Applying for Fall 2011

[BachRocksMySocks]

Ethnomusicology.

Ethno is though. Most programs can only afford to accept one ethnomusicologist a year.

[Melchior]

Most one-year masters programs in the humanities are cash cows for Universities; they fund the Ph.D. student fellowships and provide cookies and soda for the Southeast Asian Transgender Film Club's bimonthly movie screenings, etc.

They don't look great on paper and don't usually do much for you unless you're trying to get into a Ph.D. program and you need another year of "finishing school" in order to try to make yourself more attractive.

Don't get a one year masters degree unless it's a technical program like a MA in teaching. At least by the end of that program you'll have some sort of certification that allows you to receive training for a specific type of profession, rather than just doing another year of college...

I have had professors and grad student friends who have done an MPhil in the UK or an MA at a US school before doing a PhD. It is not unattractive on a CV. Please don't make blanket statements about other people's choices about how to pursue their education.

Edited March 10, 2011 by Melchior

[BachRocksMySocks]

I have had professors and grad student friends who have done an MPhil in the UK or an MA at a US school before doing a PhD. It is not unattractive on a CV. Please don't make blanket statements about other people's choices about how to pursue their education.

Yes, you are correct - it's good "before doing a PhD." That is why I said they "don't usually do much for you UNLESS you're trying to get into a Ph.D. program." So it seems that we actually agree. If you're looking to enter the job market outside of the academy, a 1 year MA or MPhil in the humanities will help some, but mainly will serve to make you a more attractive PhD candidate. A more technical program, such as Music Education, Music Performance, Music Therapy, etc, other other more technical degree in the humanities is more professionally attractive AND can also help you get into a PhD program - if that is your goal.

Also, I didn't say it's "unattractive," I just said, it doesn't look "great." Not "great" if you are comparing your CV to someone who has a REALLY great CV, and who has committed to a longer MA program which afforded them further academic and professional development. I think the person who posted the question about the "fast track" was given an option between finishing the MA in one year or two. I would suggest doing it in two, if possible, to allow for more personal growth. There's only so much growing one can do in a year.

But, on the real... a lot of top institutions (Ivies, Ivy +, McGill, the British institutions) see a 1 year degree as just what I said, "finishing school." I've even heard music professors at Yale, MIT, Southampton, and other institutions use that phrase or similar ones. Especially since most 1 year masters programs are not funded, they understand that the students who enroll in them do so because they can either a) afford to do so, or don't mind another $40,000 in student loans.

Sadly, the institution where I work (one of the world's top 10) has a popular 1 year master program and I know people who have gone through it and been disappointed. Several of them have hoped that upon completion, the would be offered a PhD fellowship at the *same* institution, only to be denied admissions.

[composser]

I'm going pretty crazy right now waiting for funding from McGill, apparently I'm "being considered for a fellowship"... but this obviously isn't a guarantee. I'll definitely be applying for TA positions next week. I'm honestly so excited to potentially live in montreal! It's a great city.

Hi Shachey, They put all accepted candidates on a wait-list for excellence fellowships. Me and an other friend are both on that as well

The real questions are two: What fellowship, and what number on the wait-list are we? That they don't say...

But yes, 15th March is the time they open up TA applications

[Melchior]

Yes, you are correct - it's good "before doing a PhD." That is why I said they "don't usually do much for you UNLESS you're trying to get into a Ph.D. program." So it seems that we actually agree. If you're looking to enter the job market outside of the academy, a 1 year MA or MPhil in the humanities will help some, but mainly will serve to make you a more attractive PhD candidate. A more technical program, such as Music Education, Music Performance, Music Therapy, etc, other other more technical degree in the humanities is more professionally attractive AND can also help you get into a PhD program - if that is your goal.

Just to clarify, an MA is not the same thing as an MPhil. They are two completely different degrees and should not be compared to each other.

The all-mighty Wikipedia can tell us the differences: http://en.wikipedia....ster%27s_degree

vs. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MPhil

(I know that the DGS at Yale did an MPhil (and a DPhil) at Oxford, as did a new prof at Cornell (just the MSt, I think, and then a PhD in California), as did one of the music history profs at Columbia, and I'm sure there are a ton of others of whom I'm not aware).

Also, I didn't say it's "unattractive," I just said, it doesn't look "great." Not "great" if you are comparing your CV to someone who has a REALLY great CV, and who has committed to a longer MA program which afforded them further academic and professional development. I think the person who posted the question about the "fast track" was given an option between finishing the MA in one year or two. I would suggest doing it in two, if possible, to allow for more personal growth. There's only so much growing one can do in a year.

But, on the real... a lot of top institutions (Ivies, Ivy +, McGill, the British institutions) see a 1 year degree as just what I said, "finishing school." I've even heard music professors at Yale, MIT, Southampton, and other institutions use that phrase or similar ones. Especially since most 1 year masters programs are not funded, they understand that the students who enroll in them do so because they can either a) afford to do so, or don't mind another $40,000 in student loans.

I don't know much about doing an MA program, but it seems to me that because a fair number of PhD students at my university come in with an MA from somewhere else, doing an MA isn't the worst thing in the world. You keep on contradicting yourself which is why I'm getting confused. On the one hand, you say that doing an MA will help your application for a PhD program. But on the "real," you say that profs just see it as finishing school and really isn't that great. There are also a lot of other reasons why someone might choose to enroll in an MA program (certainly in an MPhil program) than the two you gave. Personally, I chose to apply to only MPhil and MMus programs in the UK this year for the following reasons:

a) there is a very specific project I wanted to do and there are a few people at a few universities in the UK who would be perfect advisers. I couldn't even do the project in the US.

b ) I wanted to do more coursework because I wanted to learn more about my discipline.

c) I wanted the experience of writing a dissertation before having to write a doctoral dissertation.

d) I wanted to spend some time in the UK where my family lives.

e) I wanted to have the opportunity to take advantage of the resources at one of the best universities in the world (Oxford or Cambridge).

f) I wanted to be able to really take advantage of being in school somewhere near enough to Germany so that I can do research on my MPhil project there relatively easily.

g) I wanted to have a bit of time (in a shorter academic program and just having time off to do other research) before going into a PhD program.

So, there are a lot of reasons why someone might choose to do a one or two-year program instead of doing a PhD.

Sadly, the institution where I work (one of the world's top 10) has a popular 1 year master program and I know people who have gone through it and been disappointed. Several of them have hoped that upon completion, the would be offered a PhD fellowship at the *same* institution, only to be denied admissions.

You also keep on saying, "the institution where I work (one of the world's top 10)," which is not really a basis for passing judgement on how other people choose to pursue their education. All it means it that you go to a good school. I go to one of the world's top 10 universities, too, but all that means is that I know some things about my school, but I don't know that much -- I'm not on faculty or a dean or something.

[BachRocksMySocks]

Just to clarify, an MA is not the same thing as an MPhil. They are two completely different degrees and should not be compared to each other.

The all-mighty Wikipedia can tell us the differences: http://en.wikipedia....ster%27s_degree

vs. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MPhil

(I know that the DGS at Yale did an MPhil (and a DPhil) at Oxford, as did a new prof at Cornell (just the MSt, I think, and then a PhD in California), as did one of the music history profs at Columbia, and I'm sure there are a ton of others of whom I'm not aware).

I don't know much about doing an MA program, but it seems to me that because a fair number of PhD students at my university come in with an MA from somewhere else, doing an MA isn't the worst thing in the world. You keep on contradicting yourself which is why I'm getting confused. On the one hand, you say that doing an MA will help your application for a PhD program. But on the "real," you say that profs just see it as finishing school and really isn't that great. There are also a lot of other reasons why someone might choose to enroll in an MA program (certainly in an MPhil program) than the two you gave. Personally, I chose to apply to only MPhil and MMus programs in the UK this year for the following reasons:

a) there is a very specific project I wanted to do and there are a few people at a few universities in the UK who would be perfect advisers. I couldn't even do the project in the US.

b ) I wanted to do more coursework because I wanted to learn more about my discipline.

c) I wanted the experience of writing a dissertation before having to write a doctoral dissertation.

d) I wanted to spend some time in the UK where my family lives.

e) I wanted to have the opportunity to take advantage of the resources at one of the best universities in the world (Oxford or Cambridge).

f) I wanted to be able to really take advantage of being in school somewhere near enough to Germany so that I can do research on my MPhil project there relatively easily.

g) I wanted to have a bit of time (in a shorter academic program and just having time off to do other research) before going into a PhD program.

So, there are a lot of reasons why someone might choose to do a one or two-year program instead of doing a PhD.

You also keep on saying, "the institution where I work (one of the world's top 10)," which is not really a basis for passing judgement on how other people choose to pursue their education. All it means it that you go to a good school. I go to one of the world's top 10 universities, too, but all that means is that I know some things about my school, but I don't know that much -- I'm not on faculty or a dean or something.

Melchior - I don't "go to a good school." I am a professional musicologist who works as a full time, salaried researcher (with benefits) at a good school. There's a difference.

[snes]

Melchior - I don't "go to a good school." I am a professional musicologist who works as a full time, salaried researcher (with benefits) at a good school. There's a difference.

HOW DID YOU GET THIS JOB. I assume you have a Master's.

[Melchior]

Melchior - I don't "go to a good school." I am a professional musicologist who works as a full time, salaried researcher (with benefits) at a good school. There's a difference.

And you expect me to know this from an online forum, how? Everyone else in here is a student.

[shachey]

Hi Shachey, They put all accepted candidates on a wait-list for excellence fellowships. Me and an other friend are both on that as well

The real questions are two: What fellowship, and what number on the wait-list are we? That they don't say...

But yes, 15th March is the time they open up TA applications

I know right??? It would be nice to have a guaranteeee of funding rather than everyone being shoved onto a wait list. Are you applying for composition?? I already have TA experience so I'm hoping that is beneficial in my application. I'd much rather have that as a job then have to search for some part time work selling clothing or making food *shudder*. I know that in a lot of Canadian universities (especially the one I'm currently attending) there is a shift towards one full year masters and course-based over thesis. It makes sense to fast track the masters if you're planning on heading straight into the PhD program.

[composser]

I know right??? It would be nice to have a guaranteeee of funding rather than everyone being shoved onto a wait list. Are you applying for composition?? I already have TA experience so I'm hoping that is beneficial in my application. I'd much rather have that as a job then have to search for some part time work selling clothing or making food *shudder*. I know that in a lot of Canadian universities (especially the one I'm currently attending) there is a shift towards one full year masters and course-based over thesis. It makes sense to fast track the masters if you're planning on heading straight into the PhD program.

Yes Composition. Well you have it better in terms of costs. I'm considered international and although school + living is cheaper than in the states, I still can't afford the $27.000 /year (all including). It's such a desperate situation for students all over the world... a lot of places have reduced funds for music in the past few years to a minimum.

Some programs where I applied were accepting only one student. How do you even choose who's the best in that case? I get the sense that as students we are trying to squeeze as much as we can out of a system that is slowly degenerating. Good schools in the states have gone in the 50.000$ and their costs keep increasing. Ridiculous... And yet going to Graduate School seems to be the only way to succeed in real life at the moment. Arrgh so few options...

Anyways getting back to Mcgill, I wish you the best. I'll try to fight myself if I can get some funding. Crossing fingers.

Edited March 11, 2011 by composser

[musichistorygeek]

Most one-year masters programs in the humanities are cash cows for Universities; they fund the Ph.D. student fellowships and provide cookies and soda for the Southeast Asian Transgender Film Club's bimonthly movie screenings, etc.

They don't look great on paper and don't usually do much for you unless you're trying to get into a Ph.D. program and you need another year of "finishing school" in order to try to make yourself more attractive.

Don't get a one year masters degree unless it's a technical program like a MA in teaching. At least by the end of that program you'll have some sort of certification that allows you to receive training for a specific type of profession, rather than just doing another year of college...

Just adding that I would love to go to a school with a Southeast Asian Transgender Film Club, even if they make me buy cookies and soda...

[shachey]

Yes Composition. Well you have it better in terms of costs. I'm considered international and although school + living is cheaper than in the states, I still can't afford the $27.000 /year (all including). It's such a desperate situation for students all over the world... a lot of places have reduced funds for music in the past few years to a minimum.

Some programs where I applied were accepting only one student. How do you even choose who's the best in that case? I get the sense that as students we are trying to squeeze as much as we can out of a system that is slowly degenerating. Good schools in the states have gone in the 50.000$ and their costs keep increasing. Ridiculous... And yet going to Graduate School seems to be the only way to succeed in real life at the moment. Arrgh so few options...

Anyways getting back to Mcgill, I wish you the best. I'll try to fight myself if I can get some funding. Crossing fingers.

Oh of course I realize that I won't have to face the international student fees, thankfully... which is part of the reason I wanted to study in Canada... and because of who works at McGill... It's so hard to make a decision, I have a much better financial offer from another school, but it isn't really where I want to go. I'll be happy with the program next year regardless of how poor I'll be hahah.

Yes hopefully we're both able to make a decision we're happy with! Honestly money is the smallest motivation when it comes to choosing where I want to go, it would just be very nice if I could get some sort of funding.... Have you heard anything about applying to TA positions yet?

[Tex]

Has anybody heard from UNC? Looks like there was one acceptance for musicology in early February, but anybody else? From past years it looks like they send out rejections in late February , but I haven't heard anything.

Edited March 16, 2011 by Tex

[snes]

Didn't apply to UNC, unfortch. Anybody heard from NYU GSAS (I'm on the waitlist, please say no! lol) or NYU Steinhardt (Music Tech master's)?

[Ayiti]

Didn't apply to UNC, unfortch. Anybody heard from NYU GSAS (I'm on the waitlist, please say no! lol) or NYU Steinhardt (Music Tech master's)?

I think at this point the institutions that haven't sent out their rejection letters are waiting to hear back from the acceptances they've already extended. I would imagine that they are waiting to make sure they don't run through their entire accept/waitlist list before they finalize things with a rejection. Of course, this is also the point where people have to make decisions between one place and another, so I wouldn't be suprised if the letters didn't come until after the 15th.

[lizthesmith]

I haven't heard anything from NYU Steinhardt Music Tech Masters. But then again, I haven't seen anyone online that has yet.

[composerette]

Didn't apply to UNC, unfortch. Anybody heard from NYU GSAS (I'm on the waitlist, please say no! lol) or NYU Steinhardt (Music Tech master's)?

I, too, am on the NYU GSAS waitlist (but for composition). Unfortunately I get a very strong sense that it is the same as a rejection....

[composerette]

Oh of course I realize that I won't have to face the international student fees, thankfully... which is part of the reason I wanted to study in Canada... and because of who works at McGill... It's so hard to make a decision, I have a much better financial offer from another school, but it isn't really where I want to go. I'll be happy with the program next year regardless of how poor I'll be hahah.

Yes hopefully we're both able to make a decision we're happy with! Honestly money is the smallest motivation when it comes to choosing where I want to go, it would just be very nice if I could get some sort of funding.... Have you heard anything about applying to TA positions yet?

The McGill TA positions opened up on March 15. The applications are due April 15. You can see the postings here: http://www.mcgill.ca/music/current-students/graduate/job-postings-0 These spots are competitive and I know some current students who have never had any TA positions despite applying every year - a lot of it has to do with your financial status - if you get a lot of fellowships from the university you are less likely to get a TA position. At the Master's level you can receive TA spots for a maximum of 5 terms.

[starbreeze89]

I haven't heard anything from NYU Steinhardt Music Tech Masters. But then again, I haven't seen anyone online that has yet.

I sent them an email asking when we should expect to hear. They told me that it would most likely be early April....

[ir720]

My husband was accepted to UBC MA Music Theory yesterday (via email).

Congrats to everyone!!

[musichistorygeek]

Has anyone heard anything regarding funding from UW-Madison? (I wouldn't be surprised at all if there isn't any, especially for MA students, but I'm still curious...)

[JSK]

Has anyone heard anything regarding funding from UW-Madison? (I wouldn't be surprised at all if there isn't any, especially for MA students, but I'm still curious...)

I was in contact with a professor about 3 weeks ago. I got the impression that as of then, there was no funding but there is "some possibility" (ie only a small possibility) that this would change.

[Eislinn]

I think at this point the institutions that haven't sent out their rejection letters are waiting to hear back from the acceptances they've already extended. I would imagine that they are waiting to make sure they don't run through their entire accept/waitlist list before they finalize things with a rejection. Of course, this is also the point where people have to make decisions between one place and another, so I wouldn't be suprised if the letters didn't come until after the 15th.

Can they do that? Keep us waiting until even after the 15th? I am still waiting on responses from 5 schools out of 7, and trying to convince myself that doesn't mean they've just forgotten about me....

[Eislinn]

Can they do that? Keep us waiting until even after the 15th? I am still waiting on responses from 5 schools out of 7, and trying to convince myself that doesn't mean they've just forgotten about me....

Well, that brings it down to four answers I'm still waiting on....I've been "conditionally" admitted to U of Oregon! (Need to take a couple more theory courses, as I didn't actually do my undergrad in music)

[composser]

Can they do that? Keep us waiting until even after the 15th? I am still waiting on responses from 5 schools out of 7, and trying to convince myself that doesn't mean they've just forgotten about me....

Yes, they can. From personal experience I know 1 person who was accepted in late April, (McGill) and 1 other in AUGUST (Juilliard). Personally last year I had been wait-listed from Brandeis but no one told me until I decided to e-mail them myself around early April. Lastly, I know countless of other applicants being offered a full ride in May+ (after having been wait-listed)

Suggestion: Call the departments and press for a reply over the phone!

Edited March 29, 2011 by composser