NSF GRFP 2010-2011

[chaospaladin]

Generally, both assistantships and fellowships have two parts- the tuition waiver (pays your tuition) and a stipend (salary), ranging from 10k-30k per year. The stipend can be used for whatever you want, and you pay taxes on it.

I've never heard of anywhere doing figures based on "cost of attendance", but that's just me.

But you did say that if you were to get a teaching assistantship and more than 1 fellowship, then you would be forced to not receive money from your teaching assistantship in full and would be forced to give up all but 1 fellowship since being supported on more than 1 fellowship is generally not allowed and your combined money from both teaching assistantship and fellowship cannot exceed 125% of the threshold. That's what I meant by cost of attendance so to speak.

EDIT: Let me clarify myself. I know for a fact stacked fellowships are not allowed. But let's say my TA stipend is $25,000 and I receive a fellowship of $15,000, would I get $40,000 combined, or is their a limit on the amount of money I can receive per year? I know each program probably has their own policy as what the limit is but what is the general consensus regarding combining your TA stipend with your fellowship stipend?

Edited March 13, 2011 by chaospaladin

[Eigen]

The questions you are asking are completely school dependent.

By and large, I'd say you either have an assistantship or a fellowship... The two don't usually combine. The case you propose (a 15k fellowship stipend) is quite unusual, due to the really low value of the fellowship. Usually, external fellowships are going to be around the same value (roughly) as the stipend from an assistantship, or maybe a little higher. In any case, you would probably take the fellowship (and maybe a small bit of money from the department).

I know schools that have internal fellowships (small amounts) that stack with assistantships, but I don't think that's what you're talking about. I had one offer from a school that stacked several fellowships that were in the 1-5k range with an assistantship ::shrugs::

[purplesmoke]

Any care to venture a guess as to when we'll hear or how many awards?

[mmk]

Any care to venture a guess as to when we'll hear or how many awards?

As for how many: Assuming all goes well...

Edited March 13, 2011 by mmk

[purplesmoke]

Combined with the 8k applicants figure, does it seem odd that 25% of applicants are awarded a fellowship?

[Krypton]

There are at least 10,000 applicants.

But let's say my TA stipend is $25,000 and I receive a fellowship of $15,000, would I get $40,000 combined, or is their a limit on the amount of money I can receive per year?

This is the usual case: If your fellowship doesn't exceed how much you're already getting internally, then your internal source will supplement up to your current amount. So you'd get the $15,000 from the fellowship, plus $10,000 internally to bring it back up to $25,000. The generally unstated function of fellowships is not for you to get more money, but instead for your internal source to be paying you as little as possible.

You may get a little extra from the internal source since you're saving them money anyways with a fellowship award, but they'll never continue to pay you what they did previously after you receive a substantial fellowship.

Edited March 13, 2011 by Krypton

[purplesmoke]

Ya, you're right, looks like 12k.

http://www.nsfgrfp.org/assets/File/2011%20NSF%20GRFP%20Presentation.pdf

[Eigen]

You may get a little extra from the internal source since you're saving them money anyways with a fellowship award, but they'll never continue to pay you what they did previously after you receive a substantial fellowship.

The other obvious purpose of an external fellowship is the prestige. I know people that have ended up with slightly lower funding from an external fellowship, but taken it anyway. Things like the NSF fellowship open doors down the road- they make it more likely to get NSF post-doctoral fellowships, grants, career awards, etc.

[awvish]

The other obvious purpose of an external fellowship is the prestige. I know people that have ended up with slightly lower funding from an external fellowship, but taken it anyway. Things like the NSF fellowship open doors down the road- they make it more likely to get NSF post-doctoral fellowships, grants, career awards, etc.

Wait...if you get an award like the NSF GRF predoc and you don't use it (say, you go to an international institution, for example)....you can still say you got it, can't you? After all, the winning it is the important part, not that you were capable of spending the money.

[IRdreams]

Wait...if you get an award like the NSF GRF predoc and you don't use it (say, you go to an international institution, for example)....you can still say you got it, can't you? After all, the winning it is the important part, not that you were capable of spending the money.

It is common to say on CVs. You basically put the entry in like you would a normal fellowship or grant and then (declined). While this allows you to capture some of the prestige benefits, unfortunately, you do not get all of them would be my bet since there is likely networking effects as well. Also, whether the NSF "remembers" you as a past possible recipient if you don't actually take their money is questionable. I don't know for sure. But, your odds of recieving an award from them later in your career go up if you take their funds earlier. This is partially a quality effect. Quality applicants are likely to get both. However, a friend of mine works at the NSF and said that they actually do consider whether you've gotten their funds and preferentially favor you if you have.

[mmk]

Wait...if you get an award like the NSF GRF predoc and you don't use it (say, you go to an international institution, for example)....you can still say you got it, can't you? After all, the winning it is the important part, not that you were capable of spending the money.

Um, yes! I've seen "declined" next to prestigious awards/conferences on so many CVs...

[t_ruth]

I find the speculating about how much *extra* money we can earn or work we can do after winning the fellowship a bit too optimistic for my blood

[meankney]

I find the speculating about how much *extra* money we can earn or work we can do after winning the fellowship a bit too optimistic for my blood

Agreed! I was too optimistic last year and ended up being really disappointed, so this time around it's pessimism all the way!

[kkompiles]

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/03/15/us-usa-congress-spending-idUSTRE7205MS20110315

Ok...so our new *lower bound* on NSF knowing how much money it actually has (and therefore how many awards, and therefore us finding out if we are those receiving them) is April 8th.

Damn that's a long time!

[Eigen]

Um, yes! I've seen "declined" next to prestigious awards/conferences on so many CVs...

I've also had professors tell me that it's a really, really tacky move to put "declined" fellowships on your CV.

But yes, a lot of the prestige doesn't come from winning it, but from keeping the funding and networking opportunities it provides. If you turn down the fellowship, you don't spend three years as an "NSF Pre-Doctoral Fellow"... You just were offered (and declined) an award at some point in the past.

Basically, it's a nice perk on a resume, but not nearly as good as if you accept it.

[mmk]

I've also had professors tell me that it's a really, really tacky move to put "declined" fellowships on your CV.

But yes, a lot of the prestige doesn't come from winning it, but from keeping the funding and networking opportunities it provides. If you turn down the fellowship, you don't spend three years as an "NSF Pre-Doctoral Fellow"... You just were offered (and declined) an award at some point in the past.

Basically, it's a nice perk on a resume, but not nearly as good as if you accept it.

Haha, agreed that it is somewhat tacky, but the original question wasn't concerned with tackiness.

If this issue is a concern, perhaps a more suitable way of stating one was qualified for the honor should be used. That is the point, after all, no? Is the fact that one didn't spend the three years as an NSF pre-doc as important as the fact that one was qualified for it? Does accepting the fellowship and using its three years of funding somehow make one more qualified? As long as one continues to meet the stipulations for funding throughout their graduate work, being qualified for the honor and actually utilizing it are not so completely different (notwithstanding is the prior discussion of preferential treatment by NSF in the future according to whether one has been funded by them). Moreover, some other more prestigious fellowship likely took its place if one is in a position to decline, so it's simply one more way to draw attention to one's qualifications, which seems to be the point of CVs.

Edited March 16, 2011 by mmk

[awvish]

I agree that it seems sort of tacky...but then, a lot of people's CVs are sort of tacky in the self-congratulatory arena, too...

[IRdreams]

Isn't the whole notion of a CV self-congratulatory? I mean they are designed to sell you and "your brand," which means touting you up a bit. It really is a catch 22 since on the one hand you are meant to sell yourself but on the other a culture of self-promotion is looked down upon.

[Eigen]

I agree that it seems sort of tacky...but then, a lot of people's CVs are sort of tacky in the self-congratulatory arena, too...

Sure. I just know that when I was preparing my NSF app this year, I was told I definitely should not put on "declined" fellowships- most of which were fellowships from other schools that I declined along with the admission offer. They are still nice "feathers in the cap" so to speak, especially the ones from top-10 schools... But the consensus among my advisors was that it might be more detrimental than beneficial to put them on.

[hoobers]

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/03/15/us-usa-congress-spending-idUSTRE7205MS20110315

Ok...so our new *lower bound* on NSF knowing how much money it actually has (and therefore how many awards, and therefore us finding out if we are those receiving them) is April 8th.

Damn that's a long time!

Is the NSF actually waiting for this budget, or are our awards coming out of last year's budget? (I bet this is the sort of thing they would tell you over the phone if you call: anyone care to try?)

[crimsonengineer87]

Isn't the whole notion of a CV self-congratulatory? I mean they are designed to sell you and "your brand," which means touting you up a bit. It really is a catch 22 since on the one hand you are meant to sell yourself but on the other a culture of self-promotion is looked down upon.

I think we've beaten this subject to death, but as someone alluded to, I really think it depends upon who you are submitting your CV to and what for (ugh I ending sentences in prepositions ... anyways). So you'll always have your long CV with EVERYTHING. I mean EVERYTHING including declined awards. If something calls for the NSF-style one-pager CV, then most likely don't put the declined fellowships. But if you're applying to something and you know putting that you declined an NSF fellowship would help you network or something, then yes it's okay. But it does depend. Obviously you will never send your entire 5-6 page CV, unless you really need to. It's more like a way to keep track of stuff. And as someone mentioned, if you declined a major fellowship, you probably received a more prestigious one in place or one that provided more money. Personally, if I got NSF, EPA STAR, and NDSEG (all three ... most unlikely! ha!) ... I would accept NDSEG and the decline the others. If I were submitting an abstract for an environmental conference, I might add I declined the EPA STAR, but not NSF. I dunno, I think I'm just rambling ... I'm just a first-year PhD student ...but just my thoughts ...

[adaptations]

Any care to venture a guess as to when we'll hear or how many awards?

I would guess they have approximately 2,000 awards again this year. The ARRA funding was allocated for two years (FY 10/11) and as we saw, last year was the first year they began allocating ARRA funds, which accounts for the spike in number of awards. Assuming congress continues passing CRs, I don't believe we will see significant cuts to the GRFP funding (CRs are based on FY 10 benchmarks and there hasn't been much substantive action to cut GRFP style programs - yet). The program solicitation estimated 2,000 awards, and I don't see the funding being significantly changed from their estimate this year (I suspect next year will be back to pre-ARRA levels). So, if you're applying this year it should still be a good year to apply, since ARRA funding should still be flowing. Anyway - that's my best guess. Good luck.

Edited March 17, 2011 by adaptations

[repatriate]

Is the NSF actually waiting for this budget, or are our awards coming out of last year's budget? (I bet this is the sort of thing they would tell you over the phone if you call: anyone care to try?)

I called today and asked if the delays in setting the budget would delay award announcements. I was told, "We don't have any information on that, so I can't answer your question. Sorry."

According to FastLane, the number of fellowships is expected to be around 1,000.

Edited to provide direct link to relevant FastLane FAQ.

Edited March 18, 2011 by repatriate

[kdilks]

I called today and asked if the delays in setting the budget would delay award announcements. I was told, "We don't have any information on that, so I can't answer your question. Sorry."

According to FastLane, the number of fellowships is expected to be around 1,000.

Edited to provide direct link to relevant FastLane FAQ.

They probably just didn't bother updating that page to reflect the temporary increase from ARRA funding. I'd expect closer to 2000.

[hoobers]

I called today and asked if the delays in setting the budget would delay award announcements. I was told, "We don't have any information on that, so I can't answer your question. Sorry."

Thanks for calling. I wonder why they are dithering on it. Maybe they can award them out of the existing budget, but would rather not?