NSF GRFP 2014-2015

[gpantel]

Over the past couple days I've found that I'm the first student in my department at my school to win the GRFP as an undergrad. Additionally, it seems that I'm the first incoming student in the department I've chosen to attend for graduate studies who is coming in with a graduate fellowship.

 

This is kind of a silly question, and terribly selfish to ask given there are so many who did not recieve the award, but to others: Should I feel bad about wasting my "golden ticket" on a school that isn't top-tier? Will people still see that I've been able to get my own support and give me respect of the same degree as students at top tier schools? I hate the thought that my personal choices for research and adviser-fit could significantly hamper my potential even though I do think that, outside of prestiege, I am making the best choice.

 

Could any previous winners tell me a bit about how the award has shaped the way they interact with researchers outside of their home institution? Or if it has at all?

Edited April 3, 2015 by gpantel

[marty3]

Over the past couple days I've found that I'm the first student in my department at my school to win the GRFP as an undergrad. Additionally, it seems that I'm the first incoming student in the department I've chosen to attend for graduate studies who is coming in with a graduate fellowship.

 

This is kind of a silly question, and terribly selfish to ask given there are so many who did not recieve the award, but to others: Should I feel bad about wasting my "golden ticket" on a school that isn't top-tier? Will people still see that I've been able to get my own support and give me respect of the same degree as students at top tier schools? I hate the thought that my personal choices for research and adviser-fit could significantly hamper my potential even though I do think that, outside of prestiege, I am making the best choice.

 

Could any previous winners tell me a bit about how the award has shaped the way they interact with researchers outside of their home institution? Or if it has at all?

 

There really are too many variables to make general statements about what will happen if you go to a prestigious school versus somewhere else. Work your butt off and anything can happen. There are good and well-connected people at every school, presitigious or not.

 

Based on what I was told as an undergrad when faced with accepting a graduate school, the only real need to go to a prestigious school is if you are on the fast track (no postdoc) to become a tenured prof at a tier one school. You only really have a chance at that if you're slaving away day and night for someone famous in one of the best programs. If you don't do that, but still want the glamorous lifestyle that goes along with being a famous professor, you can still become one but you need to postdoc for someone famous after gradschool.

 

Again, it's impossible to make such generalizations. Just sharing the view I was told. Your best bet, in my opinion, is to talk about that with your current advisor, boss, or anyone who knows you well. The whole view of postdocs also varies wildly from field to field, and I have a hunch it's more necessary for chemists than engineers.

[ron_swanson]

I got both the NSF GRFP (all E/E's) and the Ford Foundation Predoctoral Fellowship.  The NSF GRFP states that you cannot take on another Federal Fellowship.  I know the Ford Foundation is private and is managed by the National Research Council (also private).  Yet, the NRC receives Federal funding.  I'm in the process of figuring this whole thing out.  But I just wanted to know if anyone here has/will accept both.  The Ford can only be deferred after the first year (for a maximum of 2 years), while the NSF GRFP can be put on Reserve for up to 2 years.  It'd be great to "leap-frog" these fellowships over the full 5 years they are offered (the PhD program I'm entering is designed for 5 years, making it perfect).

 

Right now I accepted the NSF GRFP (haven't made a decision on Tenure or Reserve for the upcoming year) since it pays more and allows me NSF GROW and NSF GRIP opportunities.  If I can't accept both I'll probably just drop the Ford.  But yeah, anyone have experience with this?

[Eigen]

Have you accepted a particular school's offer yet? 

 

If so, you'll have a program officer at the school who mediates interactions with NSF. 

 

When I was awarded the NSF, I was in my 2nd year of another fellowship, and I wanted to keep it for another year before swapping to NSF (first year reserve). I got my program officer to ask NSF (and they were OK with it) and the other fellowship agency was as well. 

 

The purpose behind not taking two federal fellowships (irrespective of reserve/tenure) is that they come out of the same pot, so to speak. I'm relatively sure that the Ford and NSF could be leapfrogged OK, but you'd want to ask via your program officer(s) to be sure.

[Eigen]

Over the past couple days I've found that I'm the first student in my department at my school to win the GRFP as an undergrad. Additionally, it seems that I'm the first incoming student in the department I've chosen to attend for graduate studies who is coming in with a graduate fellowship.

 

This is kind of a silly question, and terribly selfish to ask given there are so many who did not recieve the award, but to others: Should I feel bad about wasting my "golden ticket" on a school that isn't top-tier? Will people still see that I've been able to get my own support and give me respect of the same degree as students at top tier schools? I hate the thought that my personal choices for research and adviser-fit could significantly hamper my potential even though I do think that, outside of prestiege, I am making the best choice.

 

Could any previous winners tell me a bit about how the award has shaped the way they interact with researchers outside of their home institution? Or if it has at all?

 

No, you should not feel bad at all. I was the first person to win a fellowship from my definitely not top-tier R1, and it's been a great experience. 

 

It definitely smooths along interactions with researchers outside of my institution- having the NSF is a nice feather in your cap (and on your CV) that will certainly help you along. 

 

People worry too much about prestige, in my opinion. It matters, to some degree, if you want to land a job at an R1 as a researcher- but what matters more is showing that you're a good researcher. In my small sub-field, some of the highly respected folks are at smaller schools, some didn't go to top-5 schools. They've made a name for themselves since. 

 

I would also ask yourself if the types of people who's opinions you care about care more about where you went to school or what kind of researcher you are- likelihood is, the people that matter won't care. 

[rufusjbuttlicker]

No, you should not feel bad at all. I was the first person to win a fellowship from my definitely not top-tier R1, and it's been a great experience. 

 

It definitely smooths along interactions with researchers outside of my institution- having the NSF is a nice feather in your cap (and on your CV) that will certainly help you along. 

 

People worry too much about prestige, in my opinion. It matters, to some degree, if you want to land a job at an R1 as a researcher- but what matters more is showing that you're a good researcher. In my small sub-field, some of the highly respected folks are at smaller schools, some didn't go to top-5 schools. They've made a name for themselves since. 

 

I would also ask yourself if the types of people who's opinions you care about care more about where you went to school or what kind of researcher you are- likelihood is, the people that matter won't care. 

 

Going along with what this says.

Generally, going to a top tier school is supposed to a) connect you with more people who work in your discipline (more interesting problems and conversations that can lead to more productive work), a more competitive academic environment where you try to publish to keep up with the prestige of your school and the work ethic of your peers. Beyond this, the meaning isn't that much. Of course, if you do not plan on doing research/academia after graduation then the school name matters slightly more (not sure what you would be doing though, especially since Chemistry !). But really, its your own independent work ethic.

Hiring committees at universities tend to pick candidates from better schools because the combination of a) and have led to more productive researchers that have better looking CVs. But you can still do it at a lower school, its just up to you. You need to:

1. Work very hard and consider everyone outside and inside your school as a rival, because that is the case even in year 1 of graduate school. You must shine!

2. Network aggressively at conferences and promote your work online as much as possible.

3. Publish as much as possible, and push your adviser to work in the same direction.

4. Plan for the future; what are the necessary goalposts to hit to move to a successful postdoc then maybe a high tier school? (Note: the answer is always the same ... publish or perish).

[ron_swanson]

Eigen

 

Yeah, I was talking with the CO at one of the schools I was considering and he had concerns (along the lines of my concerns about the NRC being Federally funded).  This was before I formally accepted their offer.  I just accepted the school's offer like 3 hours ago and sent a follow-up email, so he'll probably put more thought in to my questions.  I also just emailed GRFP with my questions/concerns.  If the green light is given I'll like contact Ford to get their approval.

 

Things get complicated because I have a 3rd private fellowship to throw in there... good ol' three body problem.

Edited April 3, 2015 by ron2d2

[Aliake]

Just a quick question. If you go abroad (UK institution) then there's absolutely nothing you can do with the GRFP correct?

[VentiHalfCaff]

Wow, Pitangus, thank you! (post #795)

That was an awesome post! So informative.

 

So, from your description, my 5 VG's and 1 E were either rated by tough reviewers and then given higher z-scores that ultimately put me in group one, or I was awarded from group two because of other criteria like "geographical region, discipline, and other factors." Very interesting.

 

Thanks so much for explaining!

[GABA-daba-doo]

Hello all~

 

I was awarded as an incoming first year student, but I haven't decided on my program yet. Does anyone know if there's a way to update what institution I'll be attending? I had planned for one program and indicated that institution when applying, but now feel I'll be accepting a different school's offer.

 

Hi nananiemand. I was in the same situation as you. When you accept the award, you will then have to declare your status for the following year (tenure or reserve). This form has the option to switch your institution, and I believe that's all you have to do! Make sure you do it at least a week before the May 1st deadline, because it has to get approved.

[gpantel]

No, you should not feel bad at all. I was the first person to win a fellowship from my definitely not top-tier R1, and it's been a great experience. 

 

It definitely smooths along interactions with researchers outside of my institution- having the NSF is a nice feather in your cap (and on your CV) that will certainly help you along. 

 

People worry too much about prestige, in my opinion. It matters, to some degree, if you want to land a job at an R1 as a researcher- but what matters more is showing that you're a good researcher. In my small sub-field, some of the highly respected folks are at smaller schools, some didn't go to top-5 schools. They've made a name for themselves since. 

 

I would also ask yourself if the types of people who's opinions you care about care more about where you went to school or what kind of researcher you are- likelihood is, the people that matter won't care. 

 

Going along with what this says.

Generally, going to a top tier school is supposed to a) connect you with more people who work in your discipline (more interesting problems and conversations that can lead to more productive work), a more competitive academic environment where you try to publish to keep up with the prestige of your school and the work ethic of your peers. Beyond this, the meaning isn't that much. Of course, if you do not plan on doing research/academia after graduation then the school name matters slightly more (not sure what you would be doing though, especially since Chemistry !). But really, its your own independent work ethic.

Hiring committees at universities tend to pick candidates from better schools because the combination of a) and have led to more productive researchers that have better looking CVs. But you can still do it at a lower school, its just up to you. You need to:

1. Work very hard and consider everyone outside and inside your school as a rival, because that is the case even in year 1 of graduate school. You must shine!

2. Network aggressively at conferences and promote your work online as much as possible.

3. Publish as much as possible, and push your adviser to work in the same direction.

4. Plan for the future; what are the necessary goalposts to hit to move to a successful postdoc then maybe a high tier school? (Note: the answer is always the same ... publish or perish).

 

Thank you both for your responses! I do feel strongly that I've made the best choice for my graduate research. I suppose that the networking is something that I should put extra effort into because of the institution I've chosen.

[juilletmercredi]

Congratulations to all of you new NSF awardees! I found out that the notifications went out on Wednesday and raced to this forum, lol.

 

@mheimbu2, I don't think you are overreacting because disappointment is natural. However, my read of your description doesn't sound like you are doing door-to-door outreach and education. You noted that you would gain access to do your research by speaking privately to landowners and others; that sounds like speaking privately to individuals to secure data and the means to gain it. Honestly, the outreach and education part sounds kind of thrown in - "And yeah, in the course of trying to get access to their yards I'm also going to tell them a bit about my research." You'd have to be a bit more explicit about your plans to do one-on-one education with the people you're connecting with.

 

I don't think your feedback would be welcome, frankly. You honestly have no idea how much thought and consideration the reviewer put into your application. Perhaps they overlooked something, but perhaps you didn't express your plans clearly enough in your proposal. It's hard to tell without seeing it, and you can't really determine how good or bad this reviewer is on the basis of one sentence from your reviews.

 

@gpantel - It varies by field. I would say that you should not feel bad about using your NSF however and wherever you see fit. An NSF + solid publications in good journals + an innovative, interesting area + a good postdoc will probably go a long way towards helping you secure great academic employment. The NSF is just the beginning. I agree in general that if your goal is an R1, elite SLAC, or some other prestigious R2 that the department prestige still matters somewhat, but for the vast majority of colleges in the country it's your track record that will matter more.

 

I have found that my NSF has impressed researchers outside of my home institution; when giving a job talk at my current postdoc, the director of the program commented on it publicly, and several other people have commented specifically on it in reviewing my CV. I have yet to go on the full academic job market to look for TT jobs (fingers crossed for the fall!) but I have noticed that many of the successful professors at the kinds of jobs I want had an NSF in graduate school - more than you would expect by random chance.

[SeanDDavies]

Has anyone in the Clinical/Counseling Psyc field been able to receive the GRFP?

[gellert]

^ I know someone who did back in the early 2000s with a basic science proposal. But they tightened up on eligibility requirements this year and there's no longer any way for clin/counseling people to do it at all, even if their science is basic research with clinical applications.  The program solicitation now phrases it such that they will not fund you if you are getting a clinical/counseling degree regardless of your research focus.

 

See the program solicitation: http://www.nsf.gov/pubs/2014/nsf14590/nsf14590.htm#elig

Edited April 6, 2015 by gellert

[Storyhill22]

Has anyone in the Clinical/Counseling Psyc field been able to receive the GRFP?

 

I am in a clinical psych program and was awarded the fellowship. I believe there were 7 people in clinical psychology programs. You can look through the list of people who received the fellowship by area of study. 

 

Another person in my lab got the NSF last year. Both of our proposal did not include clinical populations, but focused on methodological issues regarding clinical research

Edited April 7, 2015 by Storyhill22

[SeanDDavies]

Gellert- I read the requirements and it appears that they do not accept proposals from clinical or counseling. I am guessing the reason Storyhill22 and their lab member were able to receive it is because it was in previous year prior to these new guidelines, assuming that it is indeed a new guideline instituted this year. 

 

What a shame because it does indeed seem like an excellent opportunity. Anyone know of similar fellowships in which counseling/clinical people can apply?

[Storyhill22]

Gellert- I read the requirements and it appears that they do not accept proposals from clinical or counseling. I am guessing the reason Storyhill22 and their lab member were able to receive it is because it was in previous year prior to these new guidelines, assuming that it is indeed a new guideline instituted this year. 

 

What a shame because it does indeed seem like an excellent opportunity. Anyone know of similar fellowships in which counseling/clinical people can apply?

 

I was just awarded this year and the guidelines said the same things when applied. My lab focuses on neuroimaging and general emotions. Clinical Students can apply as long as the proposal isn't based in clinical work or uses a clinical population. 

[doctordestiny]

So what are the odds of getting bumped up from HM to awarded?  I'm masochistic in keeping some small hope alive.

[doomination]

doctordestiny: roughly 0%. HM for me too. Didn't get any useful feedback either, all of my reviews were very positive.

[engineerathon]

So what are the odds of getting bumped up from HM to awarded?  I'm masochistic in keeping some small hope alive.

 

doctordestiny: roughly 0%. HM for me too. Didn't get any useful feedback either, all of my reviews were very positive.

 

The odds are around 2% to 3%, given that around 50-60 awardees reject their offer every year. I got an HM too, with two very positive reviews (E/E) and one reviewer who didn't like my GPA, but otherwise really liked my application (VG/VG). I think it's best not to think about it... But I'm sure half of the HMs will worry about it until the upgrade letters go out anyway (mid-June I think).

 

Oh: and long-time reader, first-time poster.

Edited April 7, 2015 by engineerathon

[ibc]

Is there merit in re-taking the GRE solely for the purposes of applying for the GRFP? Or are there other ways to demonstrate quantitative competency and compensate for my low Q score? 

 

Verbal and Writing are 97th and 93rd %ile, respectively, but as mentioned, my Quant score is laughably low (37th %ile). I'm wondering if that's enough to sink a potential application. Undergrad GPA was 3.76 (graduated magna cum laude).

Q: 149

V: 167

AW: 5.0

 

I'm not as awful at math as my score would suggest, but it doesn't come naturally to me, unlike verbal. So it can take me a little while to wrap my head around a problem and solve it; the time constraints on the GRE really sunk my score. Give me five minutes per problem rather than ~two, and I suspect I'd do a lot better... (if I were to retake, I'd work on this, obviously.)

 

Background: Accepted to a research-heavy/PCSAS-accred. clinical psych PhD program for Fall '15. My research is in affect science (i.e., emotion and emotion regulation, using psychophysiology/neuroimaging/etc. methods) which I have been/am studying in clinical populations at the moment, but the questions needn't be confined to those populations.

Edited April 8, 2015 by ibc

[geographyrocks]

The NSF GRFP does not even accept GRE scores. 

[ibc]

The NSF GRFP does not even accept GRE scores. 

 

Well, that'll teach me to do my own research, ha. Thanks. I clearly haven't been looking that closely at all of the finer details yet, just had family members (also in academia) express concern over my chances given my Q score. 

Edited April 8, 2015 by ibc

[geographyrocks]

They used to require the GRE and some other fellowships still do (NPSC, NDSEG).  There's been some talk about clinical psych (ex: if NSF allows it) further up on this page and on the previous page of this thread that may be worth reading. 

[akt4933]

Does anyone know if current fellows will get back pay for the stipend increase again this year? Last year, when the stipend increased from $30,000 to $32,000, we essentially got a $2000 "bonus" at the end of the year. I'm wondering if this will happen again this year as it increased from $32,000 to $34,000.