cheating

[doodtest]

I am in trouble.

I referred to a solution for an assignment on book exercise, online and basically copied it down. However later I found out that the solution was for the older version of the question. Now my professor has found out that I and 3 others have copied from the Instructor manual and has summoned me in two days time.

I am very worried about this. I am a TA myself. I don't know what to do or clarify. Please suggest what can happen to me and what I should do.

[flit]

yikes! I don't know what is likely to happen ...I think that depends on what the policies are at your university...

but I will keep my fingers crossed for you

[doodtest]

Please anybody with experience or knowledge do give suggestion. I am scared to death.

[Aceflyer]

I believe at this point it is at the professor's discretion as to what to do with you. Given that your prof has summoned you to see him, you're probably likely to receive a stern warning, some kind of punishment, extra work, or any combination of these. Worse things could happen, of course, but I'd imagine that you'd be hearing directly from the Graduate School and not from your prof if your prof had decided to escalate this.

[liszt85]

I agree with the above. When he asks you for reasons, I'd advise you not to say "I was pressed for time due to ... and hence..", rather say something like "I do not know what got into me, I've never cheated before. I don't expect you to believe that, but I take full responsibility and promise never to do this again. I'm willing to accept any punishment that you deem fit for this behavior of mine. I am all the more ashamed of myself since I also serve as a TA and have set a bad example." Own up to your mistake and brace yourself for the worst. Normally, people do appreciate honesty and the willingness to accept mistakes. So let this also be a way of showing him that you intend to be an honest person now on. Anyway, that is what I'd have done in your place.

[goose2009]

You seriously want advice on how to get away with what you did? That seriously left me speechless for some time.

It sounds like your professor is going to be pretty hard on you, at least I hope so. I think the previous poster is right that if you were going to be kicked out this would be going higher up, but I wouldn't be surprised if you lost your TA position and whatever other funding you have, at least for a semester or two.

[doodtest]

Thanks everybody for suggesting. I hope more people can help me.

And I am not looking to escape anything, all I want to know from you guys is how best to face this awkward situation and what worst or normal can happen to me.

I am already sorry for my foolish act ( But, a thief is one who caught stealing, not one who stole and was never caught)

[UnlikelyGrad]

( But, a thief is one who caught stealing, not one who stole and was never caught)

Wrong. A thief is one who steals, period. A cheater is one who cheats, whether or not they get caught.

Honesty is not the best policy because it keeps you from being punished: it is the best policy because, long term, it is the most beneficial to you and the rest of society.

The person who steals deprives someone of that which is rightfully theirs. The thief also start to think that he/she 'deserves' to get anything they want, no matter what it takes to get it.

Those who cheat don't learn the material. If they don't get caught, they may get a good grade in the class, but they won't understand what's going on. (Speaking from long experience as a tutor: those who don't learn the material early in the class will be doubly screwed because the later stuff will probably be totally incomprehensible...)

I wish there were more honest people in the world. Seems like, nowadays, there are too many people who don't comprehend the definition of the word. **bites tongue, refrains from saying: "When I was a kid..."**

Around here, what happens depends on the professor. One professor of mine recently caught a bunch of plagiarists; he called them into his office one by one to test their understanding of the material. If they understood what they'd written (even though they didn't come up with the words themselves), he gave them points, albeit fewer than the rest. I thought this was very merciful...most profs I know will give you a zero for the assignment.

[watanabe]

No, I think you are trying to escape this situation. It is not awkward; it is wrong. And you are unrepentant.

[thepoorstockinger]

The original poster seems like a scumbag. I hope things go very poorly for you.

[liszt85]

Thanks everybody for suggesting. I hope more people can help me.

And I am not looking to escape anything, all I want to know from you guys is how best to face this awkward situation and what worst or normal can happen to me.

I am already sorry for my foolish act ( But, a thief is one who caught stealing, not one who stole and was never caught)

I take back all that I said to you earlier in this thread. You do seem to be unrepentant. A thief is not one who stole and never was caught?! So you mean its okay for me to steal your new ferrari as long as you don't catch me and I'm not a thief if you don't catch me? :shock:

Copying one solution for an assignment is one thing (not fine at all but lets leave it at that) but it looks like you're a habitual offender going by your statements.

[katreese]

"a thief is one who caught stealing, not one who stole and was never caught"

is this a quote from the madoff school of morality?

[doodtest]

Dear guys and respected ladies,

I totally appreciate your suggestions.

Well let me clear up the air a bit. I am an international student and this is my first year at US university. This sort of copying/collaboration is considered a common practice from the part of world where I come. Not that I meant it is the reason we passed all those exams/TOEFL/GRE that way. But there is little such honor policy. Usually we as students try to get ideas from others, if and when we do come at stages when we are unable to originate the concepts ourselves and apply that in our own styles. And coming to university level, we know that we can at no place escape by direct copycat, at least we must be able to use our brains even to modify the things that we have taken ideas.

So my mistake although a few recurring times, I must admit that, I am not free to use ideas and works that are not mine as my work, which in this case what happened to me. I studied online resources, in which I happen to find the solution, understood how it worked and then implemented it. My part of fault was that I was not right to take ideas from others, but also I should have cited my reference, so that I provide the due credit to the original composer.

I am not being unrepentent, I was just ignorant. I have now realized how dire the consequences can be and although its hard to say that I will never again look for solutions, I will promise to myself that should I ever refer to some resources online, I will definitely give complete credit to that and mention the source of my knowledge.

The reason I used the infamous quote was that I meant, almost everyone in my class does refer to some solution if found, on the case is that I have been stupid enough. Besides I haven't collaborated with anyone else or taken solution from another peer in the class, although in practice it might seem there is hardly a difference in either case.

However, let me make this vow, I have learnt my mistake, I have realized the consequences and I stand to the fact that I will not repeat this mistake again and wherever possible enforce the proper rules of academic integrity to all I can identify in breach of it. And as for the professor meeting, I will be honest and accept whatever penalties that I get.

Once again thanks everyone. I hope the posts under this topic become a guiding reference to all starting their graduate career, especially those who tend to come from international places and are not habituated to strictly following proper academic integrity.

To Peace.

[thepoorstockinger]

I buy this as an excuse for international students in the early years of undergrad, but if you're a graduate student (and a friggin' TA!) you should have known what the expectations were before applying for the program, and certainly after at least a full semester in it. I assume this was covered in TA training and it is definitely in most style guide, and based on your latest post you seem to have a solid grasp of what the expectations were and chose to willfully ignore them. I don't feel all that sorry for you.

If you didn't know what you did was wrong then quite frankly you shouldn't be in grad school.

[rising_star]

I buy this as an excuse for international students in the early years of undergrad, but if you're a graduate student (and a friggin' TA!) you should have known what the expectations were before applying for the program, and certainly after at least a full semester in it. I assume this was covered in TA training and it is definitely in most style guide, and based on your latest post you seem to have a solid grasp of what the expectations were and chose to willfully ignore them. I don't feel all that sorry for you.

If you didn't know what you did was wrong then quite frankly you shouldn't be in grad school.

First, having gone to TA training at two different schools, I can honestly tell you that I've never heard of this being covered. TA training covers your responsibilities as a teaching assistant and university and federal policies (like FERPA), not what the expectations of you as a student are. Second, often instructors are unclear about how much collaboration is allowed on an assignment. If the instructor didn't want students to search for solutions on the internet, s/he should make that explicitly clear to students. From what I've read so far, it seems like the OP is confused about how searching the internet for a solution is any different than copying the solution off of a classmate, which I think is a legitimate complaint. Third, I can't think of any program that tells students when they can and can't use the internet for problem-solving before or during the application process so saying "you should have known what the expectations were before applying for the program" smacks of silliness to me.

When I took statistics, we were told to use whatever resources we needed to answer the questions, even if that meant searching the web for information. Seems to me like one of the problems here is that the instructor did not make his/her expectations clear, yet everyone seems to be blaming the OP. Now it could be that things were clear to everyone in the class and the OP didn't get it, which is a different thing, but still not one that means the OP "chose to willfully ignore [the expectations]". Should we punish people for not understanding even when they admit the mistake? And, what if the instructor's expectations really weren't made clear until this incident erupted? I think everyone here is quick to indict.

[bowdoinstudent]

I buy this as an excuse for international students in the early years of undergrad, but if you're a graduate student (and a friggin' TA!) you should have known what the expectations were before applying for the program, and certainly after at least a full semester in it. I assume this was covered in TA training and it is definitely in most style guide, and based on your latest post you seem to have a solid grasp of what the expectations were and chose to willfully ignore them. I don't feel all that sorry for you.

If you didn't know what you did was wrong then quite frankly you shouldn't be in grad school.

Hear hear, well said. Academic intergrity is a serious matter. We go to grad school to become professionalized in our fields, if you don't even understand the basic expectation of citing your work, then I don't think you are cut out here - being an international student does not justify your "ignorance." The same rule and work ethic should be applied to everyone who is already enrolled into an or any American graduate program. Then again, it's better to have made the mistake now, then to pay for it later in your career - then you'll REALLY lose your credibility as a scholar/teacher. Good luck.

[jasper.milvain]

First, having gone to TA training at two different schools, I can honestly tell you that I've never heard of this being covered.

In my TA training, we had a long talk on identifying plagiarism from our department Academic Honesty Rep., were asked to cover the issue in seminar with our students, and were strongly encouraged to take the same Academic Honesty Tutorial online that our students were required to take.

I dunno... I can buy the international angle, but I don't think a lack of clarification from the prof is a fair excuse. The onus is on the student to make sure they're not breaking policy.

[Aceflyer]

First, having gone to TA training at two different schools, I can honestly tell you that I've never heard of this being covered. TA training covers your responsibilities as a teaching assistant and university and federal policies (like FERPA), not what the expectations of you as a student are. Second, often instructors are unclear about how much collaboration is allowed on an assignment. If the instructor didn't want students to search for solutions on the internet, s/he should make that explicitly clear to students. From what I've read so far, it seems like the OP is confused about how searching the internet for a solution is any different than copying the solution off of a classmate, which I think is a legitimate complaint. Third, I can't think of any program that tells students when they can and can't use the internet for problem-solving before or during the application process so saying "you should have known what the expectations were before applying for the program" smacks of silliness to me.

When I took statistics, we were told to use whatever resources we needed to answer the questions, even if that meant searching the web for information. Seems to me like one of the problems here is that the instructor did not make his/her expectations clear, yet everyone seems to be blaming the OP. Now it could be that things were clear to everyone in the class and the OP didn't get it, which is a different thing, but still not one that means the OP "chose to willfully ignore [the expectations]". Should we punish people for not understanding even when they admit the mistake? And, what if the instructor's expectations really weren't made clear until this incident erupted? I think everyone here is quick to indict.

I agree completely with rising_star. How is searching the Internet for a solution any different than copying the solution off of a classmate? The latter is often more 'accepted' especially in courses where heavy collaboration and cooperation between peers is expected and encouraged. After all, it's always a blurred line between collaboration and just plain copying.

I think the problem here is that the OP copied from an Instructor's Solutions Manual he found online. The issues are: he copied from a publication and tried to claim credit for what he copied; he copied from an Instructor's Solutions Manual, which he presumably should not have had access to in the first place.

[goose2009]

The thing I'm wondering is how the OP didn't know that the answer he/she copied down (from what I understand word for word) was for an old version of the book. Was the question completely different? Did you not even read the question before copying down the answer? Based on the original post it sounds like this might be the problem.

[Jakrabite]

Dear guys and respected ladies,

I totally appreciate your suggestions.

Well let me clear up the air a bit. I am an international student and this is my first year at US university. This sort of copying/collaboration is considered a common practice from the part of world where I come.

Bro..I am an intl. student and I do not appreciate you defining my integrity with corny platitudes. Apologize to your professor and start being honest.

[Rutabaga]

Maybe there is some element of cultural differences to this. The only students who ever blatantly asked to cheat off of me (and no, I never agreed) were international students. Maybe that is more acceptable in universities abroad? Not that that's an excuse, but perhaps an explanation.

[Jakrabite]

Maybe there is some element of cultural differences to this. The only students who ever blatantly asked to cheat off of me (and no, I never agreed) were international students. Maybe that is more acceptable in universities abroad? Not that that's an excuse, but perhaps an explanation.

That's pretty subjective. In my personal experience I've had both American and International students request me for my finished assignments. Though as a TA I've only once had to report a case of academic dishonesty and unfortunately the students in question were International students. But frankly I believe that more than regional factors, the intrinsic honesty of individuals is too random to be cogently explained either which way.

[Aceflyer]

Different cultures/nations do have different standards regarding what is acceptable behavior and what isn't. It isn't that international students are more immoral, it is just that they may be used to different societal and academic standards/policies regarding what is acceptable. The problem here is that the OP knew, even before he got caught, that what he did was unacceptable at his current program.

[liszt85]

Different cultures/nations do have different standards regarding what is acceptable behavior and what isn't. It isn't that international students are more immoral, it is just that they may be used to different societal and academic standards/policies regarding what is acceptable. The problem here is that the OP knew, even before he got caught, that what he did was unacceptable at his current program.

^ I couldn't agree more. I'm myself from a country where students do collaborate or solve questions in groups, or even look up solutions on the internet but I'm fully aware that this is not the way things work there in the US! I wouldn't do any of this unless the instructor explicitly okays any of it.

[doodtest]

Most important lesson I've learned in my entire life. I would rather pass the exam of honesty and fail the exam of knowledge.