How difficult is it to get into PhD Social Work/Welfare Programs?

[TigerMem]

Hi all,

I will graduate in May with an MSW and my plan is to get my LMSW, secure a job, and start applying to PhD Social Work/Welfare programs for Fall 2019 entry. I wanted to get advice on how to strengthen my application and opinions on if I have a shot at getting in. My current MSW GPA is 3.75 from a public state university. I have an undergrad 3.09 cumulative GPA and a 3.79 major (Psychology) GPA; 2-3 years of clinical experience (including internships); no research experience or publications. I'm working on my personal statement and retaking the GRE. (My first-time GRE scores were 150V, 145Q, 4.0A but I didn't study much).

I'm applying to 8-10 PhD programs (my top choices are Berkley, Penn, U of Chicago, Brandeis, & Columbia) and a few researched oriented Master's programs, like University of Oxford's MSc in Evidence Based Social Intervention and Policy Analysis. From doing a little research and reading previous threads - it appears that PhD Social Work/Welfare programs aren't as competitive as other fields, for example PhD Clinical Psychology programs, but are still difficult to get into.  I don't know if its imposter syndrome at play here, but I'm worried that I wouldn't be a strong applicant for PhD programs,  especially with my lack research experience.  

Any input would be much appreciated! 

Edited April 1, 2018 by TigerMem

[Adelaide9216]

I've been told that it isn't that hard to get accepted into PhD programs in social work, at least in my Canada. Most social workers practice, rather that do research so I guess that partially explains it. I think it all depends also if your research interests fits with the interests of your potential supervisor and the expertise of the university you're applying to. You do sound like a strong applicant. I think you should apply, you've got nothing to lose. 

 

 

Edited April 1, 2018 by Adelaide9216

[SWjdg]

As someone who recently applied and got accepted - it entirely depends on what schools you are applying to. The ones you mentioned are all tier 1 social work schools and WILL be difficult to get in. You will need to compensate for your low undergrad GPA, retake your GRE, and try to get research experience if you want a good chance to get into any of those schools. 

[Val006]

I am in my 3rd year PhD in a Social Work Program at a top 10 R1 institute. I applied for 5 psychology PhD programs and 2 Social Work programs, I got into none of the PhD programs (however i have an undergrad and master's degree in social work).  I think a big critique depending on the program you apply for is having a minimum of two years in the field prior to application.  I had low GRE scores however because I had 5 years of experience and varied experience in the field,  I think it helped round out my application.  I would suggest really making a strong argument about why you do not need 2 years (for example you have a strong focus and know you want to pursue research etc.) As I mentioned our school wont even look at applications unless they have 2 years post MSW experience so i would encourage you to check out the schools you are interested in and prepare to have a strong justification.  Speaking to our school again, we typically get 35-50 applicants and accept 4-6 so its not overly competitive.  It sounds like you are well positioned.  If you have any questions, feel free to message me.  Good luck!

[briannn]

I am graduating with my MSW this Aug, and starting my PhD program in Social Work three days later. From my understanding, regardless of the program you apply to in any field, if your research interests are not a match to the school they will not consider you since they have to consider funding etc. So research the schools and the faculty members and find those faculty member who you believe would be interested in picking you up as a student. Reach out and connect with the Director of the program. I know my relationship with the Director helped push my application through.

Considering that applying to PhD programs is arduous and overwhelming, I think this feeling of "imposter syndrome" can resonate among most of us who have applied to the programs, so you are definitely not alone. I would encourage that you try your best to strengthen your applications with higher GRE scores. Try your best and if you don't make it through this cycle, you can always apply again next cycle.  Your worth is not determined by whether you get accepted or denied into these programs

Good luck

[scthorne]

@TigerMem

I am planning on applying for 2019 as well! I will also be applying to Berkeley and U of Chicago. I'm also looking at UCLA, USC, and UW (I've got a real west coast bias  ).

So far I've been focusing on holding informational interviews with faculty members that I would be interested in having as mentors. Everyone has been very open to talking with me about the program, their work, and the application process. This has also given me an opportunity to give them my CV and get feedback on what I should focus on improving before December. It's been a fantastic experience for me so far (just today I spoke to a faculty member from Berkeley over the phone) and a great way to get to know the people behind the schools. Some schools offer admissions advising appointments as well!

Like you, I'm also working on improving my GRE score. My scores were 155 V, 157 Q, and 4.0 W the first time around. I have practically no clinical experience (macro-practice focus for my MSW) and some research experience. Thanks to a fantastic field instructor, I'm co-authoring a book that will be published in August 2019 and am currently assisting on a research article.

Impostor syndrome is really real and really sucks. I felt it in the first year of my MSW program and I am feeling it now. A big thing that I have heard from the faculty I have spoken to is that a lot of people enter these programs without much prior research experience. What they're really looking for is someone that is an overall good fit to the program, school, and area of focus who has the drive to learn.

If you don't mind my asking, what type of research or population are you interested in?

[TigerMem]

@scthorne 

I'm primarily interested in child and family welfare, poverty and economic mobility;  juvenile justice, and trauma. I have a BA in psychology and am also interested in the intersection between social justice, psychology, and education - researching (and providing solutions to) issues like the school-to-prison pipeline, economic inequalities and racial disparities in education, etc. I want to study social work with an international focus and am especially interested in schools that have a global focus and/or faculty doing work in this area. Career wise, I want to teach, conduct research, author books, and consult with domestic and international agencies (i.e. the United Nations, World Bank, etc.).

Thank you for suggesting having informational interviews. Great idea. How do you initially go about setting them up? Do you usually give the faculty members your CV via email or in person?  

Edited April 5, 2018 by TigerMem

[Adelaide9216]

I'm also considering applying for Fall 2019.

 

[scthorne]

8 hours ago, TigerMem said:

How do you initially go about setting them up? Do you usually give the faculty members your CV via email or in person?  

I've been emailing folks through their school email address listed on the school website. I usually introduce myself as a current student, state my school, and explain that I will be graduating soon. Then I mention my interest in their school's PhD program and their research focus specifically and ask if I can meet in person or over the phone (depending on if I'll be visiting before December) to learn more about the program. 

For the ones I have completed in person so far I have provided them my CV in person. The ones completed over the phone I've been sending my CV as a PDF attachment. However as I've been working on it, I think it makes more sense to include the CV in that initial email. A couple of professors have wanted to forward my CV to other faculty members or current PhD candidates that they think would be good contacts and having a PDF copy of my CV on hand makes that a lot easier. 

So far all but one professor has responded to my meeting requests. I learned from someone else at that school that that particular person is on sabbatical this semester so it makes complete sense that they would not be checking their email.

Edited April 5, 2018 by scthorne

[scthorne]

Just noticed I made a mistake in my first comment. I'm co-authoring a book CHAPTER, not a whole book!

Edited April 5, 2018 by scthorne

[TigerMem]

On 4/5/2018 at 5:08 AM, scthorne said:

I've been emailing folks through their school email address listed on the school website. I usually introduce myself as a current student, state my school, and explain that I will be graduating soon. Then I mention my interest in their school's PhD program and their research focus specifically and ask if I can meet in person or over the phone (depending on if I'll be visiting before December) to learn more about the program. 

For the ones I have completed in person so far I have provided them my CV in person. The ones completed over the phone I've been sending my CV as a PDF attachment. However as I've been working on it, I think it makes more sense to include the CV in that initial email. A couple of professors have wanted to forward my CV to other faculty members or current PhD candidates that they think would be good contacts and having a PDF copy of my CV on hand makes that a lot easier. 

So far all but one professor has responded to my meeting requests. I learned from someone else at that school that that particular person is on sabbatical this semester so it makes complete sense that they would not be checking their email.

Thank you. 

I talked to a professor from Fordham last week and the conversation was really helpful. I guess I underestimated how willing professors are to meet/talk to students.

I'm going to continue to reach out/talk to professors - I want to make sure I'm applying to schools that will be a good fit for me and my interests. 

Thanks again and good luck with your applications! 

[flowerthor]

Get your 2-years post MSW experience first. This is very important, especially if you plan to teach after getting your PhD. Majority of the assistant professor (tenure track) jobs require that,  in addition to having a PhD in social work, you have to have had at least 2 years post MSW. You want to take a look at the job market and make sure you're on the right track. I'm not saying you won't be able to find a job at all without the 2 years but your options will be limited. I've seen phd students who enter start their phd in social work without the 2 years post masters or without a msw and are then learning that they will only be able to find employment where they won't be teaching social work practice classes. 

[SWjdg]

3 hours ago, flowerthor said:

Get your 2-years post MSW experience first. This is very important, especially if you plan to teach after getting your PhD. Majority of the assistant professor (tenure track) jobs require that,  in addition to having a PhD in social work, you have to have had at least 2 years post MSW. You want to take a look at the job market and make sure you're on the right track. I'm not saying you won't be able to find a job at all without the 2 years but your options will be limited. I've seen phd students who enter start their phd in social work without the 2 years post masters or without a msw and are then learning that they will only be able to find employment where they won't be teaching social work practice classes. 

Generally, this is good advice. You WILL have better job prospects with 2 year most master experience. As an admitted PhD Student who doesn't have 2 years post experience, I can tell this doesn't faze me in the slightest. I DON'T like practice courses, I do not like micro level social work. I don't want to teach these courses at a University. I have several friends in the same boat as I am who are landing tenure track positions. Don't kid yourself, schools want you for the research grant's you can secure - not teaching courses that adjuncts can teach.