Applying for a job while in PhD program and your advisor (boss) finding out...legal issues

[Astarabadi]

So,

 

1. Person A is  a graduate student at a PhD program and is satisfied. Can move on and finish PhD and get  job, whole 9, etc. Good relation with advisor and faculty and fellow cohort.

 

2. Same person A is also interested in a job at another university--at another department, with other people, nothing to do directly with his current university. He applies for the job.

 

3. Now is the search committee at the university that will maybe hire him bound not to speak to his current adivsor (boss)? Because person A has listed nothing in his application stating that his current advisor will be a good reference. Also, his current advisor should ideally not find out that he is applying for a job. Person A just wants to apply for the job quietly, find out if he was hired, and move on and tell his advisor.

 

4. Now the question is legality: if the search committee directly or inadvertently contacts his current advisor, then that is trouble for person A. He might not be hired and might also be denied candidacy. But then is there not the question of legality--the university he is applying for will be held responsible for contacting someone and then damaging the career of person A. He never asked that his advisor be contacted and wanted that to stay quiet. Both advisor and hiring university are implicit is maybe damaging person A's career. 

 

any advice? any thoughts? who is maybe the best person at each university to consult in terms of legality?

 

thanks !

[Lisa44201]

I'm a little confused as to why the adviser should not find out the student is looking for a job; that's what happens after students graduate - they find jobs.

 

I also don't understand how this would damage the student's standing at the current university - again, folks who graduate go find jobs. Unless the student is planning on leaving the university before graduating, and lying about obtaining a degree....

 

But anyway. I believe that prospective employers are only allowed to contact people that are listed as a professional reference; so, if the student doesn't list the adviser, the hiring university isn't going to go Google the adviser's contact information (seems a little silly, no?).

 

However, the hiring university will no doubt ask for academic transcripts from the current university. Not sure what the candidate is trying to hide, but I hope it's not something on the transcripts.

 

Furthermore, I imagine it will be difficult getting a job without having a letter of recommendation from the student's primary adviser; from the standpoint of an employer, that looks suspicious. Who else is going to write a letter of recommendation?

[rising_star]

I'm assuming this question is about non-academic jobs and that student A isn't that close to graduation. If you don't list someone as a reference, they can't contact that person. It's that simple.

[Guest |||]

The only relevant thing I can relate to this, some universities have strict rules if you are recieving funding and then also try and seek a job.  Otherwise, only issues concerning visa and working permits seem relevant.

[TakeruK]

I think it's strange that a University might have restrictions about job-seeking while on a fellowship or other form of funding. I don't doubt that this could happen somewhere, but most conflict of commitment / conflict of interest policies prevent students from actually taking the job, but applying or job hunting is normally okay. Some funding sources do have stipulations that if you don't finish your graduate degree voluntarily (i.e. drop out) then you must repay the award money! So, this is something to look out for (although terms like this would probably be highlighted in the offer letter!)

 

I think Person A can trust the potential employer to not break privacy policies by contacting former employers/supervisors without Person A's permission. However, if Person A is really concerned about it, they might explicitly ask the employer not to contact their supervisor. Otherwise, this might be done accidentally -- academia (even if this is a non-academic job, it's still at a university) is a small world. It's possible that someone at the potential employer's department might know Person A's supervisor (or someone in Person A's department) and mention that "oh, someone from your department is applying here". 

 

It would be unlikely and I don't think a potential employer will be as unethical as to seek out anyone who might have known the applicant if the applicant did not give them permission. In many job applications I've seen, when they ask for former employment/experience, they ask you to list the supervisor and ask if they may contact this person. Personally, I would list the supervisor, omit any contact information and explicitly answer "no" to their question about contacting the supervisor. However, with all that said, there is no way to be certain that Person A's supervisor will not find out about the job search and I think Person A should have a plan in place in case this happens. No graduate student is "bound" to stay in their PhD program and while it's probably better and smoother if no one else found out about Person A's job search, Person A should not feel ashamed or guilty -- everyone has a right to choose to leave the graduate program if they find something else they rather pursue. 

 

I also think Person A shouldn't expect to be able to keep the whole thing a secret forever. Rumours spread quickly and Person A should be prepared for the possibility that someone will find out if the job hunting process takes awhile. 

 

Finally, as for legal consequences for the potential employer if Person A's supervisor finds out -- I don't think it's reasonable to assume that Person A will have legal recourse against the employer if the information is leaked. I'm not a lawyer though! One potential resource in getting some advice in these complicated matters would be Person A's university career center. They might know what students in similar cases have done in the past. For legal advice in matters like potentially suing the other university if they contact Person A's supervisor, Person A should probably consult a lawyer. 

Edited September 14, 2013 by TakeruK

[Astarabadi]

Ok, thanks guys.

[juilletmercredi]

^I want to clarify something.

 

It's not true that employers are not "allowed" to contact people that you don't list as references.  There's no law preventing them from doing this, there's nothing legally or ethically wrong with it, and in fact employers do it all the time.  If you list someone as a prior supervisor/employer on your application, even if you don't explicitly list them as a reference, the employer can contact them.  In fact, even if you ask them not to contact your supervisor they still can without legal ramification - although few employers would do that.  And it's not 100% uncommon for employers to find contact information for former employers you listed.  It's not even that hard.  AskAManager.com has written a couple of posts about this.

 

Think about it from their perspective.  Say you work at ABC Company and Jill Scott applies.  Jill Scott has worked for your old grad school buddy Rob Smith, but she didn't list him as a reference - all of her references are co-workers.  You trust Rob Smith's judgment AND you really want to hear from a supervisor of Jill's.  Wouldn't you want to call Rob Smith and find out what he thinks about her?  A good employer would contact Jill first and make sure that there's no legitimate reason precluding them from calling Rob (i.e., she still works there and doesn't want him to know she's leaving) but many employers don't do this.

 

That's why it's up to job hunters to explicitly say whether or not they want prior employers contacted, if they list that employers' information on a job form.  But this is not damaging your career, not in any legal sense anyway.

[danieleWrites]

To add to what Julliette has already said, there isn't legal recourse if a potential employer tells someone else that they're interested in hiring Person A, specifically, and thereby ruining that person's career. There is legal recourse if certain things, which are legally required to be confidential (FERPA, HIPPA, social security numbers, etc.) are released. There is legal recourse if Person A and the potential employer have a signed contract about confidentiality. There is no legal recourse otherwise, even if Person A asks the search committee to keep it confidential.

 

I have no idea why applying for a job is a career ruiner. That seems very fishy.

 

Where there is recourse is if a Person A were denied further candidacy in the program for accepting a job, unless the graduate school regulations make it clear, in writing, that applying for a job at another university will result in termination of candidacy, or whatever. If the rules of the school make it clear that Person A's employment during candidacy will affect Person A's candidacy, then why is Person A applying for a job? If the problem rests with the adviser, not the department or the graduate school, then if the job interview gets leaked to the adviser, who then begins to make trouble, Person A should speak to the director of graduate studies for the department (if that person is not the adviser) or speak to someone in the graduate school. Universities have a vested interest in having their students employed: employment figures are directly tied to prestige.

[Academicat]

I know this is an old thread, but I want to add my search committee experience to the conversation for future job-seekers. I've been NTT faculty in a growing department at a major university for a few years, and I've been on quite a few search committees. It is not uncommon for the search committee to ask, at the end of an interview, for permission to "contact references, both listed and unlisted." Academe is a small world, especially within your field, so chances are, someone on that search committee is familiar with someone at your current institution. Those are your unlisted references.

 

Of course, the committee only bothers to contact references, a time-consuming process, if they are serious about the candidate, so if your situation is delicate, talk to the chair of the search committee. Chances are, if they are nearing the campus interview point, they're ready to start wooing you and will do what they can to avoid putting you in an uncomfortable situation.