As for what factors could offset lower GRE scores: I have not gotten into a program (yet!), but I'll just tell you what the PhD director at Duke told me when I queried him - and it was revealed that my scores were not exceptional. He said that one will have to have an especially strong Statement of Purpose and strong Letters of Recommendation. This is always the case, I think, but especially if one's GRE scores are subpar.

 

Truthfully, I think most people would agree that that Statement is the single greatest factor in the whole process (assuming, of course, that an applicant has at least baseline stats in other areas). So if you are wondering how to spend the remaining time you have, it might be most fruitful to spend more time trying to craft a great statement than to spend a lot of time trying to raise your GRE scores by a few points. That's just what people have recommended to me!

[AbrasaxEos]

I've mentioned this in other places here, but it bears repeating.  GRE scores are like the invitation that allows you to move past the bouncers into the party, which then probably goes into your pocket and doesn't show up again once in.  For MA programs you probably don't need to worry, but for a PhD, you might consider a retake if you think that you could pull your percentile above 95.  The role of the GRE probably fluctuates with different programs, but a lot will use it to create a kind of 'shelf' to clear out the excess of applications received.  As nice as it would be to read through one hundred purpose statements to be sure there wasn't a diamond in the rough who only managed a 155 on verbal, I don't think this is how it usually works.  It sucks because some people are amazing writers and despicable test-takers, but it seems to be the way that the cards are falling now. 

 

As shawn mentions, there are exceptions which do seem to indicate that in some cases a good-not-great score does get read and even makes it into a program, and these are encouraging.  However, I can tell you that way back in the olden days of the old scoring system, I was told to shoot for 700 or above so as not to get turned away at the door (so to speak), which I think was 96th percentile.  I think shawn's advice is pretty decent though, if you legitimately think that you could improve your score by a couple of points, and have the financial means to take it again, go for it.  If you do not, or are unsure, and the prospect of blowing however many hundred dollars the GRE costs these days is not something that you are willing or able to do, just apply and see how things come out. 

[sacklunch]

Anything above 90% on verbal for doctoral programs is totally sufficient in my experience. It seems as if anything above 60-70% for M* programs is more than fine.

FWIW I had scores on the border of my above recommendation for doctoral programs and I got into several top programs. Though my field is quite language heavy and my background propelled me beyond, I imagine, some other applicants who had 'stellar' scores. 

I've also said it on here, but it's worth repeating. Many of the people on the forum freely reporting their scores score well (90%+). There are some, of course, freely admitting to their 75% verbal, but by and large you will see plenty of 'you better have this amazing score or you're screwed' kinda reports. 

Some will tell you that high math indicates either proficiency in languages or simply that your great score simply reflects your long-groomed affluence (and thus something that cannot be learned quickly, as the test is 'unbeatable'). Unfortunately I have heard this sort of garbage from professors at several institutes, and in turn, I'm sure, committees across the country also buy into it. Whether or not it's true isn't what matters. Sometimes you gotta play the game in order to get your foot in the door. 

Edited October 28, 2014 by sacklunch

[xypathos]

I haven't applied to PhD programs yet but I have had this conversation with a VDS faculty member. I mentioned people giving advice of percentile scores of 90+ for verbal in order to be taken seriously and they described that as complete garbage. That from their assessment of applicants while at VDS, Yale, and Harvard, and from discussions with other faculty - 160 (or about 85%) will get your application seriously considered.

Students expounding this notion of a 165V and 3.9 GPA simply fail to understand the incredibly subjective nature of PhD applications. So, they look for some quantifiable data to explain why they weren't accepted and what they have is GPA and GRE. In reality, it's much more likely that your writing sample didn't connect with the faculty, the faculty member you wanted to work with was barred from taking a student this year because of politics or funding, someone simply sold themselves better, etc.

That said, the faculty member encouraged hitting 160+ and after that, focus your efforts on your writing sample. It's largely the strongest aspect of your application. While LORs are important and you should discern who can write you the better recommendation, what they write is out of your control.

[dr. t]

And public institutions do usually have GRE-based funding, which can affect matters.

[Isaac32]

So now that we have all heard back, were any of you admitted to good PhD/ ThD programs this season with a V score less than 90%?

Edited April 14, 2015 by Isaac32

[newenglandshawn]

So now that we have all heard back, were any of you admitted to good PhD/ ThD programs this season with a V score less than 90%?

 

Nope. My V was 89% - though I'm assuming that wasn't the deciding factor in why I wasn't accepted (it also doesn't help that my AW score was not quite where it should have been either).

[Isaac32]

Nope. My V was 89% - though I'm assuming that wasn't the deciding factor in why I wasn't accepted (it also doesn't help that my AW score was not quite where it should have been either).

Thanks for the reply. I've spoken with admissions people at UVA, PTSem, Marquette, Fordham, and Vandy and they all said my scores (162 V, 5.0 AW) are good, but they also said that a higher score would help. 

I'll probably retake just so I am not left wondering if my GRE scores did me in in the end.

Are you coming from a master's program in RS or theology? 

[newenglandshawn]

Thanks for the reply. I've spoken with admissions people at UVA, PTSem, Marquette, Fordham, and Vandy and they all said my scores (162 V, 5.0 AW) are good, but they also said that a higher score would help. 

I'll probably retake just so I am not left wondering if my GRE scores did me in in the end.

Are you coming from a master's program in RS or theology? 

 

I got a 162 on my V as well, but that was supposedly 89%. I really do think that's probably adequate - but what do I know!

 

I did my MDiv at an Evangelical seminary. 

Edited April 14, 2015 by newenglandshawn

[ALH3]

So now that we have all heard back, were any of you admitted to good PhD/ ThD programs this season with a V score less than 90%?

It is hard to judge what you mean by "good" programs but I'll say that I got into 3 schools -- Florida State, Boston U, Georgetown -- with a 160 V (the programs are in comparative ethics/traditions, philosophy, religious studies and theology). 

 

At the same time, I talked with some schools prior to applying that mentioned that my scores would make it tough (impossible?) to get admitted. So, I either chose to not bother applying or tried anyway and got rejected. Whoever wrote that VDS doesn't care about scores didn't talk to the faculty member I did. The VDS faculty member told me that he hasn't seen the school even consider someone without a 3.9 GPA and 90%+ V (same for Yale). I will say that Harvard appears to place less weight on GREs but it's still Harvard so few people get in regardless. I'd imagine the majority of those who are admitted come from Harvard and have good scores, though.  

[Isaac32]

It is hard to judge what you mean by "good" programs but I'll say that I got into 3 schools -- Florida State, Boston U, Georgetown -- with a 160 V (the programs are in comparative ethics/traditions, philosophy, religious studies and theology). 

 

At the same time, I talked with some schools prior to applying that mentioned that my scores would make it tough (impossible?) to get admitted. So, I either chose to not bother applying or tried anyway and got rejected. Whoever wrote that VDS doesn't care about scores didn't talk to the faculty member I did. The VDS faculty member told me that he hasn't seen the school even consider someone without a 3.9 GPA and 90%+ V (same for Yale). I will say that Harvard appears to place less weight on GREs but it's still Harvard so few people get in regardless. I'd imagine the majority of those who are admitted come from Harvard and have good scores, though.  

I'd say Boston U and Florida State are definitely good programs, even if they are just below TT. I don't know much about Georgetown. 

I e-mailed admissions at VDS. I did not talk to a specific faculty member. That said, I know two people who have been admitted to VDS PhD in the past couple years with comparable scores at or near the 90% mark. One had a 161 V and a 4.5 AW and the other had a 163 V and a 4.5 AW. 

[xypathos]

Whoever wrote that VDS doesn't care about scores didn't talk to the faculty member I did. The VDS faculty member told me that he hasn't seen the school even consider someone without a 3.9 GPA and 90%+ V

 

The comment made wasn't that VDS doesn't care about GREs. The comment made was that VDS wanted to see 160+ on Verbal.

[Maccabeus]

So now that we have all heard back, were any of you admitted to good PhD/ ThD programs this season with a V score less than 90%?

my V was lower than this (158) but my writing was 5.5. I'm guessing the writing helped me get in the door. With that said, there are so many factors that go into adcom decisions and the GRE is just one aspect.

[ALH3]

The comment made wasn't that VDS doesn't care about GREs. The comment made was that VDS wanted to see 160+ on Verbal.

 

Gotcha, I should have written that differently. What I meant was the professor I talked to said he has never seen a student with anything lower than 90%+ even get considered. Like you said, regardless every school cares about the score. 

[fides quarens intellectum]

I did pretty well on the test myself, but professors I know have told me that Many places use the scores to quickly sort through the applications that they want to review more thoroughly. I think you never really know what will get you in. I'm sure many people have applied with the same score on different years and had very different results.

[Isaac32]

I did pretty well on the test myself, but professors I know have told me that Many places use the scores to quickly sort through the applications that they want to review more thoroughly. I think you never really know what will get you in. I'm sure many people have applied with the same score on different years and had very different results.

It is very difficult to predict, and there is a lot more than test scores and academic achievement that go into such considerations. A buddy of mine says the biggest reason that he was admitted to a very prestigious philosophy program because he is a half Korean, half Hispanic Pentecostal who loves to go skydiving I don't know how much truth there is to his claim, but I am sure his background didn't hurt his chances.

[fides quarens intellectum]

FWIW, I'm hispanic also!  Haha.  I only got accepted at one out of the seven schools I applied at, though. But it was my top choice!

[liquidmountains]

I had a 160 on the verbal, 149 on qual and 4.5 for writing. I was admitted to RS Phd programs at several ivy league schools. The originality and importance of your ideas, as expressed in you personal statement and writing sample(s), is what matters most. Best advice I ever got: send less time fueling the testing-industrial-complex and more time thinking about how to meaningfully intervene in your chosen sub-field.

[sacklunch]

I had a 160 on the verbal, 149 on qual and 4.5 for writing. I was admitted to RS Phd programs at several ivy league schools. The originality and importance of your ideas, as expressed in you personal statement and writing sample(s), is what matters most. Best advice I ever got: send less time fueling the testing-industrial-complex and more time thinking about how to meaningfully intervene in your chosen sub-field.

 

My scores were only points better and I had good results. I spent a hilarious amount of time on my PS.