Roundup

[Hicks]

Do they always interview those they're considering? I know schools like Emory do, but many schools only interview those they are on the fence about. Don't give up hope yet!!

I don't know what their practice is when it comes to interviews. While the lack of news from UC Irvine is concerning I did get an acceptance letter today from the Graduate Theological Union program in Art & Religion. It is different than the other programs for which I applied but fits very well with my interests. My only concern there is that I want to work within an art history not religious studies environment. But still, I am excited.

[Hicks]

To those of you hoping to maintain your studio practice in art history grad school:

I came in with a BFA, thinking I'd like to continue making and exhibiting art. Ha! Didn't happen. Between being a TA, my courses, and a part-time job, studio work had to go. I'm sure everyone has different levels of commitment, but I had been a pretty serious artist as an undergrad, in lots of national juried shows. I just couldn't make it work.

I also discovered that reactions among the art history faculty to my studio interests ranged from bemusement to snide dismissal. It was not encouraged, as it was viewed as merely a distraction to my "serious" art historical work. (Of course, they were fine with all my language study . . . )

YMMV

I fully understand this point. In fact, I'm concerned that while my artistic background gives me a unique perspective that having an established career in the visual arts may be seen negatively by some committees. I also, understand that I will have to lessen my artistic production. But, over the last few years I have been teaching and I was a department head for four years. So, I confident that I will be able to maintain a modest studio practice. But, I also agree that this commitment is not something that the art historians I study with will understand.It will be a part of my personal life but not something I seek to explicitly brig to my studies.

[losemygrip]

And of course, it depends on the department. There are a good number of art historians with studio backgrounds, and they tend to be sympathetic and accommodating about studio interests. (I've also found them to be the art historians I gravitated towards, often not finding out until much later that they had studio backgrounds.) The reactions I noted were more prevalent at my MA institution than my PhD institution, for instance. I can tell you, however, when it comes to the academic job market, having some studio background is a big asset.

[OnceAndFutureGrad]

This discussion about studio art and its relationship to art history gets me thinking about another field that somewhat overlaps but is also somewhat in opposition: archaeology. I went to a field school last summer when I was exploring other options and I thoroughly enjoyed excavation. Obviously later periods of art have virtually nothing to do with archaeology, but earlier periods such as my own often rely on field discoveries (the Staffordshire hoard being an obvious example). A number of universities combine art history and archaeology, but others divide them on the art/science line. Does anyone have any experience with archaeologist-art historian crossovers?

[LLajax]

This discussion about studio art and its relationship to art history gets me thinking about another field that somewhat overlaps but is also somewhat in opposition: archaeology. I went to a field school last summer when I was exploring other options and I thoroughly enjoyed excavation. Obviously later periods of art have virtually nothing to do with archaeology, but earlier periods such as my own often rely on field discoveries (the Staffordshire hoard being an obvious example). A number of universities combine art history and archaeology, but others divide them on the art/science line. Does anyone have any experience with archaeologist-art historian crossovers?

I worked on an excavation last summer as well. I also spent a bunch of time trying to find art history programs that were "friendly" to archaeology and aarchaeology based research.

[cokohlik]

@egomex11

I took the GREs this summer before they changed over to the new version. As for 9 programs, I'd rather err on the side of the cautious. Haha its too bad that applying to more doesn't actually mean I'll get in anyplace. Hearing from so many people in their second season of applying is making me more worried.

I did the same thing - caution meant applying to 11 PhDs and 2 Master's programs. Here's to seeing where that leads!

[DiogenesCynicus]

This discussion about studio art and its relationship to art history gets me thinking about another field that somewhat overlaps but is also somewhat in opposition: archaeology. I went to a field school last summer when I was exploring other options and I thoroughly enjoyed excavation. Obviously later periods of art have virtually nothing to do with archaeology, but earlier periods such as my own often rely on field discoveries (the Staffordshire hoard being an obvious example). A number of universities combine art history and archaeology, but others divide them on the art/science line. Does anyone have any experience with archaeologist-art historian crossovers?

My program (Classical Archaeology) is placed within my university's Art History department, so I get to experience the crossover every day. They take our classes and we take theirs. The same is true for TA positions. We are a significant chunk of the department's students, so we often cross over and fill in TA positions that need filling. Our research approaches are different, but similar enough for a coherent dialogue to exist between the two disciplines.

[jilly11]

Hi all!

I have my BA and rather than going for the terminal MA first I have applied only to PhD programs - I have a feeling I might get shut out of all of them just because the acceptance rates are so low. But it is possible to go straight to a PhD program from a BA, right? I mean the programs I'm applying seem like first 2 years are basically your masters (your right a big qualifying paper at the end of the 2 years) then the next 4 are your dissertation.

Any words of encouragement or wisdom/experiences about trying to go straight into a PhD program?

Thank you!!

[Hegel's Bagels]

Woah Woah WOAH! I just saw a discussion about interviews posted on the History thread and was led to this article:

http://www.yaledailynews.com/news/2012/jan/11/grad-school-divided-over-interviews/

Did anybody else know Yale will be conducting interviews this year? AGHHHHHHHHHH *stress increases tenfold*

[Hicks]

I read that over in the religion forum. i don/t know what that means for the timeline.

[NaturallyAesthetic]

Hi all!

I have my BA and rather than going for the terminal MA first I have applied only to PhD programs - I have a feeling I might get shut out of all of them just because the acceptance rates are so low. But it is possible to go straight to a PhD program from a BA, right? I mean the programs I'm applying seem like first 2 years are basically your masters (your right a big qualifying paper at the end of the 2 years) then the next 4 are your dissertation.

Any words of encouragement or wisdom/experiences about trying to go straight into a PhD program?

Thank you!!

I'm doing the same thing for some programs! In fact, some schools require that you apply directly to the PhD, regardless of whether or not you have your masters. As to acceptance rates of people with only BAs, I haven't been able to find that information.

In terms of encouragement, here are some things I've been telling myself when most discouraged:

1. If you don't get into a program this year, you can always try again.
   
2. If you don't get into a program this year, you can take a year to relax (with 60+ hour work weeks, hopefully!), gain valuable functioning-outside-of-academia-skills, and take time to dissect your intentions and life direction a little more.
   
3. If you really love what you are trying to do, you will find a way to do it.
   
4. You're great!
   

Hope that helps, and best of luck!

[jilly11]

Hi NaturallyAesthetic,

Thanks for your words of encouragement - much needed!!! (Especially after reading the results pages on this site - yipes!)

[OnceAndFutureGrad]

Any words of encouragement or wisdom/experiences about trying to go straight into a PhD program?

Hi jilly11, it took me a while to formulate my response, but I think I'm ready to respond. I attempted to get into the PhD right out of undergrad three years ago, but I failed - and now that I have perspective, I wouldn't have changed that for the world.

I'm not going to say that you cannot or should not go into the PhD program right out of undergrad, but I will say that you are against some tough odds. Just getting accepted is one thing, but it sounds like you are aware of the challenges inherent in that. Being a PhD-level graduate student is very difficult. The coursework is more challenging and less structured than in undergrad, and you will probably be held to a higher standard than MA students in your department.

If you are the standard age of an American undergraduate senior (22) with a typical education and job history, it is likely you will be alongside people in their mid- to late-twenties and thirties with past careers, spouses, children, and other life experiences that may make you feel immature or unprepared. Also, you will likely be TA'ing students who are around your age and it can be difficult to summon the presence necessary to lead a classroom, assign grades, and so on.

PhD-level demands like writing for publication, preparing for oral exams, and taking years to research and write a dissertation require fortitude and determination not often found in people without a history of triumph despite adversity in fields other than education. Assuming that you have been in school since kindergarten, you may have not lived life outside of a school-year schedule, and a year into your PhD coursework is not the time to wonder if you are capable of being an academic forever.

All that being said, I do know people who are working on their dissertation without any break in education who are happy as clams about it. It's certainly possible. And I may be barking up the wrong tree if you are an atypical student with more life experience than most. But as I said, as disappointed as I was in 2009, I realize now how much trouble I'd be in if I had started the PhD program then. I hope you don't see this as discouragement, but rather honest and solicited advice.

[LLajax]

Got an email from Williams (MA)- apparently they didn't get my transcripts. Alas, will have to send them again. Maybe this means they're starting to look at apps?

[Hicks]

Feeling some pain! I've been a bit overwhelmed the last couple of weeks with teaching classes and several other projects I have gong on. So, late last night I found out that my thesis adviser hadn't submitted letters to Tyler or Missouri. Tyler only requires two so they have their minimum but Missouri is another issue. Still my adviser should be my strongest recommendation so it painful to have this happen. I should have caught this sooner but as I said I've been swamped and we had contact early-mid January so I didn't think it was an issue.

[jilly11]

@ OnceandFutureGrad - amazing advice! I have had a year break from school and I'm ready to go back but nonetheless you do make very valid points. I think if I do get rejected I will have to see the silver lining...and as the saying goes "everything happens for a reason" and if I have to wait its not the end of the world and many good things could happen in between.

Thank you for your thoughtful response.

[OnceAndFutureGrad]

Thank you for your thoughtful response.

Thank you. I was on tenterhooks all yesterday afternoon hoping that I hadn't brought you down! There are just so many people on GradCafe who, it seems, exist only for that acceptance and cannot imagine life outside (or alongside) the typical PhD-postdoc-tenure avenue.

Having a year outside the "system" made me sure that I really do want to be a part of that system, but with the wisdom that only exile can provide.

It also made me realize how sure I am that I love my boyfriend (now fiancé), and spending time with my friends' children re-affirmed that I want to become a parent sooner rather than later. The initial idea of "get a PhD, get a job, get married, have a kid, in that order" has given way to the happier concept that life does not happen in sequence. Finally, becoming an EMT and learning about anatomy, injury, illness, and what to do when sh*t hits the fan filled gaps in my psyche, abating worries that I was "intrinsically useless".

I see now that I was depressed - or at least performance-affectingly despondent - as a student of theoretical history and that I will always need a pragmatic base as motivation. I know for certain that I would have burnt out long before finishing an enormous dissertation on, say, Irish influence in Icelandic literature (my undergraduate senior thesis). Now that I have things going on in my life outside of translating Old Norse, or the iconological interpretation of Anglo-Saxon crosses, I can stay focused on the task at hand for as long as I need to. Writing myself into a corner, or realizing that I have constructed a circular argument, is merely a setback in my work instead of failure at life in general. I hope that you, jilly, and any other graduate student can find external strength and motivation if your work falters or is poorly received.

TL;DR: PhD work is maddening, have other things in your life to keep you sane.

[NaturallyAesthetic]

Thank you. I was on tenterhooks all yesterday afternoon hoping that I hadn't brought you down! There are just so many people on GradCafe who, it seems, exist only for that acceptance and cannot imagine life outside (or alongside) the typical PhD-postdoc-tenure avenue.

Thank you for sharing your experience, OnceAndFutureGrad!

I'm in a similar boat as jilly, and I am slightly ashamed to admit that I was once one of those GradCafers who only existed for acceptance into a program. When I began this process, I kind of got into the mindset that pursuing a PhD would be the only way to go about accomplishing my goals. This mentality is due in part to the fact that I came from a rural town where most people did not have four year college degrees, let alone doctorates. Prior to college, I had only met two people that had PhDs: a slightly addled history teacher at my high school, and an uncle whom I rarely saw but always thought of as the epitome of sophisticated. I really had very little idea what the whole thing was about, and sometimes worry that I am still too naive.

I am pursuing graduate study because I need the credentials to curate or to teach or to continue my research, but also (and mostly) because I am fascinated with the world and that fascination is emphatically visual. Out of those four reasons, I only really need the doctorate to curate. Teaching is something I more or less find myself doing, almost by accident. Inevitably, I end up guest lecturing for professors across campus, leading art classes for children, or giving music lessons without really paying attention to the process that led to the situation in the first place. Research is something I can't escape either - I constantly have some project going, either to inform a series of paintings or photographs or for a journalism piece I am writing. The format of the research and the ultimate usage of the research is what might be subject to change if I end up in a graduate program for art history, but not the spirit of exploration engendered by actively seeking new knowledge.

The first rejection letter I got was pretty hard to read. However, I am now more hopeful than ever. Good things will come, probably in unexpected forms. I'm beginning to think that recognizing the guises of the good is not only crucial to happiness, but also contingent on diligent practice.

Congrats on becoming an EMT! And on translating Old Norse! And on giving good advice!

[complexprocedure]

@ NaturallyAesthetic and OnceAndFutureGrad - Thank you both for sharing your experience! Actually, that goes for all who've been willing to share: your stories really boost the camaraderie factor around here. It certainly helps to remind each other that there are many things out there besides a shiny PhD, and many paths to contented adulthood. I hope to share a little more of my own tale at some point, but I've just come home from a looong museum day of thinking and writing (I know, I know... but it was on about three hours sleep, so help me!) and am at a point where I can't face reading one more staff email, much less string coherent thoughts together. And I still have to save at least a couple of those for writing an LOR tonight for someone I mentored who's now applying to MFA programs.

Speaking of which, it feels a little bit weird writing LORs when I just finished my undergrad last year and am trying to get into grad myself. I see a number of us on this forum have taught, so I know I can't be the only one in this situation. Hicks? Anyone else?

[Hicks]

It is a little odd. But, I'm in a little different situation. First off, I'm old. Okay maybe 39 is OLD but it certainly is older. Also I've been teaching in college for the last five years and that is just a part of the gig. But, being on this side of it has certainly made me more appreciative of the letters I do write...no pushing it off to the last minute...I know to well how that feels as the applicant.

[OnceAndFutureGrad]

Congrats to the Yale acceptance! Anyone gonna step forward and claim it?

[LLajax]

Congrats to the Yale acceptance! Anyone gonna step forward and claim it?

...I don't see one on the results board? Haha, I'm getting a feeling of deja vu.

[OnceAndFutureGrad]

Edit: Wait! I figured it out - I was NOT seeing things, I just exchanged Yale for Princeton. Who got the PRINCETON admit?

Edited February 2, 2012 by OnceAndFutureGrad

[Hegel's Bagels]

Edit: Wait! I figured it out - I was NOT seeing things, I just exchanged Yale for Princeton. Who got the PRINCETON admit?

Hahaha I laughed really hard at this exchange. But yea, detaila please! I think we all are starved for info.

[manyarecalled]

I was cracking up, too! Also having a heart attack, because oh man Yale results, but mainly laughing. It's pretty cruel that every PhD program in the world seems to be giving out results, but not art history. I need to cut myself off from the internet this weekend (not gonna happen). Maybe we should all go camping.