The last month: 100% rejections, every school, internship, scholarship and fellowship, job

[Ken Koh]

^^

Yep that's why I suggested calling. Getting them on the phone directly is probably much better than emailing. To be honest, I think you'll have to be a bit more thick-skinned, especially when you have nothing much to lose.

[tiffanyamber81]

I've been applying to tons of things with tons of backup plans. Many jobs in the public and private industry, grad schools, internships, scholarships and fellowships, and I've been rejected from 100% of them. Two rounds of grad schools all rejected, nothing but skill building in the past year.

Before all this, I had pretty good confidence, after seeking advice from several career advisers, mentors, supervisors at a previous internship. People were certain I had a great chance. They looked over my documents, pointed out weaknesses for me to fix, which I did, and they nodded their heads saying that it all looks great. The grad school aim might have been high, but, the internships and job applications were not aiming high. To rub it in, a coworker ended up getting the very same internship I was shooting for, so I get to work with him while he's excited about his opportunity. His qualifications were less, too.

It's just hard for me to even function anymore. I've been going at this for 2 years, hundreds of job applications, grad school applications, polishing the resume, building a portfolio, making personal visits to departments and jobs I'm interested in, even if it includes flying out of state and arranging an interview, doing research with the department here, doing teaching at the local university (love the teaching, hate the univ and city, everyone loves how I teach, though, and I've been getting stellar evaluations). I was a very different person 6 weeks ago. I was filled with confidence that something, even the risky "everything else failed" backup plans would pan out, but, in the last week, the last doors have closed. The last 6 weeks have been constant pitfalls, just adding to the years of constant rejection. After graduating with honors in AE, I've yet to see any sort of moving forward whatsoever. I'm already 25 and I don't even have my master's degree yet. I was planning on at least having some job experience in something other than an internship, but nothing has worked out. I've searched for jobs all over the country, government and non government, large and small companies, and out of the country: UK, Netherlands, Australia.

Sorry, just venting. Don't mind me.

I suggest not giving up - and consider post graduate studies at a college. I know many people who decided to go this route after not having luck in other areas, and were happier in the end. Of course many of these studies do not focus on theory or research - and are much more applied. But, it could help you choose a direction if the university path isn't working at this time.

Edited March 19, 2012 by tiffanyamber81

[tiffanyamber81]

My above comment would work in Canada. But, if you are from the US - not sure if they have post-grad programs at a college (not university). I am from the States originally - and in Canada the two are discussed as different.

[Guest Amon-Ra]

I'm so sorry, GradHooting, for your troubles. You sound like a terrific, talented, level-headed person, and I wish you luck. I know how hard this process can be. Last year, I was rejected from every graduate program I applied to, and I spent nearly eight months searching fruitlessly for relevant work. I have an great record, an MA, and experience in my field, but I just couldn't find anyone willing to give me a chance.

This poem, by Sheenagh Pugh, helped me to get through the year:

Exhibition

He's playing trick shots to entertain

the crowd, because the match finished early.

And why was that? He was comprehensively

hammered, that's why; he didn't win

a frame. Now it's all going well:

now it doesn't matter, he can knock

them in from anywhere. There's a wisecrack

from the audience; he looks a bit pale,

small wonder, but he's right in there

fighting back, turning the laugh, as if

no-one just hurt most of the life

out of him for some hours. He's a master

now, showing them how to do it,

the skills of which most of us just dream,

courage, class, humour. That's the game

in the end, and he's a player all right.

It's infinitely easier to get into a great program or to get a great job, than it is to get rejected completely and repeatedly and still behave with grace, humor and hope. I have been blessed recently to begin a new job and to be accepted to an excellent PhD program for the coming fall. I'm grateful for these opportunities, but I'm proud of the way I behaved before I had them. It would be wonderful for the graduate programs and jobs to recognize your worth, and for you to find a place where you can be happy and useful. But mostly I hope you are able to find pride in your situation and to know that, if you're strong enough and gutsy enough, it, as much as anything else, really illuminates your true worth. All my best wishes! This will not last forever.

Edited March 20, 2012 by Faustina

[GradHooting]

I'm contacting the different schools and awaiting some kind of response for how I could improve the application. I also contacted a friend who looked at the SOP and said it was horrible, and he couldn't even finish reading it. That kind of puts me off, not because he said that, but because all these career advisers were saying it was great. So, I'm not really sure who to believe.

[go3187]

I was planning on at least having some job experience in something other than an internship, but nothing has worked out. I've searched for jobs all over the country, government and non government, large and small companies, and out of the country: UK, Netherlands, Australia.

If you don't mind working in Germany, OHB has been accepting engineering/earth and space sciences students from our university for short- and long-term internships. We're an international university and many students don't speak German, so I'm pretty sure German is not a requirement (although it does help if you speak it!). I think the way most of them applied is by sending a CV and cover letter... the company never had internship positions posted on their website, afaik.

So, if you haven't applied to OHB yet, you might want to take a look at it. Here's their web page:

https://www.ohb-system.de/

Also, I watched this video yesterday, and quite liked it:

http://tedxtalks.ted.com/video/TEDxCMU-Charlie-Hoehn-The-New-W

[GradHooting]

If you don't mind working in Germany, OHB has been accepting engineering/earth and space sciences students from our university for short- and long-term internships. We're an international university and many students don't speak German, so I'm pretty sure German is not a requirement (although it does help if you speak it!). I think the way most of them applied is by sending a CV and cover letter... the company never had internship positions posted on their website, afaik.

So, if you haven't applied to OHB yet, you might want to take a look at it. Here's their web page:

https://www.ohb-system.de/

Also, I watched this video yesterday, and quite liked it:

http://tedxtalks.ted...Hoehn-The-New-W

Wow, that's a really good talk. You know what resonated with me the most? The concept of free work. I tell my career advisers that I really want to do something I love, and that, because I enjoy it so much, I would be willing to do it for free for a short amount of time, to get the connections, to prove myself, and to have documented experience. It's capital that goes beyond just money. But, they almost universally freak out when I say that. They tell me "Do NOT sell yourself short. That's a terrible idea." But, I truly do not understand why I am suddenly entitled to all this pay, and all this immediate risk for the employer, if I have not sufficiently proven myself to be worth what they wish to pay me. Has everyone been completely misleading me here?

EDIT: I have one concern, though. I really want to continue to grad school, not just because of the importance of proper qualifications for an aerospace engineer, putting other people's lives in their hands, but because of the connections and additional experience gained in graduate school. My concern, however, is that the process for getting into graduate school, as much as this talk resonates with me, does not at all permit what this person is talking about. The *only* way in, from what I've seen, is through the established procedures, and they will not listen to you at all if you try another route. Reality does seem to support this perception of mine, because, even with personal talks, marketing how I can be useful to them, even as an unclassified student, the rigid, established departmental procedures I've found at pretty much any of these institutions completely prevent me from using these alternate, creative routes. I really do feel stuck between a desire to do what I want to do, and what I want to do being completely stonewalled by an antiquated system that's being stubbornly held in place by gatekeepers everywhere.

Edited March 26, 2012 by GradHooting

[GradHooting]

So, some news came in just around a day or two after I made that last post. Something came through that completely surprised me. I'll be spending at least a year working at NASA, gaining experience in the space industry. I cannot put into words how amazing this feels. This is exactly (or, even better than) what I've been pushing for. This program is specifically aimed towards providing relevant experience to those who have recently graduated. I've one quick question: Should letters of recommendation purely come from professors you've studied with in school, or could NASA researchers also be relevant? I've been out of school as a full time student for so long, that I feel that recommendations from previous professors at my undergrad institution might well be outdated by now, and might not represent where I'm at right now. I give them updates, but their first hand experience with me ended in 2009. This is the first time in two years that *anything* has worked out for me. I'm just in shock.

Edited April 2, 2012 by GradHooting

[UnlikelyGrad]

Congrats!

Since you'd be doing research, I think NASA recommendations would be mostly OK...though do try to get at least one professor.

If you don't mind sharing, which NASA center will you be working at? (I have several ex-NASA friends.)

[GradHooting]

I'll be at NASA Ames. I'll try to do lots of networking around the area with schools and businesses there, as it's pretty much exactly where I want to be. I don't think my undergrad professors would be able to offer super strong recommendations beyond seeing my tenacity against the constant rejections over the years. I mean, I graduated with honors and such, but I have *way* more perspective about what I want to do now than I did as an undergrad, and a lot of the professors with whom I interacted more closely ended up pretty much disappearing from the school and leaving the country, so it's been very hard trying to contact them. I do have some professors that have seen what I can do at the school where I'm doing research currently, but, still, I'm concerned that it's nothing truly mindblowingly impressive. It's basically research that's outside my field that I've been pushing real hard doing lab work in. Things have moved forward quite fast, with my help, at least. But, I was more joining projects that were already started by the adviser and what he wanted me to do. I didn't really start anything of my own (they're very picky about students doing things without their permission) beyond just offering solutions for simultaneous use of lab equipment by different groups that the professors thought was impossible.

I basically went through undergrad with zero perspective on the expectations of grad schools.

Edited April 3, 2012 by GradHooting

[TakeruK]

Should letters of recommendation purely come from professors you've studied with in school, or could NASA researchers also be relevant? I've been out of school as a full time student for so long, that I feel that recommendations from previous professors at my undergrad institution might well be outdated by now, and might not represent where I'm at right now.

Congratulations!!! This sounds like an excellent opportunity. To answer your question, YES! Actually, reference letters form NASA researchers may end up as your strongest reference letters, especially if this is the first time you are doing full-time research work. NASA researchers could also be well known in their field -- although a well known tenured professor is probably the ideal letter writer, they are not the only choice. You might already know this, but the only reference letters taken seriously are those written by your research supervisors (I don't necessarily agree, but I think it's the reality). I definitely agree that although career advisors and professors are very encouraging of students to apply outside of "traditional routes", the reality is that few schools are willing to take a chance on these students!

[GradHooting]

I can get one letter from a research adviser at the school I'm currently at, as well as a regular professor from undergrad I've been keeping in contact with. Then, hopefully, I can apply myself quite well in this opportunity and get some juicy letters from some NASA researchers! I'm just ecstatic. For being rejected from everywhere, the opportunity work in research for a year, in the relevant field, seems like the perfect thing I can do with myself until the next application round.

Thanks for all the support you guys have given me, so far. I was initially very wary to post things here, and practically avoided this site to avoid the stress of anticipated rejections (on the results page and such). This thread has been one of the biggest supports I've had through that brief, 3 week long period of battling with the sense of defeat, that seemed to give the impression that the 2 years of applying myself was for nothing, when it wasn't! The NASA thing's the first evidence I have that I actually moved forward. Woot!

[GradHooting]

I'm giving an update a year later.  What a year!  It has been laced with ups and downs.  I left NASA with some completed projects under my belt.  I could go into more detail regarding that, but it is a bit late, and will go into more detail if prompted.

 

The better news: Applied to 8 schools, got into half of them, and accepted a fully funded aerospace engineering Masters + Ph.D. program in a top 10 engineering school!  I'd say that I am fairly excited, but it is more a sense of calmness and a "I'll see how it goes" mentality.  I wanted to post this because I started this thread in sheer frustration of the loads of dashed hopes.  But, I'll be wading into a sea of challenges with the armor I've developed from dealing with constant rejections in the past.  My new outlook on life has made me a tad bit relentless, but also a bit more tolerant towards rejections.  In a sense, I feel more encouraged to challenge myself and keep aiming high, because I have enough experience with people turning me down that I can quickly find other ways to get to where I want to be.

 

I am not exactly where I thought I would end up.  I had saved up for years for graduate school, assuming no department would fund me.  But, not only have I been accepted, I've been fully funded!  That certainly came out of nowhere.  This is far better than I thought it would be.  Now, it's time to work my butt off and meet some amazing people in my field.

Edited July 10, 2013 by GradHooting

[klehrie]

Congrats!!!!!! What a wonderful story of perserverance. Thank you for the update. I think it will give many people here who are going through similar paths a lot of hope.

[nugget]

Your story is truly an inspirations for others. Thank you for sharing your experiences on this forum and for providing updates on the latest developments. I wish you all the best on this new chapter in your career.

Edited July 12, 2013 by jenste

[fuzzylogician]

Thank you for coming back and giving us this update. It's great to hear! Congratulations!! 

[NavyMom]

Don't give up on your dreams!!!  I am 38 years old, have been going to school for 14 years, and I am just NOW 2 quarters from finishing my bachelor's degree.   I plan to apply to my master's program in October for next fall entrance.  It takes time, experience, patience, self-confidence, a great support group, and persistence!  Never ever lose focus on your dream. Don't try to do everything at once. Set small goals for yourself, and work to acheive them. 

You will get there, we all believe in you! 

[Chai_latte]

Yay!!  That's excellent. 

Best of luck with your program

[Panama Slim]

Congrats on the NASA gig. I did a summer internship back in 1986 at the Johnson Space Center. Fantastic experience that is still a conversation starter on my resume.

Speaking on not being to old yet, I am starting my PhD at 43. Good things happen to those that are patient. Good luck with your future plans.