Application timeline/plan

[othersamantha]

Hi all!

I'm writing today for some general advice about the application timeline-- I know that this varies person-to-person. I'm a notorious procrastinator and generally will leave things until the last minute unless I force myself to adhere to a schedule of some kind. I'll be applying for Fall 2017 admission, and just am trying to get a sense of how behind I likely already am!

For those who've applied in the past, when did you:

-Begin working on your SOP? When did you feel you were "finished" (if you ever did)? In general, was it months of redrafting and tweaking, or a solid week's worth of work?

-Ask for letters of recommendation (is it ever too early)?

-Finalize your list of programs?

-Reach out to POI?

-Begin revising your writing sample (if you did indeed revise)?

I've already taken my GRE (I'm planning on taking the subject test in September or October-- I've done some studying/flashcard making but it's sucking the soul out of me and I've decided it's not the most important thing anyway). I have professors who've written letters of recommendations for me in the past, and will be able to revise their previous letters for me, so I would like to give them time to add in relevant information about the work I did at the end of my senior year and what I have done in the year since graduating. What I'm most worried about is the SOP and revising my writing sample (I'm going to need to cut down my 15,000 word honors thesis to 15-20 pages). I guess I'm also a little nervous about finalizing my list of schools-- I find it really difficult to judge what caliber of programs I should be considering, so I'm hoping my advisor might be able to help me with that.

I realize there's no time like the present to get started on all of this, but just wanted to see what others' past experiences were like! Thanks in advance; hope you're all well! Best of luck to everyone working on applications right now!

[jason3biernat]

Likewise, I will be applying for Fall 2017 Masters degree in Creative Nonfiction.  I have my CV pretty much revised and polished after many drafts.  

My academic adviser and the writing lab at my current school are looking it over and helping me polish it further during the summer.  

My Statement of Purpose is the one that is causing me some trouble.  It must be "perfect" so it is the cause of much stress in my life.  

My first application is not due until December 5th 2016.  Then January, February, March and July 2017.  So I have plenty of time.  

I decided to simply cut all programs that required a GRE.  This has reduced my stress load significantly.  And, I still have 6 schools on my list that offer

teaching assistant positions.   

I have performed allot of research on numerous universities all over the USA!  I feel that my decision to compromise some wants and desires was the right way to go.   My list of schools now contains ( 6) MA Creative Nonfiction programs that I know I have a high chance of being accepted due to my experience and skills.  

 

MA Creative Nonfiction Programs.docx

[unræd]

On June 24, 2016 at 10:00 AM, othersamantha said:

For those who've applied in the past, when did you:

-Begin working on your SOP? When did you feel you were "finished" (if you ever did)? In general, was it months of redrafting and tweaking, or a solid week's worth of work?

-Ask for letters of recommendation (is it ever too early)?

-Finalize your list of programs?

-Reach out to POI?

-Begin revising your writing sample (if you did indeed revise)?

• I began my SOP in the summer before my application season -- about in early July, I think? It was a solid week's work to produce a document that I thought was pretty good, and then months of redrafting and tweaking after my readers saw it and went "lol nope." (Which is precisely the reaction you want them to have.) It went through multiple drafts with multiple readers, incorporating feedback from each and then starting the cycle over again. It never felt finished, really -- I think I probably made tweaks to it here and there for different programs, especially in terms of talking about fit (when I did, which wasn't always), right up until a couple deadlines -- but it had reached what would become its final form by, say, September/October or so.
• It is never too early to ask your referees for letters, and so if you know who it is you'll be using, you might as well send them an email today. If they aren't already helping you prepare your materials, they'll eventually want to see copies of your SOP and sample (perhaps in addition to other things), and they'll want to know about your list of programs -- a couple of my letter writers wrote different letters for different places, so it's nice to give them at least a ballpark idea of what sort of ones you're thinking. (Although, again, they might be the same people helping you decide that!)
• I applied to ten schools. The top, say, 7-8 of those were set by the spring of my junior year, in part just because there's a limited number of programs that are strong in OE, and because my advisers were very clear about what places warranted applications and what ones didn't. The last 2-3 were settled on by September.
• I didn't reach out to POI at all. Some people do, and if that's the sort of thing you're interested in, go for it! But it is most definitely not the norm in the humanities (none of the people I've talked to about it in my cohort did), not expected, and depending on how the process is set up in the department, has few benefits in terms of admissions. Where it might be useful is knowing if a prof you're interested in working with is retiring soon or something like that, but that's also the sort of thing your advisors/referees should be able to help you with, if they're as plugged into their/your field as they (ideally!) should be. But again, if that's you're thing, knock yourself out.
• My sample was a paper I wrote for a class the end of my Junior year, and I applied in the fall of my Senior year. I began revising it midsummer, and it went through three rounds of research/writing/revision with my advisor before all was said and done. It was finished by September, but I didn't do some of the length editing (*cough* and margin/spacing-playing) required for programs with different length limits until I started applying in the fall.

Hope that helps!

[sarabethke]

You know, I (like many of us) had great intentions for starting getting my materials together during the summer, but it didn't happen and it all worked out. You're only as behind as you can't handle being. I work great under pressure, so "behind" is very relative. 

I tried working on my SOP early because I knew it was super important, but I couldn't get it finished until my wonderful advisor set up a workshop so we could peer review one anothers'! There were actually about 8 of us in my program applying to PhD programs, so it was worth holding a small workshop for. We had one followup workshop to see how revisions went, and the whole process made that a lot easier! Even if I was terrified to show all my dreams to my peers on paper lol. That was done by probably mid-October.

My CV was pretty much done before I started, because of, like, an Intro to Grad Studies class, followed by a GTA application, and then an intro to teaching comp class. My advisor was pretty on top of making sure our CVs were ready to go long before applications for school or jobs. Always show your CV to someone because they will just fix it all for you instead of you having to guess if the format works or whatever. Actually one thing I did was find a prof from my school on academia.edu and used her CV as a template for mine. Worked beautifully.

Letters of recommendation--I didn't feel comfortable asking anyone to recommend me until I could give them my materials (SOP and CV pretty much), so that was another thing that added stress to getting my SOP done. I don't think letters are necessary to do super far in advance--I've had several professors come through for me on very short notice before with no problem. However, there was a girl I knew my first year who was applying for programs and though one of her recommenders was working on her recommendation months in advance, she didn't get it returned until kind of last minute and that was a lot of stress for the student. I made sure to ask by the beginning of November because I had a few December 1 deadlines.

***One thing to remember about letters of rec is sometimes you have to submit your application before the school will send a form to your recommenders, so do try to get everything you can done as early as possible so that profs don't have to upload something in a rush when it's already winter break or they're on sabbatical in France or something.

Luckily with my writing sample I'd already done a lot of revision before turning it in for a seminar the year before, so even though I agonized about doing further revision for months, I didn't end up changing it at all.

I finalized my list of schools I think by October for sure, possibly September. I wanted to have a good idea before taking the Subject test so I didn't waste money sending my results to places I wouldn't apply to. I think a couple did change though. I wouldn't completely resist applying to schools you're iffy about based on location because you can live anywhere for 5 years. I ultimately did choose based on location and stipend, but as long as there are faculty in your area of interest who are involved in your training, the program will be worth it.

I didn't contact any POIs despite my intentions. I'm shy and feel lame reaching out to important people I don't know! What I DID do though was find a list of grad students in the department, found someone who was working on things I was interested in, and contacted THEM about the program. That was actually extremely helpful, and I felt better able to trust what they had to say about the program, atmosphere, etc. 

Most of all, don't agonize that you're "behind"! Just get a little team together and knock this stuff out together! I had more fun with my MA cohort bonding over PhD application stress than I imagined, and it's so much better when you're not alone.

Edited June 26, 2016 by sarabethke

[echo449]

I decided to write something from scratch to apply with; I didn't have a draft ready until roughly Halloween. Because I took so long to get it done, none of my letter writers even saw the finished version of my sample, which I would revise daily. I didn't have a draft of my statement of purpose until Thanksgiving, but my letter writers were incredibly helpful and supportive during the week that I had to make it presentable. My advice is to not do what I did, cuz it almost killed me. I did, however, talk to my letter writers the summer before, making sure that they knew relatively early in the process that I was going to ask them for letters. 

[klader]

I second @sarabethke in paying attention to programs that require your application to be sent before the letters of recommendation can be submitted!! 3 of the 7 I applied to had this configuration, so I had to finish those applications by early/mid December so that my professors could submit their letters before they started break. It worked out because this kinda forced me to finish all the January deadline ones early, too, but it was added stress.

Here's a rough sketch of my timeline (I will elaborate more on it afterwsrds):

Summer before: lined up letter writers (informally - more of, "hey, will you write me one later?"), polished up CV's layout/design, dabbled with SoP

September - scheduled GRE, nothing else really. My classes were intense 

October - formally asked for letters, worked minimally on SoP, researched the heck out of schools (the hardest part!), started applications at schools (this is when I finalized my list) 

November - took GRE (ugh! Should have studied!), tackled SoP head-on with a prof and writing center folks (still didn't feel good with it, though), checked in with letter writers (and kept track with who submitted what where), met with prof and revised/expanded on writing sample (the hardest month!)

December - finished SoP at last possible moment for all applications (I still feel that I rushed all these because I was so exhausted and overwhelmed and wanted to get the apps in), tied bow on writing sample, cried, sent panicked emails to letter writers who had gone MIA, cried again, submitted all apps, cried again.

Generally speaking, I'd say that I procrastinated waaaay too much on my SoP and writing sample. Work on those ASAP and have anyone who can spare 5 minutes look them over. These are the most important things, and you want to make them perfect, especially when tailoring them to specific programs (and people in the programs).

Sometimes MA deadlines are set after PhD deadlines, so that might help you here. However, do double check, and plan to submit them earlier any way. I was at least happy I got them all in by 12/17 (I think), so I could enjoy the holidays without them looming over me.

Good luck!

 

ETA: This was for MA applications in comp/rhet

 

 

Edited June 28, 2016 by klader

[AP]

On 6/24/2016 at 1:00 PM, othersamantha said:

Hi all!

I'm writing today for some general advice about the application timeline-- I know that this varies person-to-person. I'm a notorious procrastinator and generally will leave things until the last minute unless I force myself to adhere to a schedule of some kind. I'll be applying for Fall 2017 admission, and just am trying to get a sense of how behind I likely already am!

For those who've applied in the past, when did you:

-Begin working on your SOP? When did you feel you were "finished" (if you ever did)? In general, was it months of redrafting and tweaking, or a solid week's worth of work? I decided to go to grad school by this time of the year and started sending e-mails to faculty. At the same time, I started a course for the GRE (I am international student so this test was not even near my horizon when in college). As I contacted professors, we held informal interviews via Skype or phone. 

-Ask for letters of recommendation (is it ever too early)? I don't think is ever early because professors want time to write. It is worse if you are late on this. I prepared my recommenders by sharing my aims in grad school, sending links to the departments I was applying, and also helping out with some guiding questions I found online (again, my international status meant my professors were not used to writing this type of letters for the North American readers)

-Finalize your list of programs? This is probably the most personal thing. You'll be done when the due dates have passed. Eg: I applied for five programs. The last one I applied just because the interview had gone well but I never thought I had any chances. I got in and accepted their offer. 

-Reach out to POI? Soon. 

-Begin revising your writing sample (if you did indeed revise)? First decide what to submit and of course you revise it. 

I've already taken my GRE (I'm planning on taking the subject test in September or October-- I've done some studying/flashcard making but it's sucking the soul out of me and I've decided it's not the most important thing anyway). I have professors who've written letters of recommendations for me in the past, and will be able to revise their previous letters for me, so I would like to give them time to add in relevant information about the work I did at the end of my senior year and what I have done in the year since graduating. What I'm most worried about is the SOP and revising my writing sample (I'm going to need to cut down my 15,000 word honors thesis to 15-20 pages) I cut down my 150-page thesis to 20. And translated into English. It is very doable (though a professor told me it was impossible and I should defer my application for the following year. Of course, I did not apply to his school). I guess I'm also a little nervous about finalizing my list of schools-- I find it really difficult to judge what caliber of programs I should be considering, so I'm hoping my advisor might be able to help me with that. Yes, but also reach out and keep your mind open. I'd suggest listing what things you definitely want in a program. In my case, I wanted a five year stipend and no teaching requirements in my first year. Several faculty understood my position and suggested I didn't apply to their (state) schools because they could not guarantee funding for five years for international students. I know other people that apply only to places in X region. So list things that are non-negotiable for you and this will help you trim your list or at least prioritze beyond the schools' prestige/name.

I realize there's no time like the present to get started on all of this, but just wanted to see what others' past experiences were like! Thanks in advance; hope you're all well! Best of luck to everyone working on applications right now!

Also, work out a plan backwards. If most due dates are, say, Dec 15th, by Dec 7th you should have all the materials ready. That means that by Dec 1st you should have all your letters submitted. That means that also by Dec 1st your SoP and writing sample should be ready so that you have time to proof read. And so on and so forth backwards in time. 

 

[Warelin]

As a side, most applicants don't contact a POI for English. Contacting a POI is much more common in the sciences than it is for the humanities.

[LeadersAsAnimals]

On 6/24/2016 at 1:00 PM, othersamantha said:

For those who've applied in the past, when did you:

-Begin working on your SOP? When did you feel you were "finished" (if you ever did)? In general, was it months of redrafting and tweaking, or a solid week's worth of work? For what it is worth, I drafted my SOP in about a week and a half. I revised it on my own and to the best of my ability. Once I felt I had a solid draft, I sent it to my thesis chair and two other professors who knew my work. I spent about a week working on their suggested revisions. So, in all, I probably spent about three weeks working on a draft. However, I tailored the end of my SOP to fit each program to which I applied, which added about a day per program. The bulk of my SOP remained unchanged, but the last section was highly specific about which professors I wanted to work with and why I wanted to work with them and was geared towards specific schools each submission. The keys to a good SOP for English in my opinion: show that you want to write, improve your writing, research, write some more, discuss your goals (to become a better writer), to publish (requires becoming a better writer), etc. You should really explain in great detail which of your strongest scholarly attributes make you a good fit for graduate studies and why you want to be in their program.

-Ask for letters of recommendation (is it ever too early)? I say the earlier you notify the referees the better. This will give them a chance to think about your career as a student and your work in any classes you have or had with them. Giving them more time allows them to be as detailed as possible in the letters. You won't see the letters because the schools will email a submission link to each referee. In lieu of asking for letters, just let them know you would like for them to write and submit one when the time comes, but you should definitely give them a timetable of when to expect the letter request.

-Finalize your list of programs? I also had trouble narrowing my list of schools. I knew I didn't want to spend $1,000 on applications so that helped narrow the number. From there, I looked around my area for various programs that fit my desired field of scholarship, which dramatically narrowed my list. Once I came up with a list of about ten schools and after extensive research about each one of them via their websites, I narrowed them by just how fitting my academic interests were with each program and with the faculty. I tried to find schools that had a few professors specifically and/or tangentially related to my field of interest. I also considered the cost to move and somewhat limited myself based on that. I didn't have a fortune at my disposal, so I knew I couldn't go too far across the country. I also considered my spouse's wishes when narrowing this list of schools. However, I think academic fit played the biggest role in determining my list.

-Reach out to POI? I reached out to one POI for one school, and it is not the school I am attending. All this did for my application was tell me not to include the professor's name in the section of my SOP that discusses with whom I would like to work because they are retiring. This can help get your foot in the door, but it really isn't going to hold much sway over their decision process. Reaching out doesn't allow them to know your body of work and your capabilities as a graduate student. The things they require in the application, however, do give them this information. Spend more time and energy on the SOP, writing sample, and GRE--the first two being the most important and the GRE being the least. I had a passable GRE score and was admitted; I only took it once to get into my MA program and recycled the scores for my PhD application. Your writing is what carries the most weight because it indicates your abilities, interests, etc.

-Begin revising your writing sample (if you did indeed revise)? Go ahead and begin revising/reworking your writing sample if it is not something that is already tailored, revised, tidied, or whatever. I had the fortune of being able to use a chapter from my MA thesis, so I didn't have to revise very much. I did read through the chapter a few times to catch any silly grammatical issues, but the argument stayed the same. Thus, I did more editing than revising. My dissertation plans are to expand my MA thesis, so it worked well to simply submit a chapter to show my depth of knowledge on the topic, to show the direction of my argument, and why I fit/want to work with the professors listed in the SOP. Try to tailor the end of the SOP to show you have knowledge of the work professors are doing in the department to which you are applying--especially and specifically those with which you want to work.

Sorry for the long-winded reply. Applying to graduate school is a process but isn't that bad if you schedule it out. Good luck!!

 

Edited June 28, 2016 by LeadersAsAnimals

[lesabendio]

On 6/24/2016 at 10:00 AM, othersamantha said:

Hi all!

I'm writing today for some general advice about the application timeline-- I know that this varies person-to-person. I'm a notorious procrastinator and generally will leave things until the last minute unless I force myself to adhere to a schedule of some kind. I'll be applying for Fall 2017 admission, and just am trying to get a sense of how behind I likely already am!

For those who've applied in the past, when did you:

-Begin working on your SOP? When did you feel you were "finished" (if you ever did)? In general, was it months of redrafting and tweaking, or a solid week's worth of work?

-Ask for letters of recommendation (is it ever too early)?

-Finalize your list of programs?

-Reach out to POI?

-Begin revising your writing sample (if you did indeed revise)?

I've already taken my GRE (I'm planning on taking the subject test in September or October-- I've done some studying/flashcard making but it's sucking the soul out of me and I've decided it's not the most important thing anyway). I have professors who've written letters of recommendations for me in the past, and will be able to revise their previous letters for me, so I would like to give them time to add in relevant information about the work I did at the end of my senior year and what I have done in the year since graduating. What I'm most worried about is the SOP and revising my writing sample (I'm going to need to cut down my 15,000 word honors thesis to 15-20 pages). I guess I'm also a little nervous about finalizing my list of schools-- I find it really difficult to judge what caliber of programs I should be considering, so I'm hoping my advisor might be able to help me with that.

I realize there's no time like the present to get started on all of this, but just wanted to see what others' past experiences were like! Thanks in advance; hope you're all well! Best of luck to everyone working on applications right now!

As many have said, I don't think reaching out to your POI is necessary for applying to English PhD programs. I didn't. It might be useful though if you have a specific vision of your graduate studies and know exactly who you want to work with.

I would focus your efforts first and foremost on revising your writing sample. As soon as I knew I was going to apply this past fall (around August), I sent a first shit draft of my writing sample (a totally revamped old undergrad thesis) to 10 different readers: graduate student friends from my alma mater, writerly, non-academic friends, and a trusted coworker. By sending it to a variety of different readers from different backgrounds, I was hoping to gauge the readability as well as the academic rigor of my language and initial arguments. Sending out your writing sample early also forces you into the revision process right out of the gate and gives you plenty of time to reconsider the approach, scope, and structure of your sample. Perhaps more importantly it also gives you time to process the ego bruising you'll probably receive from your readers' feedback. I think "getting over yourself" is one of the most important steps in the application process. Once you do, you can focus more of your energy on the actual nit-and-grit labor of the writing itself.

Shortly after sending out my writing sample, I drafted up a quick and dirty SOP. Before I started writing, I asked a few of my graduate student friends for the SOPs they used to get into their PhD programs in order to get an idea about what a successful SOP looks like. Although I didn't exactly use their examples as templates, I certainly broke down each SOP into their essential components and then rearranged and adapted them for my own purposes. If you can get your hands on a few examples of successful SOPs, I think they will definitely help you frame your own. That being said, the very first draft of my SOP was terrible, really cringeworthy, as one should be.

At this point, drafts of my writing sample and SOP complete, I asked my former professors for letters of rec. I didn't, however, just let them know of my intention to apply. I also attached copies of my writing sample, SOP, the best paper I wrote for one of their classes, my transcripts (highlighting which class(es) I took and the grade I received), and the list of schools I intended to apply to. I feel that giving your professors as much material to work with as possible makes it easier for them to write a personalized and unique letter. It also lets them know you're serious and well-prepared. Of course, I also asked for their feedback and for notes on my writing sample and SOP, which they happily provided. If possible, I would also arrange a time to visit them during their office hours to discuss all of your application materials and the list of programs you're interested in. In my case, I also needed to reintroduce myself to one professor who had difficulty remembering who I was as a student (it has been 6 years since I graduated). We ended up chatting for over 2 hours about her research interests, my research interests, and our mutual interest in martial arts training. It was a great way to put a face and personality to a random letter of rec request.

I finalized my shortlist of 6 PhD programs sometime in September when I emailed my former professors for letters of rec. I think it should be finished by the time you get around to asking for letters or shortly thereafter, so that your letter writers have a firm idea of how many letters they may have to submit and of what kind of programs you're interested in.

I made sure to have my generic SOP draft finished on December 7 and then tailored each SOP version a couple days in advance of submitting my applications. No, it never felt finished, and I agonized over every single detail, but eventually you're going to be up against a deadline that will force your hand. If I had to do it over again, I'd probably have each program-specific SOP version completed by December 7 just to give myself a little more tweaking time. 

I finished up my writing sample days before I submitted my first round of applications. Not a good idea. I felt terrible about it, and I came away thinking that my sample was the weakest part of my application. I felt doomed, but looking back I realize that involving so many different readers from the get-go and starting my revisions as early as possible strengthened my sample incrementally. Only in hindsight could I see how much stronger and more interesting my writing sample had become since I sent out that first shit draft to those 10 readers. So, yes, begin revising and drafting your writing sample and SOP as early as possible, even if you do a little here and a little there. You'd be surprised how much less stressful this way of working is.

I hope this account of my experiences can help you out. Best of luck in the coming application season! Feel free to PM if you have any other questions.

Edited June 29, 2016 by lesabendio

[AP]

On 6/28/2016 at 4:18 PM, Warelin said:

As a side, most applicants don't contact a POI for English. Contacting a POI is much more common in the sciences than it is for the humanities.

I'm in the humanities. I know people in other humanities disciplines (including English) who contacted faculty when applying. This is why I advised doing so. Of course, you know your field better than me so OP should take your point.

[mk-8]

sarabethke made a great point in that you're only behind as you can't manage. I, like everyone else, was going to finish all my application materials before the semester started (sans writing sample) so I could REALLY be ahead. 

I contacted letter writers in September, because all my applications were due in December. I talked to them frequently about it, too (because one was my boss and one was my senior seminar advisor). 

I didn't finish my SOP until like, November. I was super unmotivated and intimidated by it. Once I did have a draft, though, I sent it to EVERYBODY (professors, friends, family, anyone who would look at it). I never quite felt like I was finished with it, to be honest. I was tweaking it up until I submitted applications, but at some point you just have to stop thinking about it.

I contacted departments and such throughout the process. I wouldn't necessarily say POI, but department chairs and heads, as I had questions about their programs and the application. I found a mistake on one programs website and felt pretty cool for pointing it out ☺️

I finished my writing sample the day I submitted most of my applications. I submitted a week or so before the deadline, but still. I was writing my sample that semester as my senior seminar paper, so I knew it would be close. I made final edits and sent that sucker away. 

It's a stressful process. It shouldn't be, because you're just collecting materials and sending them away, but it is. Don't let it consume every second of your day, though. 

[Dr. Old Bill]

Yeah, when I was in the application cycle two years ago, I started my program research in late February, had my SOP and WS squared away by the end of July, and literally completed several applications on the day they first opened up. I was also in touch with POIs, and my letter-writers had all finished their letters by mid-November. I was truly on the ball. While I got into a great M.A. program that I'm very happy with, I wouldn't consider it a "successful" application cycle, despite all my advance preparation.

This time around, I have yet to even start really researching programs. A large part of that is because I've been working, taking graduate courses (including a summer course that I'm currently finishing up a 15-page paper for), moving, and...well...separating from my wife of seven years (don't worry, it was amicable etc.). So everything has been put off by necessity, yet I don't feel too concerned about it. I'm hoping to start my program research next week, and have already talked to my three letter-writers, and already have my probable WS (barring revisions). I'll be retaking the GRE subject test in September (yes, I know conventional wisdom here is to NOT retake it, but I'm doing it anyway), and will probably retake the general GRE at some point as well. At this point in my life, I just want to make sure all the t's are crossed and the i's are dotted. If I don't get into a Ph.D. program this time around, I suppose I'll have to think of a plan B...but who wants a plan B?

Long story short: @sarahbethke and @mk-8's advice is right on the money. There's no one way to navigate this process successfully. Whatever works best for you should work.

Edited July 10, 2016 by Wyatt's Terps

[boomah]

16 hours ago, Wyatt's Terps said:

and have already talked to my three letter-writers, 

Hi @Wyatt's Terps, just curious, are your three letter writers for this round from your MA program? If so, I was curious if you thought a year was sufficiently long for them to get to know you enough to write you a detailed rec letter (I really hope so, because I'm in the same situation--need to get three letters from my MA program).

[Dr. Old Bill]

23 minutes ago, boomah said:

Hi @Wyatt's Terps, just curious, are your three letter writers for this round from your MA program? If so, I was curious if you thought a year was sufficiently long for them to get to know you enough to write you a detailed rec letter (I really hope so, because I'm in the same situation--need to get three letters from my MA program).

Oh, most definitely. One of my letter-writers is my advisor, and she helped me get a plum GAship in the medieval / early modern field committee. I actually got an A- in her course, which vexed me greatly, but she assured me that she gives most students in that course an A-. In other words, she's simply a hard grader. Beyond that, she was more than happy to write on my behalf. Another letter-writer is a professor I had in the fall, and we have a great rapport. He's sort of an "up-and-comer" in my field, and had me send him the paper I will be using as my writing sample. And the final letter writer is the professor whose class fostered that writing sample in the first place...and the type of research and specialization she does is closely aligned with my own probable interests, and happens to be a fairly new line of scholarship. I have made a point of being open and friendly with all three professors (well, all of my professors period), and I have no doubt that all of them can speak confidently about my writing, my personality, and my suitability as an academic.

Not to get off topic, but if I were to give advice to anyone starting out in a graduate program, it would be to speak up, be friendly, make a good impression, and get noticed -- not in an obnoxious way, but simply as an active and engaged participant. If a professor asks a question in class, or puts something out for discussion, be the person who takes him/her up on it if the post-question pause starts to linger. Professors appreciate that, and it makes a good impression. I'm sure a great many quiet students have gone on to do great things, but in my experience, the more actively engaged you are, the more a professor will want to work with you and help you.

 

Edited July 11, 2016 by Wyatt's Terps

[AnimeChic101!]

On 7/11/2016 at 8:38 AM, Wyatt's Terps said:

 

Not to get off topic, but if I were to give advice to anyone starting out in a graduate program, it would be to speak up, be friendly, make a good impression, and get noticed -- not in an obnoxious way, but simply as an active and engaged participant.

 

I can't stress this point enough. I wish that I had done this when I entered my MA program, but at least I know exactly what I'll have to do when I'm in a PhD program. In a MA program, you have such a little amount of time to get to know your professors. You really need to hit the ground running. It took me two semesters (into a 3 semester program) to figure out what professors I should work with. Not everything is on a faculty bio, so make sure to as around and see who you should really be working with.

[othersamantha]

 Hi all! I'm the OP of this post, and I just wanted to (very belatedly) thank you all for your advice. It really has been extremely helpful and has definitely made me feel (ever so slightly) more relaxed about this whole process.

I've just finished my first draft of my SOP. I've been working on it for about a month here and there, and I'm not especially happy with it, but I think at this point it's just time to send it off to my letter writers and get feedback.

For the SOP: Did you tend to focus more on the work you've already done, or the work you'd like to do in future? For example, one of my letter writers told me that the goal of the SOP is to tell a narrative about myself as a researcher and writer. I wrote a 15,000 word thesis as a senior, and talk about that process and my research in my current draft of my statement, but I feel that I'm not left with a lot of room to discuss my future direction. Do you think committees are more interested in you proving that you can do the work (past experiences) or spending a big number of words on prospective faculty partnerships, specific lines of research, etc?

Finally, and this may seem like a silly question, but I'm having trouble striking a balance here-- to what extent did you "flatter" the program to which you are applying? I understand that it's obviously in my best interests to express a true interest in a program and show why I am a good fit for their faculty/methodology/approach, but there just doesn't seem to be enough space for "X program's commitment to training graduate students to teach is impressive..."  or "Y's exceptional faculty are..." etc. Basically, is it more important to sell myself to the committee, or to stroke the egos of readers?

Thank you all so very much! I wish you the best of luck as we get into the last couple of months!

Edited September 29, 2016 by othersamantha
grammar

[Ramus]

16 hours ago, othersamantha said:

 For the SOP: Did you tend to focus more on the work you've already done, or the work you'd like to do in future?... Do you think committees are more interested in you proving that you can do the work (past experiences) or spending a big number of words on prospective faculty partnerships, specific lines of research, etc?

I split it fifty-fiftyish. You want to prove you've acquired the skills necessary to succeed in graduate school, drawing on past experiences teaching and/or researching. You also should demonstrates how this past work could be developed. In part, this indicates that you've not exhausted all research avenues you're interested in. It's also about showing you know how to think like a graduate student—that is, you can speculate on how your first stab at a project (seminar paper, capstone project, etc.) can potentially be part of a larger project, like a dissertation. 

16 hours ago, othersamantha said:

 ...or spending a big number of words on prospective faculty partnerships, specific lines of research, etc?

I would keep this to a minimum. You should make it clear why you're applying to a particular program, though namedropping particular scholars always seems a little phony. Anyone can scan a faculty member's department page, so saying you want to work with so-and-so because they do gender and Shakespeare will probably will come off as an empty gesture. The exception to this rule is if you've actually done substantial work in your POI's area of research and have read their work. In that case, you might say something like, so-and-so's work helped me articulate my reading of so-and-so. But even in that scenario, I'd keep the namedropping and waxing on imagined faculty partnerships to a minimum.

16 hours ago, othersamantha said:

Finally, and this may seem like a silly question, but I'm having trouble striking a balance here-- to what extent did you "flatter" the program to which you are applying? I understand that it's obviously in my best interests to express a true interest in a program and show why I am a good fit for their faculty/methodology/approach, but there just doesn't seem to be enough space for "X program's commitment to training graduate students to teach is impressive..."  or "Y's exceptional faculty are..." etc. Basically, is it more important to sell myself to the committee, or to stroke the egos of readers?

It's not a silly question, in part because so many people are inclined to take this approach—I certainly did the first time I applied to programs. But I think it's a bad idea for a couple of reasons. First, it comes off as grade-A bullshit. Exceptional programs and faculty already know they're exceptional; mediocre ones know they're mediocre. Some applicant telling them they're great either tells them something they already know, or it tells them something they know to be crap (or at least not entirely true). As a general rule, it's best to stay away from fawning adjectives in the SOP ("impressive," "exceptional," "superb," etc.) 

Second, I think this approach can very easily backfire by inadvertently positioning you in the role of the program's (or individual professor's) judge. For example, say you were to say something like, "Reading over Dr. So-and-So's work, I've was impressed with his readings of The Tempest." That'd be no good, since it comes across as though you have the authority to appraise an expert's work. Which, as someone straight out of a BA program, you don't.

Instead of this approach, I'd suggest you show why you're applying to a program by explaining how a program's resources or faculty can help you pursue the kind of research you want to do.

[othersamantha]

25 minutes ago, Ramus said:

It's not a silly question, in part because so many people are inclined to take this approach—I certainly did the first time I applied to programs. But I think it's a bad idea for a couple of reasons. First, it comes off as grade-A bullshit. Exceptional programs and faculty already know they're exceptional; mediocre ones know they're mediocre. Some applicant telling them they're great either tells them something they already know, or it tells them something they know to be crap (or at least not entirely true). As a general rule, it's best to stay away from fawning adjectives in the SOP ("impressive," "exceptional," "superb," etc.) 

Second, I think this approach can very easily backfire by inadvertently positioning you in the role of the program's (or individual professor's) judge. For example, say you were to say something like, "Reading over Dr. So-and-So's work, I've was impressed with his readings of The Tempest." That'd be no good, since it comes across as though you have the authority to appraise an expert's work. Which, as someone straight out of a BA program, you don't.

Instead of this approach, I'd suggest you show why you're applying to a program by explaining how a program's resources or faculty can help you pursue the kind of research you want to do.

Thank you for making these excellent points. I tend to agree with you that those types of statements rarely read as genuine, even if they are meant to be so. I was, however, under the impression that many programs want you to indicate faculty you'd be interested in working with by name, even if they're not someone you're already particularly familiar with. Do you think it would be sufficient to make a statement such as, "I'm particularly interested in working with the early modernists for reasons x, y, z" without specifically naming each prospective mentor and referencing their work? I'd love to hear more about your/others' thoughts on "namedropping," since I agree that it's something that's a bit awkward to write, but which I thought was more or less requisite.

[avflinsch]

I am coming from a completely different area, so take this as my experience, and possibly not what you should do...

I am finishing my masters now, and will be applying to the PhD program for Fall 2017. The program requires one of a specific list of masters degrees before applying.

 -Begin working on your SOP? When did you feel you were "finished" (if you ever did)? In general, was it months of redrafting and tweaking, or a solid week's worth of work?
 For my undergrad -> masters, I wrote most of it in a weekend, let it sit for a week, then revised it twice. After the second revision, I sent it to a few trusted friends, and had them look it over, made a few tweaks then sent it in.
 
 For my masters -> PhD, I took the undergrad->masters version and started to make changes. Currently making changes (as to what should be included) based on suggestions by prospective LOR writers

-Ask for letters of recommendation (is it ever too early)?
undergrad -> masters, the program required a minimum of 2, a maximum of 3 to be included in the admission packet. Long story, but I had 3 in the packet, and 2 unsolicited letters sent in after the packet was submitted.

Masters -> PhD, the program requires 3, no more, no less.
letter #1 - first day of class this semester, asked the professor for a letter, since he knew me from prior classes as an undergrad, he said he would be happy to do so, and stated that he was on the adcom. He also let me know that he would be retiring in May 2018 (which I took as code to mean, don't reference him as a POI). He asked for me to send him a reminder when I submit the application - the application process automatically sends the reminder.

letter #2 - saw prof in parking lot, we were both in a hurry, asked if I could meet up with him later in the week. Met with him later the following week, he agreed and gave me quite a bit of advice and insight on how the admission process worked. He also asked about what kind of funding I would be looking for (see below), and hinted at not letting him know ahead of time if he was a POI, but to specifically list POIs in the SOP.

letter #3 - still trying to figure out who to ask. I am leaning towards someone who has been in the department for a while but is outside of my area of interest, as I haven't had any classroom contact with others in my area of interest.

-Finalize your list of programs?
I am only applying to a single program, so nothing to finalize.
This is unusual, but there are specific reasons -
I am a full time employee of the university, so I get 100% tuition assistance (or did until my last pay increase, now it is only 50%). This obviously limits the amount of funding that I would require. Looking at what the past history has been for the 100%/50% cutoff changes, compared to pay increases, I will probably need to pay 50% every other year.

-Reach out to POI?
See LORs above. One is retiring, so he is not an option, the other hinted that he would not want to know ahead of time. This may just be the culture within the department, other folks I know within the same university reached out to their POIs.

-Begin revising your writing sample (if you did indeed revise)?
No writing sample is required for this program at submission time. LOR #2 indicated that they somewhat lean towards applicants who had some involvement with the department (undergrad or masters) - and not to stress out too much on the application. My assumption is that they already have my writing samples. I know that one of my undergrad papers is used as an example for one the corresponding course within masters program, so if one were required, I would just submit that one (or one of the followup papers that hinged on it)

 

[Caien]

3 hours ago, Ramus said:

 I would keep this to a minimum. You should make it clear why you're applying to a particular program, though namedropping particular scholars always seems a little phony. Anyone can scan a faculty member's department page, so saying you want to work with so-and-so because they do gender and Shakespeare will probably will come off as an empty gesture. The exception to this rule is if you've actually done substantial work in your POI's area of research and have read their work. In that case, you might say something like, so-and-so's work helped me articulate my reading of so-and-so. But even in that scenario, I'd keep the namedropping and waxing on imagined faculty partnerships to a minimum.

...Instead of this approach, I'd suggest you show why you're applying to a program by explaining how a program's resources or faculty can help you pursue the kind of research you want to do.

Can you clarify what you mean by 'show' here?

Some programs do require you to name faculty, but in my experience it isn't really feasible to limit your applications to only schools with faculty whose work you were previously familiar, if only for practical reasons like funding etc. I hate the namedropping thing too, and am trying to figure out a way around it, and my professors have told me to name 2-3 faculty at every school, in case one retires/takes another job etc.

[Ramus]

54 minutes ago, Caien said:

Can you clarify what you mean by 'show' here?

By "showing," I mean provide concrete, precise, and specific examples of what the program / location can do for your research. For example, when I was applying to Ohio State, I referred to specific holdings in their rare book library, the school's relationship with the Folger Library in DC, and the early modern reading and dissertation groups on campus. When it came to individual faculty members, I did mention a couple of the Renaissance faculty, but I did so in a way that proved an actual familiarity with their work. Whereas in my first application cycle I said stuff like, "Alan Farmer's work on the history of the book has been fascinating to read," the second time around I wrote something like, "In my MA program, I used Alan Farmer's DEEP database to contextualize Milton's first publication alongside other Caroline masques. Having realized the affordances of large scale comparative work, I can imagine myself expanding this project, working with Dr. Farmer to chart how the material forms of printed plays evolved over the seventeenth-century." The difference between the two is more than just one of length. The first only proves I read the professor's faculty page; the second proves actual familiarity with the dude's work and an understanding of how the guy's presence in the department could benefit me. Note, too, that the second response isn't sycophantic, nor does it need to be, since it has substance (specific examples) undergirding it.

1 hour ago, Caien said:

Some programs do require you to name faculty, but in my experience it isn't really feasible to limit your applications to only schools with faculty whose work you were previously familiar, if only for practical reasons like funding etc. I hate the namedropping thing too, and am trying to figure out a way around it, and my professors have told me to name 2-3 faculty at every school, in case one retires/takes another job etc.

I understand what you're saying about not wanting to limit yourself to programs with people whose work you know. However, I really think it's to your advantage to read recent work—a single article, even—written by someone you might be working with. If you read just one essay by one person at each of your schools, you'd already be much better off than you would be if you didn't have any knowledge of the faculty members' specialities (and thus had to result to vacuous ass-kissing). 

In the event that you can't familiarize yourself with faculty members' work, you might look for alternative reasons for why you're applying to the programs you are. (Doing so may even reinforce your decision to apply.) I've already listed a few of the reasons I chose to apply to my grad program, but I could have listed others: opportunities for genuinely interdisciplinary work; the host of graduate workshops directed by visiting scholars; the various lectures series and the informal get-togethers with big-shot scholars after them; conference support; opportunities for dissertation research funding....you get the picture. That stuff isn't irrelevant to an SOP, in part because many programs explicitly state they're considering you as a potential addition to the larger department and university communities, not as a prospective research machine in your sub-sub-subfield. 

 

[Caien]

1 hour ago, Ramus said:

By "showing," I mean provide concrete, precise, and specific examples of what the program / location can do for your research. For example, when I was applying to Ohio State, I referred to specific holdings in their rare book library, the school's relationship with the Folger Library in DC, and the early modern reading and dissertation groups on campus. When it came to individual faculty members, I did mention a couple of the Renaissance faculty, but I did so in a way that proved an actual familiarity with their work. Whereas in my first application cycle I said stuff like, "Alan Farmer's work on the history of the book has been fascinating to read," the second time around I wrote something like, "In my MA program, I used Alan Farmer's DEEP database to contextualize Milton's first publication alongside other Caroline masques. Having realized the affordances of large scale comparative work, I can imagine myself expanding this project, working with Dr. Farmer to chart how the material forms of printed plays evolved over the seventeenth-century." The difference between the two is more than just one of length. The first only proves I read the professor's faculty page; the second proves actual familiarity with the dude's work and an understanding of how the guy's presence in the department could benefit me. Note, too, that the second response isn't sycophantic, nor does it need to be, since it has substance (specific examples) undergirding it.

I understand what you're saying about not wanting to limit yourself to programs with people whose work you know. However, I really think it's to your advantage to read recent work—a single article, even—written by someone you might be working with. If you read just one essay by one person at each of your schools, you'd already be much better off than you would be if you didn't have any knowledge of the faculty members' specialities (and thus had to result to vacuous ass-kissing). 

In the event that you can't familiarize yourself with faculty members' work, you might look for alternative reasons for why you're applying to the programs you are. (Doing so may even reinforce your decision to apply.) I've already listed a few of the reasons I chose to apply to my grad program, but I could have listed others: opportunities for genuinely interdisciplinary work; the host of graduate workshops directed by visiting scholars; the various lectures series and the informal get-togethers with big-shot scholars after them; conference support; opportunities for dissertation research funding....you get the picture. That stuff isn't irrelevant to an SOP, in part because many programs explicitly state they're considering you as a potential addition to the larger department and university communities, not as a prospective research machine in your sub-sub-subfield. 

 

This is all great advice Ramus, thank you!

[Dr. Old Bill]

Excellent, pertinent advice as always, @Ramus. One quick follow-up question: do you think it is worthwhile to mention teaching experience / teaching interest? I recognize that one's research is what usually gets an adcom's interest, but is it worthwhile to mention my legitimate love of teaching, or is that too irrelevant to an SOP?

[Ramus]

1 hour ago, Wyatt's Terps said:

Excellent, pertinent advice as always, @Ramus. One quick follow-up question: do you think it is worthwhile to mention teaching experience / teaching interest? I recognize that one's research is what usually gets an adcom's interest, but is it worthwhile to mention my legitimate love of teaching, or is that too irrelevant to an SOP?

I'm of two minds on this one. On the one hand, it might not hurt if you mention it in applications for non-top-fifteen schools where you'll teach more and varied classes. In your case, @Wyatt's Terps, your apps to UNC, OSU, UMD, and Alabama might benefit from acknowledging your teaching experience. If nothing else, it would indicate to adcomms that you're not going to resent the amount of teaching you'll have to do in their programs. (NB: Teaching references in your SOPs for UPenn, UC, and Yale probably wouldn't get you very far, since those places train their students to be a world-class researchers, not teachers.)

On the other hand, I'm worried the teaching nod can dip into the lingo of the weepy teaching statement (Cf. The Professor Is In's blog entry on the subject). Programs don't want to hear about the "joy"  or "pleasure" we get out of teaching, not only because those are trite descriptions but also because it should go without saying; if you can't at least imagine yourself enjoying teaching, then you're probably not going to apply to graduate programs in English. Also, fairly or not, if your reference to teaching has a whiff of emotionalism, you might get branded as not serious enough for PhD work, or at least unaware of the purpose of doctoral training. 

Personally, I don't think the risk of talking about teaching is worth the reward, though I can certainly imagine it being done well. If you do end up including a bit about teaching, I'd stick with specifics: what you've taught, what the experience involved, and, looking forward, what about the teaching situation at University X attracts you to their program (opportunities to teach unusual classes, classes in pedagogy, etc.)