Crush on another grad student

[Grad_ab]

Sorry if this is the wrong forum for this.

 

So...like the title says, I kind of have a crush on another grad student....Trouble is, she's in my department, though it is pretty big, and her adviser isn't someone I'll be working with...

Any advice? (I swear I'm an adult, lol)

[xypathos]

My honest advice is not to date within your department. While it could end well (marriage), if it doesn't it only creates bad blood between potential colleagues and tension within the department among fellow students as they navigate that social conundrum.

That said, it happens and I've seen it end well, just be smart about it. We obviously spend a lot of time around each other and become emotionally invested so feelings are natural. 

EDIT: Here's an older thread with advice: 

 

Edited October 23, 2016 by xypathos

[dr. t]

Department booty is bad booty.

[bhr]

7 hours ago, telkanuru said:

Department booty is bad booty.

Eh. My program has had multiple couples during my time here, two of whom have gotten married during graduate school, and I know a ton of other couples across my field who started dating in their PhD programs. On it's face there is nothing wrong with dating inside your program, as long as you are capable of being adult about it, there are  no power structure issues involved (lab supervisor), and no one is married to someone else (long story).

In grad school you spend years where most of your time is around the same people, so it's natural for relationships to form. You spend lots of time together, travel to the same conference, share the same interests, etc, so it's not a shock that this happens. That said, I'll give you some advice:

• If you are interested in someone, ask them out. Be upfront that this isn't just a "hang with colleague" moment.
• Do this in private, but don't make them feel confronted or trapped. Don't put them on the spot.
• IF they say no, walk away. Drop it, drop the crush, avoid them in the short term. Do nothing to make this seem like harassment.
• If you choose to date, disclose this to your advisor or graduate director. (This depends on the nature of your department, but it's best to be aboveboard if anything goes sideways).
• Realize that the nature of academic life means that being in a couple can severely impact your job search.

[DogsArePeopleToo]

I've had a comparable experience. I've dated within my organization. It went very well as long as it went well. When it didn't, our mutual circles of friends learned about it and things got quite awkward. When we broke up, it was harder for either of us to then date someone else within the organization. We were in different departments and our daily work didn't overlap, but everyone kind of knew, or knew about, each of us and our shared history...everyone was everyone's friend, colleague, supervisor, floor mate, water cooler buddy, cubicle companion, departmental cousin, happy hour hombre, etc.

It took about a year to move out of the whole episode of social awkwardness that surrounded us like an invisible aura.

A simple rule of thumb is that if you're both serious about the future of any potential relationship, it is probably worth the risk to do it because both of you are more likely to behave more maturely. If it's going to be a sniffing ritual, a one-night stand, a one-month dating phase, etc., it has the potential of getting a little awkward and becoming the stuff of departmental gossip, though it might be manageable depending on the culture of your program.

And finally, it's worth checking to see if your program has rules about it.

Oh, and also, some people prefer to keep the dating on the down low, at least for a little while. It helps that both parties are on the same page about that.

Edited October 24, 2016 by DogsArePeopleToo

[ThousandsHardships]

I know a ton of people who date and marry within their field. Several of my professors are married to each other, in fact. It can be great to have a partner who understands your field and whom you can potentially collaborate with in the future. As long as you're both mature enough to not let your personal life affect your professional decisions, breakups shouldn't be a problem. And since you don't even work under the same adviser, there is no need to fret over it.

[TakeruK]

7 hours ago, bhr said:

If you choose to date, disclose this to your advisor or graduate director. (This depends on the nature of your department, but it's best to be aboveboard if anything goes sideways).

I think the rest of the post is good advice, but I would caution against automatically following this point. My opinion is that unless you are required to do this by department policy (although I can't imagine a department having this policy for graduate student couples), do not disclose this out of any feeling of obligation etc.

It can depend on the relationship you have with your advisor though. If you have one where you regularly share personal stories then sure, go ahead and do it. Personally, I feel that matters like this are too personal for me to share with my advisor, but that's just me. However, if you do choose to share with your advisor, make sure your partner is also okay with this. 

I have never seen a department policy that even slightly discourages graduate student couples and definitely never anything to the extent of requiring disclosure (is this even legal?). The graduate director does not (and should not!) keep a little book of every relationship in their department. There are plenty of graduate student couples in my field, whether they join grad school together or meet in grad school. Generally, grad students do not have power over each other, so from legal and ethical standpoints, there is little reason to monitor or restrict these relationships. I'm speaking generally here, if there is a situation where a student somehow actually has power over another, then this doesn't apply of course!

[bhr]

8 hours ago, TakeruK said:

I think the rest of the post is good advice, but I would caution against automatically following this point. My opinion is that unless you are required to do this by department policy (although I can't imagine a department having this policy for graduate student couples), do not disclose this out of any feeling of obligation etc.

It can depend on the relationship you have with your advisor though. If you have one where you regularly share personal stories then sure, go ahead and do it. Personally, I feel that matters like this are too personal for me to share with my advisor, but that's just me. However, if you do choose to share with your advisor, make sure your partner is also okay with this. 

I have never seen a department policy that even slightly discourages graduate student couples and definitely never anything to the extent of requiring disclosure (is this even legal?). The graduate director does not (and should not!) keep a little book of every relationship in their department. There are plenty of graduate student couples in my field, whether they join grad school together or meet in grad school. Generally, grad students do not have power over each other, so from legal and ethical standpoints, there is little reason to monitor or restrict these relationships. I'm speaking generally here, if there is a situation where a student somehow actually has power over another, then this doesn't apply of course!

I guess this is more a "culture of the department" thing. I just would want to avoid any situations where one person gets put in position to have some power/control/influence over the other (like on grad oversight committee or w/e).

[TakeruK]

33 minutes ago, bhr said:

I guess this is more a "culture of the department" thing. I just would want to avoid any situations where one person gets put in position to have some power/control/influence over the other (like on grad oversight committee or w/e).

Fair enough. In my department, grad students in 2nd year and above will TA classes taken by 1st year grad students, so that's a power dynamic that's important to be mindful as well. 

But my philosophy is that you only need to disclose this when it comes up, and probably best for the one in the position of power to disclose it anonymously if possible. That is, if my partner was a student in the class I'm TAing (again, grad students TAing other grad students), then I would let the prof in charge know that one of the students (not necessarily naming who) is in a relationship with me and that I am willing to TA another class if necessary. Similarly, if a student was put on an oversight committee that actually has power over another student, then the student should excuse themselves and leave the discussion if that committee discusses their partner. (And where possible, make arrangements for an alternative committee member if they saw this conflict coming).

[maelia8]

I wouldn't date within my department, because I'd be too afraid of possible fallout in case the relationship ended, but several people in my department do, and all the couples I've heard of (four couples in total, out of about 140 graduate students) have gone on to get married/last for the long term. I know several more cases of hookups within the department, but not actual dating. Many more graduate students in my department date students from other grad departments tangentially related to ours (ex: English, Economics, Political Science, Film & Media, or area studies) even in the same building, because then it's "safe" as you could break up and not have to see the other person if you didn't have to. 

[dr. t]

On 10/24/2016 at 4:27 AM, bhr said:

Eh. My program has had multiple couples during my time here, two of whom have gotten married during graduate school, and I know a ton of other couples across my field who started dating in their PhD programs. On it's face there is nothing wrong with dating inside your program, as long as you are capable of being adult about it, there are  no power structure issues involved (lab supervisor), and no one is married to someone else (long story).

Ah, one of my favorite academic past times: the "yes" couched in a flurry of caveats that render it an effective "no".

[bhr]

5 minutes ago, telkanuru said:

Ah, one of my favorite academic past times: the "yes" couched in a flurry of caveats that render it an effective "no".

The short version is "if you can be a fucking adult about it, then sure," because a whole lot of people can't be, and grad students, in general, tend to be a bit emotionally stunted (med students/residents are worse, but still...)

[dr. t]

1 hour ago, bhr said:

The short version is "if you can be a fucking adult about it, then sure," because a whole lot of people can't be, and grad students, in general, tend to be a bit emotionally stunted (med students/residents are worse, but still...)

Yes, exactly.

[Almaqah Thwn]

Generally, dating someone in your own program is a bad idea. It is relatively awkward to ask them for a radiocarbon sample and it is much cheaper and more accurate to just ask them how old they are. 

[rising_star]

Honestly, people here are so negative about this! While in grad school, I dated a student in my department (actually, I did this more than once but, we'll stick with one story for this post). It started out pretty casually and I honestly didn't know they were into me for a while. But, once I figured it out and we started dating, we weren't flaunting it but we also weren't hiding it. It ultimately didn't work out and we broke up after a few months but remained friends (we might've even been in a class together throughout all of this) and no one even thought about it a few months after that. Another couple began in our program at the same time and those two are happily married today so, you never know. If you like the person, you should give it a shot just to see what will happen. "Forget regret - or life is yours to miss" as Jonathan Larson put it.

[dr. t]

Just because something occasionally works out really well does not mean it doesn't occasionally turn into an unmitigated disaster. The social entanglement inherent in the situation makes those occasional disasters much worse. 

[TakeruK]

My experience in grad school has been that almost all relationships between grad students in the same department have ended well**. So from my perspective, it's not just that something occasionally works. Instead, I would say that the really bad breakups where there is lasting drama/conflict and awkwardness is pretty rare. I can only recall one instance out of the 20-30 relationships I know of. 

** To clarify, when I say "end well", I don't mean that they ended with the students married to each other. Sometimes a relationship is just meant to try something out and if it doesn't work, both parties move on to other things. Ending well just means that the relationship ends but both parties can still interact with each other as professionals. Maybe there are a few weeks of initial awkwardness between both parties and their social circles but if it fades with time, then it's fine. Also, maybe if the two students were friends before but are no longer friends after the relationship ends, that's fine too. The whole department doesn't have to be friends with each other!

At one point, there was a department I know that had about 25 grad students and I think there were 5 or 6 couples within the department (i.e. almost half of the students were dating or married to each other). I think it was a fluke though, people graduated and the density of couples dropped soon after.

(Although I wonder if there is significant confirmation bias happening here. Do I not remember the bad breakups because I suppress bad memories? Or do people remember the dramatic endings/breakups more than the relationships that just fizzled out? Probably some of both?)