Polemic Posted January 4, 2015 Posted January 4, 2015 (edited) Hi all, I am currently an undergraduate freshmen attending a major university in the District of Columbia. I realize that I am still young and am far away from going to graduate school, but I have a strong ambition to eventually earn a Ph.D. in modern European history. I am currently focusing on taking history courses and maintaining high grades in them. I wanted to know if there was any advice that anyone here could offer for current undergraduates who have an ambition to eventually attend graduate school? I want to keep the advice in mind as I continue to progress in my undergraduate academic career. If anyone could share advice about things to take advantage of during the summer, independent research, and developing relationships with faculty—it would be greatly appreciated. Again, I will emphasize that I am just looking for advice to make the most of my undergraduate experience. I am in no way concerned with the graduate school application process right now. Edited January 4, 2015 by Polemical
MathCat Posted January 5, 2015 Posted January 5, 2015 Keep your GPA up, form good relationships with your professors, and try to get research experience. But also realize that you may very well change your goals between now and graduating. Only one person I know is graduating with the degree that they had planned on when they first started. All the rest changed majors around 2nd or 3rd year as they were exposed to new things. I'm not saying you will definitely change your mind, but keep an open mind to the possibility. thedig13 1
ashiepoo72 Posted January 5, 2015 Posted January 5, 2015 Work on languages! I would recommend this to future americanists too, but it's especially important for anyone studying areas outside of the U.S. Languages will give you a leg up when applying to grad school or are, in many cases, a basic requirement for admission. Start building relationships with professors, especially in your field. Take several classes with the same professors, ask them about research opportunities, visit them in office hours to discuss your coursework and goals, etc. Show them you're a serious student of history so when the time comes they can give you advice based on in-depth knowledge of your work/goals and can write your recs. Don't view them as simply potential rec writers, though. Making professional connections will be important throughout your career--some of these professors will one day be your colleagues if you enter academia. It goes beyond the more transitory need of a LOR. Start thinking about doing a senior thesis. I didn't do one because I had no idea what I wanted to do as a freshmen, but it's definitely something you should do. I'd also recommend buying a Chicago Manual of Style book (I think it's on the 16th edition) or Turabian research/citing guide book. You might want to look for books on historiography--get familiar with how historians study history instead of how history is studied in high school and early college. Historians go beyond factual knowledge and delve into the history of how history was and is written, so now is a good time for you to read the seminal works in your field. It's a good idea to sign up for table of contents notifications for the journals related to your field, that'll show you what new works are being written. I'm sure others will have more and different advice, but this is basically the stuff I wish I knew as a freshmen in college. It took me 2 years in the wrong major for me to figure out history was right for me, and then I had to navigate MA apps with very little knowledge of how to study history at the grad level. Good luck! spellbanisher 1
Polemic Posted January 5, 2015 Author Posted January 5, 2015 Keep your GPA up, form good relationships with your professors, and try to get research experience. But also realize that you may very well change your goals between now and graduating. Only one person I know is graduating with the degree that they had planned on when they first started. All the rest changed majors around 2nd or 3rd year as they were exposed to new things. I'm not saying you will definitely change your mind, but keep an open mind to the possibility. Thank you! I am definitely keeping an open mind about other fields of study. I have taken coursework in political science, philosophy, and mathematics in the fall. During the spring I will be doing more coursework in political science and biological sciences. I am trying to make sure I give as many fields as possible a chance, and with my institution's flexible liberal arts curriculum that is possible. I appreciate your feedback. MathCat 1
Polemic Posted January 5, 2015 Author Posted January 5, 2015 Work on languages! I would recommend this to future americanists too, but it's especially important for anyone studying areas outside of the U.S. Languages will give you a leg up when applying to grad school or are, in many cases, a basic requirement for admission. Start building relationships with professors, especially in your field. Take several classes with the same professors, ask them about research opportunities, visit them in office hours to discuss your coursework and goals, etc. Show them you're a serious student of history so when the time comes they can give you advice based on in-depth knowledge of your work/goals and can write your recs. Don't view them as simply potential rec writers, though. Making professional connections will be important throughout your career--some of these professors will one day be your colleagues if you enter academia. It goes beyond the more transitory need of a LOR. Start thinking about doing a senior thesis. I didn't do one because I had no idea what I wanted to do as a freshmen, but it's definitely something you should do. I'd also recommend buying a Chicago Manual of Style book (I think it's on the 16th edition) or Turabian research/citing guide book. You might want to look for books on historiography--get familiar with how historians study history instead of how history is studied in high school and early college. Historians go beyond factual knowledge and delve into the history of how history was and is written, so now is a good time for you to read the seminal works in your field. It's a good idea to sign up for table of contents notifications for the journals related to your field, that'll show you what new works are being written. I'm sure others will have more and different advice, but this is basically the stuff I wish I knew as a freshmen in college. It took me 2 years in the wrong major for me to figure out history was right for me, and then I had to navigate MA apps with very little knowledge of how to study history at the grad level. Good luck! Thank you so much for this fantastic advice! I plan on studying German throughout the rest of my undergraduate career. I have already found a professor that has very similar academic interest to mine, and we have really developed a great relationship with one another. I am taking another course with him (it is actually seminar to European historiography) next semester! I am extremely excited by the prospect of potentially working with him on future projects. I will definitely make sure to get a copy of the Turabian citation guidelines because that appears to be the standard in the history courses I have taken. I have already met with the undergraduate advisor for the history department, and he has encouraged me to begin thinking about a senior thesis and potential topics for it. I hope to do the honors thesis that the department offers, and so this is going to be my focus going forward.
theartman1193 Posted January 5, 2015 Posted January 5, 2015 I would try to go with 2 languages. Again, these languages should parallel your field of study. For example, a 20th century historian with an interest in WWII might find it helpful to know German in addition to French, Russian, or Italian. Having close relationships with professors is a must. I would also try to get yourself involved in your field outside of the school - lectures, talks, publications, an interesting internship at a history museum (D.C has so many!).
Polemic Posted January 5, 2015 Author Posted January 5, 2015 I would try to go with 2 languages. Again, these languages should parallel your field of study. For example, a 20th century historian with an interest in WWII might find it helpful to know German in addition to French, Russian, or Italian. Having close relationships with professors is a must. I would also try to get yourself involved in your field outside of the school - lectures, talks, publications, an interesting internship at a history museum (D.C has so many!). Thank you for this great advice. I am born in Poland, and it is my native language. I plan on taking German throughout college in order for it to serve as my third language, and hopefully become fluent enough to be able to translate primary documents. Aside from that, I will keep your advice about looking outside of school. I plan on staying in Washington D.C. over the summer (through school funding), and hopefully I will be able to pick something up on the side in order to accommodate my academic interests.
maelia8 Posted January 5, 2015 Posted January 5, 2015 I recommend starting to look into post-undergrad programs that you can do between undergrad and grad school in order to make you a richer and more diverse candidate when you apply. I know a few people who applied to grad school right out of undergrad and were accepted, but the vast majority did something else for a year or two that made them even better candidates. For example, I got a Fulbright grant to teach English as as a foreign language in the country that I research (and whose language I speak), then spent some of the two years that I was there doing summer internships in the country (at vastly reduced cost, since I was already living there) and doing independent archival research as well as honing my teaching skills. I'm sure that it made me a much better candidate than I would have been coming out of undergrad. Other programs besides Fulbright include Peace Corps and other international English teaching programs besides the Fulbright one. Anything that you can do to get more time and experience in your primary country of research before grad school is a plus. I'd also start looking into the honors process at your university, and whether it's an option to write an honors thesis. This could eventually form the basis for a really good writing sample when you later apply to grad school. If you can't find a paid internship, try to volunteer at a local historical society or archive in the summer, just to get a feel for archival research and organization. I also second the language advice. My program requires French and German for scholars of modern Europe, along with any other local languages necessary for research. It's also possible to get scholarships for language learning at summer language intensive programs, such as the Middlebury or Monterey institutes. Good luck with your preparation! spellbanisher and Polemic 2
Polemic Posted January 5, 2015 Author Posted January 5, 2015 I recommend starting to look into post-undergrad programs that you can do between undergrad and grad school in order to make you a richer and more diverse candidate when you apply. I know a few people who applied to grad school right out of undergrad and were accepted, but the vast majority did something else for a year or two that made them even better candidates. For example, I got a Fulbright grant to teach English as as a foreign language in the country that I research (and whose language I speak), then spent some of the two years that I was there doing summer internships in the country (at vastly reduced cost, since I was already living there) and doing independent archival research as well as honing my teaching skills. I'm sure that it made me a much better candidate than I would have been coming out of undergrad. Other programs besides Fulbright include Peace Corps and other international English teaching programs besides the Fulbright one. Anything that you can do to get more time and experience in your primary country of research before grad school is a plus. I'd also start looking into the honors process at your university, and whether it's an option to write an honors thesis. This could eventually form the basis for a really good writing sample when you later apply to grad school. If you can't find a paid internship, try to volunteer at a local historical society or archive in the summer, just to get a feel for archival research and organization. I also second the language advice. My program requires French and German for scholars of modern Europe, along with any other local languages necessary for research. It's also possible to get scholarships for language learning at summer language intensive programs, such as the Middlebury or Monterey institutes. Good luck with your preparation! This is some really fantastic insight, I truly appreciate it! I will keep in mind some of the options that are available post-undergraduate. I want to be able to to gather as much time necessary to decide whether or not pursuing graduate school will be the best option for me, and developing myself as a strong candidate after completing an undergraduate degree definitely has its benefits. As for the honors thesis, it is something I have already discussed with my undergraduate advisor and am working on with my faculty advisor. It is something I have been thinking about. I also intend to do an independent research project my junior year, with faculty guidance, with hopes to develop my research skills. Thank you all for the fantastic insight!
kblooms Posted January 5, 2015 Posted January 5, 2015 Do an honors thesis as said above, but be sure you can pare it down to a really good writing sample of circa 20-30 pages doublespaced; those are often the limits for history programs and it won't do as much good if you have a really excellent 60 page thesis.
thedig13 Posted January 5, 2015 Posted January 5, 2015 Do an honors thesis as said above, but be sure you can pare it down to a really good writing sample of circa 20-30 pages doublespaced; those are often the limits for history programs and it won't do as much good if you have a really excellent 60 page thesis. I second this. Most programs expect the writing sample to be 20-25 pages; some want it to be as small as 10 pages. For somebody who's put a lot of effort into producing a 50-page thesis, chopping a quality work (one that you've worked hard on) down to 25 pages can be frustrating and difficult. For this reason, I deliberately aimed for the 20-25 page range when writing my thesis -- so that when it came time to send writing samples, minimal butchering would be necessary. Of course, if your undergrad program requires a thesis to be a certain length, that changes matters.
maelia8 Posted January 5, 2015 Posted January 5, 2015 My honors thesis came in at around 75 pages, so I just chose my favorite sections from the introduction, conclusion, and one body section (my favorite) to submit as my writing sample. It's less important to have a perfect cohesive 20-25 page paper than it is to showcase your best writing and research skills, and in my case, the honors thesis represented the best work that I had completed at that time. Another issue is that writing sample requirements vary widely from school to school (some allowed submission of a paper up to 75 pages, others 25 pages, and the one that I ended up attending wanted just 10 pages!), so it's pretty much impossible to prepare one paper that fits all possible length requirements right off the bat. You're going to have to do some butchering regardless, and I personally preferred to pull small sections from a much larger paper rather than cut a short paper in half or by a third (which is harder to do and maintain the paper's integrity). However, this is simply my preference thedig13 and Polemic 2
ashiepoo72 Posted January 5, 2015 Posted January 5, 2015 I used a 30 page seminar paper for my writing sample. The original was solid with lots of original research, but most programs I applied to wanted between 15-25 pages. I asked my professor (who helped guide and inform my research for the paper) tell me what parts he thought I could cut out and what I should add. Thankfully I didn't need to cut to 10 pages (that must have been tough, maelia!). I ended up with roughly 23 pages that were much stronger for having been pared down. My takeaway is, don't worry so much about writing a thesis to a certain page length (except perhaps to make sure it's not inordinately long), worry about writing a strong thesis with solid primary source research. Second takeaway--build strong relationships with professors (I know I already said this, but it's worth repeating). Seriously--my professors did a TON of work to help me prepare applications, including looking at multiple SOP and writing sample drafts, in addition to writing recommendations. Profs are your best resource. maelia8 and Polemic 2
fopdandyhomo Posted January 5, 2015 Posted January 5, 2015 Definitely focus on language prep, as others have said. As for thesis length, mine was 80 or so pages. For my writing sample, I picked a section of my thesis I thought stood well on its own and provided an abstract to contextualize the argument I was making. I had one request to send the rest of my thesis in, but who knows if this strategy will work. Focus on close analysis of primary sources. In terms of summer work, I only spent one summer doing research. My other summers in college were spent making money. I don't think this is a strike against me. Having the time to read for pleasure and make money (which I saved) will probably be beneficial in the long run. But try to save $1000 or so for apps. By the time you apply, most fees will be around $100 (or more!) and the GRE will be well over $200 plus at least $27 to send your reports to each school.
maelia8 Posted January 8, 2015 Posted January 8, 2015 I second fopdandyhomo, application is quite expensive, especially if you are planning on applying to more than 5 or 6 schools. My father agreed to fund me through one application cycle, and I applied to just 6 schools, but that still cost over $800 when all costs are factored in. I thank goodness that I managed to get in on the first try, because I might not have had the funds to try again.
TMP Posted January 9, 2015 Posted January 9, 2015 In addition to all the excellent suggestions above, consider reading more books than you think you can. Or at least, the next time you take your finals, imagine studying for and doing 50 of those at once. *crawls back to the hideout where books for comprehensive exam await* thedig13 1
APBrown Posted January 10, 2015 Posted January 10, 2015 There have been some really good suggestions already and I agree with everything that has been said so far. I have a few of my own thoughts and I apologize if these have already been said before. You are going to have to remember, especially if you are applying to really competitive programs, that having a strong application alone won't necessarily get you into places. There will possibly be hundreds of other strong applications, so you'll need to find ways to make your application and your name stand out. If your school has a chapter of Phi Alpha Theta, get involved with that as soon as you are eligible. Not only will you get to help put on their various activities, you'll get the opportunity to present your research at conferences. This is an important difference between undergrad and graduate work. The primary shift is in undergrad the focus is on the consumption of history, while in graduate school you're expected to take part in the production of history. Especially if you are in DC, you should have access to many wonderful archives. Take advantage of that. Also, if during your time as an undergrad, before you apply to places, you may want to consider getting something published. Note this: for entering a graduate program, a publication is by no means expected for admission but if you have a publication it is certainly a plus. Here is a list of undergraduate history journals you may want to submit to: http://history.unc.edu/undergraduate-program/undergraduate-journals/ Last thing, when applying for graduate school, also consider MA programs. I decided to get an MA before I started my PhD program and I believe it was the right way to go, for me at least. If you are not sure exactly what you want to research by the time you are applying to grad programs, need more time for language study, or if you want to test out graduate work before you make a 6-8 year commitment, it is a reasonable way to go. Of course, if you feel ready for PhD work right out of college, I suggest you start right away. I hope some of this helped! Polemic 1
Polemic Posted January 11, 2015 Author Posted January 11, 2015 There have been some really good suggestions already and I agree with everything that has been said so far. I have a few of my own thoughts and I apologize if these have already been said before. You are going to have to remember, especially if you are applying to really competitive programs, that having a strong application alone won't necessarily get you into places. There will possibly be hundreds of other strong applications, so you'll need to find ways to make your application and your name stand out. If your school has a chapter of Phi Alpha Theta, get involved with that as soon as you are eligible. Not only will you get to help put on their various activities, you'll get the opportunity to present your research at conferences. This is an important difference between undergrad and graduate work. The primary shift is in undergrad the focus is on the consumption of history, while in graduate school you're expected to take part in the production of history. Especially if you are in DC, you should have access to many wonderful archives. Take advantage of that. Also, if during your time as an undergrad, before you apply to places, you may want to consider getting something published. Note this: for entering a graduate program, a publication is by no means expected for admission but if you have a publication it is certainly a plus. Here is a list of undergraduate history journals you may want to submit to: http://history.unc.edu/undergraduate-program/undergraduate-journals/ Last thing, when applying for graduate school, also consider MA programs. I decided to get an MA before I started my PhD program and I believe it was the right way to go, for me at least. If you are not sure exactly what you want to research by the time you are applying to grad programs, need more time for language study, or if you want to test out graduate work before you make a 6-8 year commitment, it is a reasonable way to go. Of course, if you feel ready for PhD work right out of college, I suggest you start right away. I hope some of this helped! This was really fantastic advice, thank you so much for this. And to everyone else that has responded to this thread. I'm ready to take full advantage of my undergraduate experience to grow as a person and a hopeful historian. All this advice will certainly be beneficial as I look forward. Of course, I welcome others to provide their input.
maelia8 Posted January 11, 2015 Posted January 11, 2015 This has been hinted at before by myself and other posters, but here's another helpful thing to keep in mind: there's more than one road that leads to entering a history Ph.D. program, so please don't think that you have do do every single one of the things listed above, in the proper order, and stress yourself out trying to become the perfect candidate while you're still an undergrad. The vast majority of the people in my cohort/program did not proceed on a linear trajectory from Bachelors to Masters to Ph.D., and they did all sorts of things out in the real world in between: working at a think thank, teaching overseas, working for a corporation, even taking a dead-end job in order to save money. Often, it's one of these experiences that really allows you some perspective to step back and consider whether you really want to go back to school and get a Ph.D. Remain open to experiences that may help you as a potential Ph.D. candidate, but try not to become singleminded in that pursuit to the point of eliminating experiences that will make you a richer person but may not directly contribute to your linear application trajectory. Many, many different roads can lead to Rome, and some of them meander more than others, so if you end up on one of those roads, try to enjoy it
TMP Posted January 12, 2015 Posted January 12, 2015 Agreed with above. I had a very winding... frustrating road to the PhD. I went from BA to MA and then got rejected for the PhD. In the two years I was out of school, I spent the time looking for jobs, living in Europe studying a language, volunteered in a therapeutic center, worked as a camp counselor (and working alongside 16 year olds at ripe age of 25!), and interning in a museum in a fabulous city. My life is richer for those experiences and puts better perspective on what kinds of historical and historiographical questions I'm most interested in. Don't be afraid to step out for a bit.
HistoryMystery Posted January 20, 2015 Posted January 20, 2015 This has been hinted at before by myself and other posters, but here's another helpful thing to keep in mind: there's more than one road that leads to entering a history Ph.D. program, so please don't think that you have do do every single one of the things listed above, in the proper order, and stress yourself out trying to become the perfect candidate while you're still an undergrad. The vast majority of the people in my cohort/program did not proceed on a linear trajectory from Bachelors to Masters to Ph.D., and they did all sorts of things out in the real world in between: working at a think thank, teaching overseas, working for a corporation, even taking a dead-end job in order to save money. Often, it's one of these experiences that really allows you some perspective to step back and consider whether you really want to go back to school and get a Ph.D. Remain open to experiences that may help you as a potential Ph.D. candidate, but try not to become singleminded in that pursuit to the point of eliminating experiences that will make you a richer person but may not directly contribute to your linear application trajectory. Many, many different roads can lead to Rome, and some of them meander more than others, so if you end up on one of those roads, try to enjoy it True, many of the TAs I had as an undergrad were older (~26-31) and already had life experience. That being said, if you feel ready don't stop yourself from applying to PhDs right off the bat. The biggest thing I can think of is to establish a relationship with a professor or two. Everyone can get three LORs, but what you really want is a professor who WANTS to write a LOR for you. Also one that is aligned with your research interests. I applied to 2015 programs so I don't know if I got in yet, but the POIs I've talked to all know my undergraduate professor advisor and thus it was an easy way to make a connection/ give them an idea of what my research interests are. Oh, and take more than one senior capstone class if you can. That's how I cultivated professor relationships, and how I was able to do some independent grad-level research with one of them as a senior. Also consider taking history courses in unrelated fields to show adcoms you branched out a bit.
kotov Posted January 25, 2015 Posted January 25, 2015 Improve your language skills as much as possible and try to get as good of an idea of what you want to research as you can. The two best things you can demonstrate when you're applying (your GPA, test scores, etc. aside) are that you already have the requisite language skills to do research in your field and that you have a clear idea of the direction in which you want to go with your research. Obviously your research interests may change some once you start grad school (mine did), but the better of an idea you have and the more specifically you can address the level of preparation you have to conduct the research you're proposing to come there to do, the better. Also, obviously, yeah, establish good relationships with as many professors as you can, etc.
anthrohis7092 Posted January 26, 2015 Posted January 26, 2015 (edited) Like others, I would spend time perfecting language skills (especially reading), learning new languages if you have time (one of my lifetime goals is to speak, write, and read fluently 5 languages) because it will come into use one day, maintain undergraduate GPA (preferable above 3.5, but ideally higher for most top ranked programs), travel and observe as much as you can (if possible lurk around the archives even if you're not searching for anything in particular--trust me it gives you good feel), excellent writing sample, and do something fun at school while you're fretting over career prospects/PhD programs etc (I was singing tenor in a choir my senior year in college. It totally kept me sane!) Oh have a summer reading list, ideally in your intended field of study. This helps you a lot toward mastering the literature and have a concrete idea of the field--something you may want to show in your SOP. Edited January 26, 2015 by anthrohis7092
gsc Posted January 27, 2015 Posted January 27, 2015 Oh have a summer reading list, ideally in your intended field of study. This helps you a lot toward mastering the literature and have a concrete idea of the field--something you may want to show in your SOP. Though I think getting experience in the field is important, I would disagree with this advice. By just reading on your own, you're liable to get the literature mixed up, whereas when you're doing reading in the context of a class you have the professor and other students to guide your thinking. If you're looking to get experience in the field, something like studying abroad, completing a senior thesis, or doing an internship related to the field can all help shape the questions you want to ask, and you can more clearly show the impacts of those experiences on your research interests in your application. Case in point: I got experience in women's history by working in a women's history archive, which actually gave me a really interesting perspective on writing women's history... and that formed the backbone of my SOP.
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