jms Posted December 19, 2012 Posted December 19, 2012 Dear Posters, I am in need of some help and advice. I am currently having an issue with jealousy- I am both ashamed to share but also realize that it is ruining my self-esteem and simultaneously the joy I once had in my department. I am currently in a doctoral program in education, an achievement that I am definitely proud of because it took a lot of hard work plus a lot of ups and downs to get to where I am-started my program in my early 30s. However, I am also aware that I have very low self-esteem, something which I am going to counseling for and know that I will definitely have to work on if I want to be successful in this program. When I entered my program, there was one colleague in my cohort that, over time, grew to be a good friend of mine. This happened in spite of a couple instances when I did realize that the department seemed to value him more than me-ranging from fellowships to comments in class to assistant positions. There was an assistant position, for example, advertised during our first year that I had put off applying for because we were not supposed to be working--it was a service free year. The professor who had advertised the position to both of us did not get back to me when I had asked if I was even suppose to apply to the position. However, my friend ended up applying anyway and did end up getting the position. This position has definitely opened lots of doors for him--now he has multiple professors asking for him to be their research assistant and he even got acknowledged by the professor he worked with in the professor's book. This same professor shared at a party that our mutual mentor (the one who had told us about the research position) had suggested he choose my friend. This definitely hurt me, although the professor had no clue (or at least I think he didn't) that I had planned on applying. On another more recent occasion, another professor that shares our research interests chose my friend to be his research assistant-a mutual friend of ours in our program had been his assistant and had told us that he would probably be the professor's assistant for a while so we should hold off on asking the professor for a position. I do not know how it all unfolded, but before I know it, my friend and our mutual friend are having coffee together with this professor and and are figuring out how they will all work together. Again, this was another instance when I should not have played nice (I think?) and just went ahead and got the positions that I wanted. What bothers me the most is that this professor works more in my sub-field than my friend. Right now I feel as though I do not have the support I need from the professors I had originally planned to work with, they seem to appreciate my friend and his work more than mine, which just makes me feel lost and disappointed. At the same time, I have started distancing myself from my friend, which is something I am not proud of. I think that it has just become hard for me not to be awkward around him. I think one of the reasons I have done this is because I do feel that professors and some of my colleagues have begun to put us side by side--there have been instances when a professor has said that I specialize in what my friend does (never the way around) even though I don't. I think I have also been tired of being the wingman. This friend also has the habit of only talking about himself when we are around and parading with a modesty that I am not sure is genuine all of the time. Again, I do know that this is probably my jealousy and envy talking, which definitely is warping my whole perspective. My big issue is that I am always comparing myself to this friend to the point that it is making me both physically and mentally sick and exhausted. I have anxiety if I have to be in the same room with this person, and I am not quite sure where to even begin to fix all of this. My anxiety has even gotten to the point that I have been thinking that spending time in this program is not worth it if the professors I am supposed to work with ignore me or don't spend as much as an investment in my work because of this friend. Also, because of this friend's many connections, I do have the fear that if I step on his toes, he could definitely make sure I do not get a position in the future as well as bring all of our mutual friends to his side. And I am fully prepared for people to call this paranoia-I'm such a mental mess! I also know that I might be using the word "friend" incorrectly, because friends are suppose to support each other and not hope that they fail. So compacted with everything is just the voice in my head saying that I am a horrible person for feeling this way. This feeling has been something I have tried so hard to get rid of and hide, especially because I know that this feeling would not be tolerated in my circle of friends in the department, who expect that we all support each other. I think that from previous experiences I have had in my life, I just cannot stand being a wingman or to be in someone else's shadow--if I sense that is happening, I shut off and feel threatened. I think this stems from being taken advantaged of in certain situations in the past. I feel that I have supported this friend and his endeavors to the extent that I forgot to make sure I am getting what I need. I apologize for such a long and toxic post everyone. I figured I would let it all out and get it out of my system and try to fix all of this before it gets any worse. Again, I know that I have a lot of work to do, and thanks for hearing me out! I would really appreciate suggestions on how to combat academic jealousy, what to do about this friend (if there is anything I can do), and how to fix my overall perspective on graduate school right now. gradapp2012 1
jms Posted December 19, 2012 Author Posted December 19, 2012 I am realizing that the length of my post might be discouraging posters to respond, sorry!
fuzzylogician Posted December 19, 2012 Posted December 19, 2012 I think that there are two separate issues here, which I'll address in turn. First, it sounds like you need to take a more active role in your education. That's precisely what you describe your friend as doing: apply for positions, schmooze with professors, talk yourself up. Since you do less of that, I think it's not unreasonable that professors have less of an idea of your research interests, and that they associate you with your friend's interests (since you describe yourself as his sidekick). Furthermore, since your friend has obviously been successful in his past positions, you can also kind of see why he would be recommended or sought after by other professors. You need to start building a name for yourself that's similar to that. If you do a good job, I don't see why you wouldn't also be appreciated. People are recognized for work they do, not for potential they might have. Prove yourself, and people will take notice. Second (and more difficult), you need to stop comparing yourself to your friend. A fact of life is that there is always going to be someone smarter/faster/better at something than you are. If you give up as soon as you encounter such a person, you won't get very far. A fact of life is also that it's not always those smarter/better people who succeed more in life, you can affect your destiny by being active and taking initiative. Get your foot in the doorway, get to know professors and try to start collaborations - essentially do the things you say your friend is doing. Hey, maybe your friend will even be willing to talk to you about how he strikes up conversations with professors and gets these collaborations. It's something useful to learn how to do. From your story, I didn't think he was doing anything to harm you, though he may have been insensitive or oblivious when he could have helped you out. If you talk to him, that may change. ... or you may find out that you were right to distance yourself from him, but either way I think you'll use your energy better if you invest it in furthering your own causes rather than comparing yourself to others. coffeeandmilk, Assotto, Reglidtra and 26 others 29
jms Posted December 19, 2012 Author Posted December 19, 2012 fuzzylogician: Definitely needed to hear what you just posted, thanks so much, really. socscholar and Conscia Fati 2
SeriousSillyPutty Posted December 20, 2012 Posted December 20, 2012 I second the idea of talking to your friend and asking him for pointers on networking and such. (If he's a natural, he may not be aware of what he does, but if you pick his brain enough I bet something will come through.) I also agree that the best thing to do is to not compare yourself to him, but I would propose that the second best thing is to remember that the aspects of you that you are comparing are not your whole selves. Example: One of my good friends in high school, Donna, was quite musical, playing guitar in the jazz band and clarinet in concert band. She was always first chair until she ended up in band with Dave Bennett, who was Benny Goodman reincarnate -- a real clarinet prodigy, who also wailed on guitar as well as playing sax and piano. He was a great guy and we all got along, but she still got tired of ALWAYS being second chair to him. The thing is, while Dave had very concentrated gifting in music; Donna had a broader array of gifting. (On top of all the band stuff, she had become a BLACK BELT in karate in 10th grade.) You, too, are more than your graduate studies. If you don't feel like it, then try to get into some volunteer work or a hobby to help keep things in perspective. And don't worry about the "mental mess" thing; "Mess" is what makes us human; character comes from learning how to deal with the particular mess we've been dealt, and you seem to be doing that just fine. Good luck! stinkybeagle 1
Shelley Burian Posted December 20, 2012 Posted December 20, 2012 (edited) I think that this is the difficult thing about graduate school. We want to be friends and support each other in our work but at some point you have to realize that you will be competing against each other for these kinds of things and eventually for jobs. I agree with the above poster on putting yourself out there. It's not really a question of being nice or not, I think that's the wrong way to look at it. Promoting yourself and your career is your responsibility and no one would blame your for applying to the same competitive fellowships as your friends. Certainly don't be that person who backstabs other students and tries to undermine them in class and with your adviser, but putting the thought of all the other students who are applying for the same position as you out of your mind when you are doing your application is certainly acceptable. Nobody wins all the time, and a healthy combination of both makes you grateful when you do and happy for your friends when they do Edited December 20, 2012 by Shelley Burian splitends, Lyra Belacqua and wildviolet 3
wildviolet Posted December 21, 2012 Posted December 21, 2012 I agree 100% with Shelley Burian. The members of my cohort are very nice. We support each other by having study/reading/discussion/writing groups and socializing outside of class. At the same time, I'm aware that my friends in my subfield are likely competitors for department fellowships and future jobs. A big part of grad school is figuring out how you want to position yourself in the field. In education, this can take many forms: specializations in subject areas, theoretical perspectives/frameworks, methodology, secondary vs. elementary vs. higher ed, etc. I completely understand your position as I've experienced twinges of jealousy sometimes as well. But, as others have suggested, you must begin carving a space for yourself in the field by developing your "academic identity." Your research interests and values should drive you, not competition with your peers or feelings of inadequacy. At the same time, it's good to have a network--you may need their assistance one day, or you could be in a position to assist others. Education is a small world! Dal PhDer, jms and Quigley 3
DarwinAG Posted December 21, 2012 Posted December 21, 2012 After fuzzylogicians very informative post, I have very little to add on the matter. I wholeheartedly agree with the first advice: take a more active role in your education. You should definitely advocate for yourself more and pursue more oppurtunities. Regarding the second advice of not comparing yourself to your friend, I would like to offer a different perspective. I happen to think that some comparisons are healthy (although I understand clearly in your case, it has more detrimental effects than helpful ones). Comparisons are automaitc processes. You can spend your time and effort trying not to compare, or you can reappraise the comparisons you make. I am very prone to upward comparisons; I compare myself to my more succesful peers and also very succesful people in my field. Literature would tell you that this results in diminished well-being, but also, in some cases, help motivate you to achieve your goals. I focus on this latter part of it, and I reppraise the comparisons to help motivate me. It is true that it is dissatisying to feel behind or inferior to others, but it just makes me work twice as hard to get where they are. Not only that, but upward comparisons has an interestnig by product and keeping me grounded and humble. The feeling of dissatisfaction has been very useful. jms 1
tonita Posted December 22, 2012 Posted December 22, 2012 I am realizing that the length of my post might be discouraging posters to respond, sorry! lolz! you're right! I still haven't read your post but talking about jealousy, its always natural to get jealous. But the thing is, you should'nt take it deeply into your heart. It causes you to sin. jms and CageFree 1 1
juilletmercredi Posted December 22, 2012 Posted December 22, 2012 fuzzylogician's post is very apt: succeeding in academia (and in the corporate world) is all about recognizing your own strengths and promoting yourself. Nobody is going to say "go", and nobody is going to be a better promoter of you than you. So if you want something, you need to apply for it and talk to the appropriate people to get it. Yes, you will be competing with your friends sometimes. If they are true friends, they will be happy for you when you succeed even if they fail. Besides, you never know where that friend can help you later - maybe he'll be on a search committee for a job you're applying for one day. Also, seconding that second paragraph. I found my peace in graduate school when I stopped constantly comparing myself to my peers. Some comparison is good to make sure you are on the right track. But you may have a different situation and different goals than the people you're with, even if you work in the same lab and have the same advisor (I have a friend and colleague right now who came in the same year as I did. She's finishing in May whereas I probably won't graduate until next February, and she has more pubs than me - but she also came in with a master's and is aiming for R1s, whereas I came straight from undergrad and want to work at R2 or LAC. Different circumstances, different goals, different people!) jms 1
jms Posted December 22, 2012 Author Posted December 22, 2012 Thank you guys so much for the great advice. This all has really motivated me to do my best next semester. I do realize that someone will always be better than you in some way but it is also a matter of playing to your strengths. Lastly there are things out of my control-I did not mention that this friend attended an instituition that is popular among some of the professors at our department in our field and is an instituition that our mutual friend attended. The professor who had given my friend the ra position had taught at that instituion as well. I think I spent so much time thinking that i was already the underdog that i forgot about what I can control. Thanks for putting things in focus guys.
jms Posted December 22, 2012 Author Posted December 22, 2012 After fuzzylogicians very informative post, I have very little to add on the matter. I wholeheartedly agree with the first advice: take a more active role in your education. You should definitely advocate for yourself more and pursue more oppurtunities. Regarding the second advice of not comparing yourself to your friend, I would like to offer a different perspective. I happen to think that some comparisons are healthy (although I understand clearly in your case, it has more detrimental effects than helpful ones). Comparisons are automaitc processes. You can spend your time and effort trying not to compare, or you can reappraise the comparisons you make. I am very prone to upward comparisons; I compare myself to my more succesful peers and also very succesful people in my field. Literature would tell you that this results in diminished well-being, but also, in some cases, help motivate you to achieve your goals. I focus on this latter part of it, and I reppraise the comparisons to help motivate me. It is true that it is dissatisying to feel behind or inferior to others, but it just makes me work twice as hard to get where they are. Not only that, but upward comparisons has an interestnig by product and keeping me grounded and humble. The feeling of dissatisfaction has been very useful. I definitely agree with this to a certain extent. I think it is a balance of admiring someone's accomplishments without thinking that that you are inferior becaiuse you don't have those same things. I also think that you are not always meant to have exactly what someone else has, which I am also trying to be at peace with. I would like to think that I should be happy with my own path. But I also think it is okay to be inspired by others. So again this is all to say that I am trying not to base my self-worth on comparisons.
evaunitone Posted January 10, 2013 Posted January 10, 2013 I just want to chime in here with a different point of view. Well maybe not different from you, but different from what other posters have said. They are probably correct, or almost definately are correct. Taking a more avtice role in your education is probably vital. However, I can totally understand your position, and unfortunately for some of us its not as easy as "put yourself out there" or "shmooze" because like you, I also find it very hard to do either of those things. Firstly, I'm not even sure what shmoozing is, and when other people are doing it around you and succeeding, although it may seem like that would be encouraging, its actually extremely discouraging for someonewho has a hard time competing with their peers. For example, I work in a lab right now and really feel under-utilized and under-appreciated. I have a coworker who does much less work than I do, does drugs at work, and doesn't even have a degree. However, he's fairly charming and lied on his resume about having a degree, and guess what, he just got a new job! I could be a creep and tell his new employer to check his credentials, or I could have reported him to HR for smoking pot on his lunch break, but I'm not that kind of person. I just don't know what to do though because I'm not getting anywhere but I'm trying, I really am. If being a charming liar is what it takes to succeed today, thats a sad sign of the times. I'm terrified that I'll encounter the same crap in grad school, and it sounds like I almost definately will. It's very discouraging because I don't seem to be equipped with the social skills to "shmooze". So does that mean I don't have a chance? I thought academia was where people like me can succeed! I'm almost 28, I have a BS in Religion and a BS in biology and 3 years of work experience in labs. I've been getting a fair amount of job interviews lately and I haven't gotten any of the jobs. Grad school has always appealed to me and I know I want a Master's, but I'm feeling very discouraged today. **I'm sorry for hijacking your post!** I hope your situation gets better. My advice, if you want it (LOL) is to talk to your friend about how he does his shmoozing and networking, learn what you can from him, and then if you can't stop feeling jealousy towards him, cut him out of your life. You may feel like a paranoid person or feel bad for having the jealousy that you do, but the fact is your relationship with him is destuctive and not good for you at this point. Best of Luck! I'll keep my fingers crossed for you!
gradorbust Posted January 18, 2013 Posted January 18, 2013 (edited) Although they are your friends, just remember that you are competition as well. I am not saying to be paranoid, just to understand that these are not like childhood friends, more like work friends. They will be looking out for themselves way more than they will be for you and if they see a opportunity for mutual advancement they will bring you in on it, however if it is just them....well. If there is no competition then trust them with every inch of your back but otherwise when there is competition for a spot or resources just go after it. At worst you dont get it and you are right back where you started minus like 30 minutes. Edited January 18, 2013 by gradorbust
gradapp2012 Posted April 7, 2013 Posted April 7, 2013 Can I say I appreciate your post a lot though you seem to be hitting yourself on the head? It was not "toxic", I think you must be a good person indeed, to be worrying about not being a good friend and wanting to be better that way what with all the other trouble you have . Maybe I am similar to you, I think I would feel exactly the same way you feel if I were to be in the same situation. But I think , like fuzzylogician said, you need to be more proactive. I personally dont go for the blowing your own trumpet thing, but working hard and being involved in activities whose results are hard to ignore would make your case much stronger. Good luck, I am sure things will turn around.
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