Grads on campus.

[korartiz]

I very well may be over thinking this, but I'm curious.

As a graduate student, what is/isn't appropriate when it comes to events/activities on campus? Is it appropriate for us to join clubs and be social with the undergrads if we have the time? Frequenting the athletic events? 

Is blending in appropriate or are we supposed to try and make ourselves stand out? 

 

I imagine that schools don't really do orientation events like they do for undergrads. What's the reason for this? 

[CarlieE]

Actually we had a mandatory orientation, but it was not really a "social" thing. There are grad organizations and clubs to join but none of them interest me... 

 

As far as events, we have to attend department events - even the social ones. They are generally only for grads, the UGs have their own events apparently but they rarely come to the dept events. 

[korartiz]

 There are grad organizations and clubs to join but none of them interest me... 

 

So then at your school graduates are not able to join the UG clubs if they want? 

Do they forget that the social aspect is still an important one? Moving to a new place and making friends doesn't really get any easier the more you do it, not in my opinion. 

I suppose that I'm also trying to justify the tuition/fee increase for grad students VS. undergrad students. 

[Eigen]

Wait, you have a tuition/fee increase for grad Vs. undergrads?

 

That, I'd be really interested to see. We've been collecting data to try to get our fees lowered, and every school I've run across has had much lower graduate fees and tuition than undergrad.

 

I guess grad students *could* join undergrad clubs here, it's just that they don't, usually. I'm the advisor for at least one undergrad club, so to me, joining them would be a bit strange.

 

Similarly, I'm friendly with most of the undergrads in our program, but I'm friendly with them more as a mentor than a buddy.

[OctaviaButlerfan]

I realize this is a bit off-topic, but where I currently attend for my M.A., fees and tuition are higher for graduate students. It is also much more difficult to get scholarships and financial aid.

 

Wait, you have a tuition/fee increase for grad Vs. undergrads?

 

That, I'd be really interested to see. We've been collecting data to try to get our fees lowered, and every school I've run across has had much lower graduate fees and tuition than undergrad.

[TakeruK]

During my undergrad, we had good graduate student attendance and participation in our Undergrad Physics Society club. We had a lounge and a fridge and a vending machine so graduate students would often use our room for lunch breaks etc. The club also hosts events meant for faculty, grad students, and undergrads to mingle and network/get to know each other. The biggest activity is our semi-annual wine & cheese (unfortunately the freshmen can't go to this due to alcohol permits but otherwise it's very inclusive). A good fraction of our grad student participation is due to our former members graduating and staying for a MSc (In Canada, it's pretty usual for one to do BSc+MSc at one place then go elsewhere for PhD). We have the occasional "pub night" as well and graduate students often joined us (and sometimes faculty too). However, I think the club constitution reserved the key executive positions to undergrads only (although grad students can hold other positions, I think).

 

In addition, especially in astronomy, undergrads and graduate students treat each other as colleagues, as most of us are involved in research in some way so we would often work together. The fourth year undergrad courses and first year grad courses in astronomy are also cross-listed (i.e. same lectures, but the grad students may be graded differently or have an extra project at the end) so we would often work together on that too. Overall, I got the sense that our department was one "family", where the undergrads are kind of like the "younger siblings" to the grad students. That is, on a weekly basis, we would often do our own things that won't interest the grads and the grads often do their own things where they might not want undergrads around, but once a month or so, we have social events for the whole "family".

 

At my current (grad) school, there isn't really "undergrad club" or "grad club" (since we are really small) other than the Grad Student Council etc. Most clubs are open to everyone and it's a combination of undergrad, grads, post-docs, and even faculty members or members of community related to the school (e.g. spouses). This was an important aspect to me, I didn't want to be in a school where there was a "hierarchy" of undergrad-grad-postdoc-faculty. I was looking for something where everyone was more of an equal and would do things together. That said, I wouldn't do things like go to an undergrad party (or invite them to grad parties/social events) or try to make really good friends with undergrads (mostly since there's now such a big age gap), but I don't purposely avoid contact with them to maintain distance or anything like that.

[korartiz]

Wait, you have a tuition/fee increase for grad Vs. undergrads?

 

Just as an example, here's the tuition for undergrad VS. grad at UWM. Keep in mind that undergraduates take 15 credit hours VS graduate 12 credit hours. 

 

2012-2013 Undergraduate Tuition   

Resident Undergraduate Tuition* Based on 12-18 credits both semesters  $9,380

Non-Resident Undergraduate Tuition* Based on 12-18 credits both semesters $19,088

 

2012-2013 Graduate Tuition    

Resident Graduate Tuition Based on 8 or more credits both semesters  $11,524

Non-Resident Graduate Tuition Based on 8 or more credits both semesters  $24,412

 

So if we figure it out by cost per credit, going by minimum credits for full time. 

Undergrad in state = 391 per credit

Out of state = 795 per credit

Grad in state = 720 per credit

Out of state = 1525

 

Almost a 100% increase per credit.

Most of the other schools I've looked at are similar in cost. 

Edited February 1, 2013 by korartiz

[Eigen]

Can't do it based on credits, though. You don't usually take the same courseload between grad and undergrad. Both of those costs are for full time.

 

It is interesting to see the ~20% increase though.

[robot_hamster]

Wait, you have a tuition/fee increase for grad Vs. undergrads?

 

Graduate tuition is higher at my school too. I'll have to look up the numbers but it is more expensive per credit hour than undergrad.

 

EDIT

 

Okay undergrad is listed as $216 per credit hour (resident) and $641 per credit hour (non-resident). Graduate is $285 per credit hour (resident) and $769 per credit hour (non-resident). Fees are the same for both undergrad and grad. They are based on number of hours enrolled. Half-time for grad is 4 hours so the fees would be less than what most undergrads pay.

Edited February 2, 2013 by robot_hamster

[Eigen]

More expensive per credit, sure- but you have to compare full time tuition to full time tuition. 

 

Fewer classes per semester for grads and smaller class sizes means increased cost per credit hour, but roughly the same cost per a full time load. 

[robot_hamster]

More expensive per credit, sure- but you have to compare full time tuition to full time tuition. 

 

Fewer classes per semester for grads and smaller class sizes means increased cost per credit hour, but roughly the same cost per a full time load. 

 

If you're meaning 9 credits versus 12 credits, then yes it is about the same. I don't know a lot of people in my department that are full time though. I guess it just depends on how you look at it.

[rising_star]

Two separate convos in this post, but I'll say something about each I guess.

 

At my current university, grads are able to join undergrad clubs. I think it happens most often for religious clubs or athletic/club sports type student clubs. I'm a member of one. So yes, that means I regularly interact with undergrads in that context but, I'm not the only grad student there.

 

As for fees, last I knew, grads paid what undergrads pay. Our university-wide grad student association is trying to fight this, particularly since whenever there's a vote about what the fee money should go towards, grad student priorities get outvoted. Which is why we all currenly pay ~$15 so the health center can offer binge drinking awareness classes...

[TeaGirl]

I don't see a problem with joining undergrads clubs. I was a member of one during my MS and I'm definitely planning on joining at least an outdoor activity type club wherever I end up, and maybe something else.

[CarlieE]

So then at your school graduates are not able to join the UG clubs if they want? 

Do they forget that the social aspect is still an important one? Moving to a new place and making friends doesn't really get any easier the more you do it, not in my opinion. 

I suppose that I'm also trying to justify the tuition/fee increase for grad students VS. undergrad students. 

 My comment was that I wasn't interested in the grad organizations they have. Whether or not UGs join them or vice versa, I have no clue. The organizations that exist are religious or professional network oriented; not stuff I'm interested in. 

 

The social aspect is important, but school isn't the only avenue for building a social life. In fact, what is more encouraged is building a social life OUTSIDE of school so that you have a break from location of campus and everything that comes with it. 

 

Most programs seem to encourage building friendships with other members of you cohort or other grads, if only because of the difference in workload, age and activities between the grads and UGs. I'm in my 30s, I'm generally not interested in hanging out with people who just turned 21 or 22; I've passed that stage of my life and the things and activities I'm interested in aren't the same. That's not to say that I don't have friends who of that age, nor to say that clubs necessarily should segregate based on grad/UG status. Most grads I know build social lives beyond the university on purpose - they don't want school to be the foundation or common thread that a friendship is premised on. 

 

As far as what is "appropriate" that's entirely based on your personality not your grad or UG status. 

 

About increased grad tuition or fees, I have to say I have no idea really how much my tuition is since the school pays it. In most grad programs (though not MA ones necessarily) the cost of fees and tuition I think are more, but generally since your package "should" include tuition it becomes kind of a moot issue IMO. 

 

One of the reasons why grad fees might be more is because grads tend to use the academic facilities more ie. access to databases, we can request the library to buy certain books/materials we want etc. Some of these privileges aren't available to UGs. 

[rising_star]

About increased grad tuition or fees, I have to say I have no idea really how much my tuition is since the school pays it. In most grad programs (though not MA ones necessarily) the cost of fees and tuition I think are more, but generally since your package "should" include tuition it becomes kind of a moot issue IMO.

 

That's interesting. In my experience, tuition waivers mean precisely that, that is to say that tuition is waived. Consequently, fees are not covered, unless you go to a school that offers a tuition waiver that includes all fees. About both institutions where I've been a grad student, fees are something we pay out of pocket or our stipends, rather than something covered by our tuition waivers.

[korartiz]

As someone who is only looking at MA programs right now, the cost is more and usually NOT covered by any sort of waiver. So I do not feel like it's moot. 

 

Thanks for all of the good information on being a grad in regards to campus life. 

[juilletmercredi]

I work in student affairs in addition to being a PhD student (part-time - I'm in a role specifically designed for graduate students) so I do attend athletic events, RA-sponsored events, and other things that appeal to me.   I "hang out" with my undergrad supervisees, too, although it's not quite the same as hanging out with grad student friends.  I supervise them, so it's not like we can go get trashed together.  I don't join undergrad student clubs, but I have entertained joining the club sports they have in the physical education department.  There are usually graduate student clubs to join, too.

I think schools don't do full-blown orientation weekends because really, graduate students aren't as integrated into the life of the campus as undergrads.  We're so busy, there's not time and often not desire.  But I think as long as you aren't in a capacity where you're going to be teaching or advising the undergrads frequently, you can do whatever - if you're fresh out of undergrad yourself you may not be that much older than them.  Me, I keep the socializing to a minimum because I supervise some of them, teach some of them, and show up at the hospital at 3 am to assist some of them.

[robot_hamster]

I don't even recall any sort of orientation. I was just thrown in there. Haha!

[TakeruK]

Just to add my two cents -- our school did have a (~4 day) long grad student orientation: 1 day for our department, 1 day for TA training, 1 day for things like showing us how to register for courses, how to get resources/help when we need it, the school's honour code, Title IX, anti harassment training etc. and 1 day for "social" things like the grad student council hosting fun events (as well as these events happening in the evenings). And there were panels where profs and older graduate student (separately) talked to us about their expectations of us and what we could expect / what the older students wish they knew in our shoes. There was also a 3 day long international student orientation where we learned about immigration policies that might affect us, special resources for international students, and also a panel with international students/profs telling us about their experience in a foreign land! 

[korartiz]

our school did have a (~4 day) long grad student orientation

 

That's great! 

As was sort of mentioned by another poster, I am fresh out of undergrad, albeit two years older than the expected graduation age. So, the activity/campus life side of things is still important to me. 

[Dal PhDer]

We didn't have an orientation for my program...but I would suggest joining as much as your schedule allows. Having peers on campus that you can socialize and veg with is really important. I REALLY believe it's important to have a social circle during this process...and the best way to develop that is to get involved and meet people.

Some of the stuff on campus that I've been or am involved with include: Graduate student society; departmental buddy (linked with an international student); recreational sports; dance classes; student conference planning...it's a great way to meet people and get away from work!

[kmd0113]

If I get into the grad program I want, I will try to join the honor society.  It is for graduate students only though.  As far as sporting events, the school has a top notch women's gymnastics team, so I am going to those.  I don't think I will have too much contact with undergrads.

[ak48]

As an undergraduate there were a few clubs with Graduate members in it too, and it mostly came off fine.

 

As long as you are interesting and don't come across as "clearly here to scope out attractive undergrads" then people generally don't discriminate between undergrad/grad, especially if it's a social/activity oriented group.