Only (likely) acceptance is a partially funded master's... Worth it?

[gradschoolcoolguy]

So I made the dumb mistake of overestimating the strength of my application and only applying to three PhD programs and one master's program. Today, I received denial notices from all three of the PhD programs. I have not yet been officially accepted to the master's program, but I interviewed with the PI and she talked as if I was already in, so I am pretty certain that I will be accepted. However, the problem is that the school only offers a $12/hr, 20hr/week stipend for assitantships. The PI also has funding for field research, but I will have to take out loans for my tuition. I did not want to be in this position, but please consider the following reasons why I might do it:

- The program and research are ideal for my interests

- The location of the school is ideal, in-state, and close to home

- The school itself is awesome and I'm pretty sure that I'll be happy there.

- The PI is,m a pioneer in my area of interest and publishes in top-tier journals. Also, many of her former master's students are in currently top PhD programs

- I am a musician on the side and I will be in an area with a great music scene where I could make an extra $300-500 per month playing gigs.

- I have a place that I could stay near the school for fairly cheap

- I have a job that I currently do not like very much I do not think that I will be able to get any relevant work experience if I wait to reapplY

 

I've already taken a year off and I don't know if taking another will be worth it to potentially not get into a funded PhD program. There are not a lot of researchers working in my area of interest, so I'll have to broaden my interests if I apply again. If this school had better funding, then it would honestly be my number 1 choice, but I really don't know if going into debt is worth it. Is it?

 

Edited January 27, 2016 by gradschoolcoolguy

[Vulpix]

I think the fact that you have made such a long and detailed list about all the positive reasons to pursue it is a good sign that in your heart you really want to do this?  Not knowing that many details.  Obviously taking loans is a serious decision but it's one worth weighing next to what your future goals are.

Also, do you still want to re-apply to PhDs down the road?  Do you already have a master's degree?  If you don't have one, and want to strengthen your PhD application in the future, I would say yes.  Depends on how many loans.

[rising_star]

I think it depends on two things: the amount of loans you'd have to take out and whether or not doing the MA will strengthen your profile enough to get you into the PhD programs you want. The latter is hard to predict because there are so many variables with admissions. I personally wouldn't do it but I'm also incredibly debt-averse.

[TakeruK]

I would have similar thoughts and concerns as rising_star. I am also very debt-averse. 

For me, the important question would be how much debt you would still be in and how much you would increase your earning potential with this MA (including the ability to get into a PhD program). In addition, how much debt might you be in during your PhD program (i.e. would the fully funded PhD programs fund enough for you to live comfortably?). When I work with other grad students in your field, many of them tell me that they have to pay for things like travel to research field sites out of pocket. 

Another important question is whether you need this MA in order to get into funded PhD programs. Sure, maybe those 3 that you applied to were out of your reach, but are there other funded PhD programs that you could get into next year? If your ultimate goal is a PhD program, and if this MA program is 2 years long, then you would actually be delaying your PhD even longer by attending the MA program instead of working for a year and then reapplying to more/different schools next year. Even if the MA program is only 1 year long, if you could already get into other PhD programs without it, then why spend that year in school / in debt.

So, whether it's worth it depends on you. But to me, I would only go into debt for a MA program if: 1) a MA degree immediately led to a career path that pays well enough to pay off the debt fast or 2) it's absolutely necessary for a PhD program which will lead to a career path that pays well enough to clear the debt fast. If I can get into a PhD program without the MA program, I wouldn't go into debt for the MA program.

[gradschoolcoolguy]

Thanks for the advice, everyone. It's good to see that I am not absolutely crazy for considering it, but the reasons why I shouldn't do it are making me think about taking another year... To answer all three of you: I am currently in ~$12k debt from my undergrad and this master's program will add another ~$18-20k.

 

17 hours ago, Heather1011 said:

I think the fact that you have made such a long and detailed list about all the positive reasons to pursue it is a good sign that in your heart you really want to do this?  Not knowing that many details.  Obviously taking loans is a serious decision but it's one worth weighing next to what your future goals are.

Also, do you still want to re-apply to PhDs down the road?  Do you already have a master's degree?  If you don't have one, and want to strengthen your PhD application in the future, I would say yes.  Depends on how many loans.

I do not currently have a master's and I do still want to apply to PhDs. It will pretty much guarantee my admission to a PhD.

5 hours ago, rising_star said:

I think it depends on two things: the amount of loans you'd have to take out and whether or not doing the MA will strengthen your profile enough to get you into the PhD programs you want. The latter is hard to predict because there are so many variables with admissions. I personally wouldn't do it but I'm also incredibly debt-averse.

 

1 hour ago, TakeruK said:

I would have similar thoughts and concerns as rising_star. I am also very debt-averse. 

For me, the important question would be how much debt you would still be in and how much you would increase your earning potential with this MA (including the ability to get into a PhD program). In addition, how much debt might you be in during your PhD program (i.e. would the fully funded PhD programs fund enough for you to live comfortably?). When I work with other grad students in your field, many of them tell me that they have to pay for things like travel to research field sites out of pocket. 

Another important question is whether you need this MA in order to get into funded PhD programs. Sure, maybe those 3 that you applied to were out of your reach, but are there other funded PhD programs that you could get into next year? If your ultimate goal is a PhD program, and if this MA program is 2 years long, then you would actually be delaying your PhD even longer by attending the MA program instead of working for a year and then reapplying to more/different schools next year. Even if the MA program is only 1 year long, if you could already get into other PhD programs without it, then why spend that year in school / in debt.

So, whether it's worth it depends on you. But to me, I would only go into debt for a MA program if: 1) a MA degree immediately led to a career path that pays well enough to pay off the debt fast or 2) it's absolutely necessary for a PhD program which will lead to a career path that pays well enough to clear the debt fast. If I can get into a PhD program without the MA program, I wouldn't go into debt for the MA program.

Honestly, it probably won't increase my chances of getting a non-academic job very much... But I am sure that it would guarantee me admission to a PhD. However, I do have a pretty strong application as it is, and a lot of people had told me I shouldn't have had any trouble getting into a PhD program. My GPA is very high and the only part of my GRE that can be improved by any significant margin is my quant score, which isn't ultra important in my field. I have a lot of research experience, a senior thesis, several conference presentations, awards, small undergrad research grants, and a possible publication on the way (although my advisor is taking her sweet time with her edits). But unfortunately, I currently live in an area where I can't really get much work/research experience. I'll just spill the beans and say I am an anthro major and my research will involve fieldwork abroad. I guess I can join the Peace Corps, but that will put me out another 2-3 years. Also,  I have already taken a year off that has been relatively stagnant. My main concern is in a worst case scenario, I will have another completely stagnant year. If that's the case, then how much will it affect my chances of getting into a program?

Edited January 28, 2016 by gradschoolcoolguy

[Vulpix]

I do think it's false that getting the masters would "guarantee" your acceptance to the PhD... there are many other factors involved and most applicants have masters degrees....

[TakeruK]

1 hour ago, gradschoolcoolguy said:

My main concern is in a worst case scenario, I will have another completely stagnant year. If that's the case, then how much will it affect my chances of getting into a program?

I can't say for sure about your field as I'm pretty far removed from it! But in the STEM fields, taking 1 or 2 (or even more) years off between undergrad and graduate school is completely normal and it should not hurt your chances of getting into grad school at all. It could make getting reference letters more difficult, but as long as you keep in touch with your undergrad advisors (and it sounds like you are still working on papers with them so that's great) then you should not be any different.

[bandinterwebs]

I worked for 3.5 years in an unrelated industry and have just been accepted into multiple PhD programs without a masters. I shied away from a Masters program because, rightly or wrongly, I've perceived them as a way to quickly boost your salary in industry, segue into a new field, or bolster a poor undergrad performance (Or just prolong your life in academia...). I personally decided I didn't want to pay for my graduate education, and because my undergrad was solid and in my desired field of study, it did not seem to be a profitable decision for me.

I, too, am very debt-averse. Is the debt you will incur from this master's and potentially carry through your PhD worth working with that professor? Are there potentially other schools where you might apply in a year (or a semester) that would be just as valuable? At least that way, you could continue to pay off your existing debt and save more for the vow of poverty that is grad school.

Could you reach out to an undergrad professor and review your application weaknesses? The only reason I would even consider a masters is if I really thought I could enhance a mediocre undergrad performance, but if your performance wasn't poor, then would a masters necessarily buy you anything?

Edited January 28, 2016 by bandinterwebs

[anthrostudentcyn]

I'm in the same situation and same field. We should talk. 

[soc13]

On 1/27/2016 at 5:48 PM, gradschoolcoolguy said:

So I made the dumb mistake of overestimating the strength of my application and only applying to three PhD programs and one master's program. Today, I received denial notices from all three of the PhD programs. I have not yet been officially accepted to the master's program, but I interviewed with the PI and she talked as if I was already in, so I am pretty certain that I will be accepted. However, the problem is that the school only offers a $12/hr, 20hr/week stipend for assitantships. The PI also has funding for field research, but I will have to take out loans for my tuition. I did not want to be in this position, but please consider the following reasons why I might do it:

- The program and research are ideal for my interests

- The location of the school is ideal, in-state, and close to home

- The school itself is awesome and I'm pretty sure that I'll be happy there.

- The PI is,m a pioneer in my area of interest and publishes in top-tier journals. Also, many of her former master's students are in currently top PhD programs

- I am a musician on the side and I will be in an area with a great music scene where I could make an extra $300-500 per month playing gigs.

- I have a place that I could stay near the school for fairly cheap

- I have a job that I currently do not like very much I do not think that I will be able to get any relevant work experience if I wait to reapplY

 

I've already taken a year off and I don't know if taking another will be worth it to potentially not get into a funded PhD program. There are not a lot of researchers working in my area of interest, so I'll have to broaden my interests if I apply again. If this school had better funding, then it would honestly be my number 1 choice, but I really don't know if going into debt is worth it. Is it?

 

I would recommend against it. I'm not in your field, but in the social sciences. After deciding not to apply to Ph.D. straight out of undergrad, I worked for a year. Then decided to go back for a MPH, as I thought I wanted a career in public health, not so much in research. Well, turns out the research I did during my MPH made me want to apply for soc programs again. I was soundly rejected my first attempt (straight from MPH). I took 2 years to work and reapplied this year.

1. I deeply regret the debt I went (and will be in for perpetuity it seems) for my master's, especially after having undergrad debt too

2. Many social sciences master's are considered cash-cows for the university

3. Your time may be better spent increasing your GRE scores, refining your SOP and writing sample, and searching for best fit programs - so that you can get into a fully funded one next year.

Also, since you are fairly local to this professor, I'd recommend seeing if you can work on one of her research projects while working your 'regular job.' I know it's asking a lot to give free labor (IDK if she'd be able to pay you as a non student, but she may have funds she could), but it could get you more experience/pubs/her to love you... and also a good recommendation from her.  Just worth considering.

Of course, this is all my opinion, and I am biased, having gone into debt for a master's.

[zipykido]

I would ask the program if there is any possibility of transfer from the masters into a PhD. Some schools might require you to finish your master's first before transferring with consent from your adviser while others may let you do so after your first year. I don't know what the salary stats on anthropology are for BA vs MA vs PhD are but generally you'll be more employable with a higher degree and make back the money many times over in the long run. If there's no hope of transfer then it doesn't seem like a bad idea to wait another year. Try to find a higher paying job so that you have a good cushion when you do get accepted into a PhD program. Remember that federal backed loans can go into deferment while at school so you don't have to pay them but they still accrue interest so you should pay those off as soon as possible even in school. 

[MarineBluePsy]

2 hours ago, mm3733 said:

Also, since you are fairly local to this professor, I'd recommend seeing if you can work on one of her research projects while working your 'regular job.' I know it's asking a lot to give free labor (IDK if she'd be able to pay you as a non student, but she may have funds she could), but it could get you more experience/pubs/her to love you... and also a good recommendation from her.  Just worth considering.

I was thinking this too.  This way you get to boost your application, land another letter writer, skip the debt, and only delay one more year instead of two.  Sure your current job isn't great, but you can suck it up for another year if you're spending your free time boosting your application and increasing your savings right?