Graduate Draft

[WildeThing]

Here me out. Forget about applying to schools. Imagine everything was centralized. All English departments were in one database. You upload all your stuff and list maybe some places you’d like to go. Departments then go through everyone and choose who they want to send offers to. Not considering any medievalists this year? Filter them out of the pool. This way, we’re not wasting time applying to schools that won’t consider us for hidden reasons, and maybe you fit at a school that you didn’t think to apply to. Is it too much work for committees? I dunno, they can figure it out.

[havemybloodchild]

I’m here for this.

[Sav]

I'm pretty sure law applications have one site where you upload all of your materials and the programs you want are able to access them. Some people were discussing this in my program so it's possible I have some details wrong. Anyway, that seems similar and much easier! 

[havemybloodchild]

6 minutes ago, Sav said:

I'm pretty sure law applications have one site where you upload all of your materials and the programs you want are able to access them. Some people were discussing this in my program so it's possible I have some details wrong. Anyway, that seems similar and much easier! 

Yes they do!

[stressbot3000]

Tbh I’d be happy with something as simple as a common app so that I didn’t have to enter my emergency contact information 10000 times 

[havemybloodchild]

1 minute ago, stressbot3000 said:

Tbh I’d be happy with something as simple as a common app so that I didn’t have to enter my emergency contact information 10000 times 

Right? Like four of my programs didnuse the same app platform but it didn’t save info from one program to the next so I still had to enter whatever years I think I was in that first community college fifteen gd years ago over and over and over...

[Sav]

48 minutes ago, kendalldinniene said:

Right? Like four of my programs didnuse the same app platform but it didn’t save info from one program to the next so I still had to enter whatever years I think I was in that first community college fifteen gd years ago over and over and over...

Lol same! I had to keep going back and checking. Also couldn’t remember my GPA from that long ago 

[havemybloodchild]

16 minutes ago, Sav said:

Lol same! I had to keep going back and checking. Also couldn’t remember my GPA from that long ago 

Right? And I’m like who even gives a shit what my gpa was when I was fifteen? It’s irrelevant. Everything I did then is irrelevant by now. Of course maybe if my gpa and other decisions from then weren’t such shite I wouldn’t feel that way.

[stressbot3000]

@kendalldinniene I got the sense from looking at a number of department websites that they only REALLY care about your last two years of undergrad when it comes to GPA-- at least that's what I'm telling myself! I sure hope a C- in a math class (lol) my freshman year of college won't be a factor here...

[havemybloodchild]

45 minutes ago, stressbot3000 said:

@kendalldinniene I got the sense from looking at a number of department websites that they only REALLY care about your last two years of undergrad when it comes to GPA-- at least that's what I'm telling myself! I sure hope a C- in a math class (lol) my freshman year of college won't be a factor here...

I think you’re right. And I think performance in your major is way more important than your overall gpa.

[lindsey372]

cool idea 

[j.alicea]

Law schools do not have a common app. You submit lsat scores, transcripts, and minimum of three LORs to CAS (credential assembly service), which is a requirement for most law schools, but not all. Once you do this, you still have to search for schools you want to receive the report. Then you have to submit a personal statement tailored to the program, highlighting particular interests and POI, and the page length varies from school to school, and some schools require additional written documents. So, by and large, it’s a similar process. And, personally, I find that differentiation as opposed to homogeneity is a good thing; different people have different interests, learning habits and strengths, and visions for how a university should function. It is difficult to have to go through so many programs to figure out where you think you may fit, and I agree that departments should be more transparent about what they are looking for. Still, some universities care about GRE’s, others don’t. Some will prefer applicants who are pretty set on what they want to do, others want students they can mold, and still others want a combination of those types. Some universities are all about teaching, others are research driven, and again there are those that want to strike a balance between the two. Plus, I like that departments choose their own standards, or choose how they approach Literature in the Americas (should it be just English or Comp. Lit., or is there space inbetween for American lit programs?)  It’s important that we know what we want, what will help foster our growth and facilitate our goals, when we apply for something as big as a grad school. 

Edited February 1, 2019 by j.alicea

[WildeThing]

I agree, but there’s no reason why committees can’t figure that out from a standard SoP than from one tailored to them. Instead of an SoP you could have sections to write about (what are your plans, why do you want to study a phd, what theories have influenced you, teaching experience, etc.).

[victoriansimpkins]

8 hours ago, WildeThing said:

I agree, but there’s no reason why committees can’t figure that out from a standard SoP than from one tailored to them. Instead of an SoP you could have sections to write about (what are your plans, why do you want to study a phd, what theories have influenced you, teaching experience, etc.).

I agree with this -- i would prefer answering 10 specific questions in 250 words or so than writing another SOP ever blindly trying to figure out what they want to hear. I know a couple programs who give a sort of "write about your past, present and future, but be sure to mention this, this, and this too" and I appreciated those a lot. 

[Mumasatus]

I'm not sure if this is true or not, but I have heard from one professor that the applications are convoluted by design. They want to know who is going to go to the trouble of reading every word on every page of their confusing website in order to follow the directions to the letter and who is just half-assing it. 

I can't remember which school it was for, but I know my daughter spent a long time on getting the SOP down to the correct word count only to find buried on another page "disregard the word count requirement listed on page..."

It is so frustrating. 

On the other hand, even if the system is set up that way, there is no reason to believe that the people reading the application have the same goals. 

My daughter was applying to a program once and she contacted the department to ask if she could go over on the word count. The guy who answered the phone said, "The people sitting in this room make the decision and I promise you we have never once looked at the word count of an application."

That is part of why everyone feels so helpless about this process. It feels so random, but I understand that some of the application materials are just subjective. One reader may find a writing sample excitingly complex while the next one thinks the same sample is wordy and too esoteric. 

But in the end, you really want to go where people want you and like the work you are doing. Maybe you wouldn't have been happy at all in the programs that don't select you. 

It looks like we all have an emotional few weeks ahead of us.  

 

[Warelin]

I think Application Season is wonderful practice for the Academic Job Market. Each job on the job market will want a number of different documents. The length of these documents will also differ at each school. Application Season (while stressful) allows everyone to become better aquainted with each school they're interested in and learn how to tailor their application to each school they're applying to which is a crucial skill when applying on the Job Market. The practice allows you to think carefully about what you enjoy doing and which schools align well with your interests and your values in the future. (Are you interested in research? Teaching?) Are you sensitive to temperatures? What about area? How do you feel about a large lecture?How do you feel about small schools? After Graduate School, there are a lot more schools which have the potential to hire you. According to World Atlas, there are 3,026 4-year institutions. That's a lot of work to catch up on if you aren't sure what you're looking for within a university.

I think the biggest part this would cause is a huge increase in the number of applications. Less work means people who aren't passionate might apply anyway to get in. In turn, this will lead to less-interested professors who only applied because they were trying to delay something else in life without really caring about what that thing was. On the flipside, it might also mean that universities will only look at students who listed their university at the number 1 or 2 spot because these students are more likely to accept their offer. I don't see that going well for many people. The SOP is crucial because it allows professors to not get overbooked and different people might be interested in the same professor for different aspects. Without the SOP, professors would have to spend more time looking over applications on top of their additional responsibilities which often include teaching, academic advising, publishing, academic meetings, serving on other committees, applying for tenure/trying to get a promotion and so on.

[WildeThing]

More work is true, but that’s also true of abolishing fees. Perhaps it’s work that is worth doing. Similarly, more people might apply, but if they actually get in, doesn’t that mean that the system is flawed if readers can’t tell who is actually committed and who isn’t? I feel more for the person who winds up giving up on the dream because they didn’t know about X program or thought they would never get it and missed out.

[j.alicea]

I don’t think the elimination of fees would increase the number of applicants in the same way that having a general app pool for all universities to dip into would... plus, the SoP seems to me to be an indispensable document that demonstrates an applicants ability to enter scholarly discourses; to not only relate their work to professor x’s, y’s, or z’s work, but also to fill gaps in the department. A professor who assisted some with one of my SoPs raises this point several times: the SoP isn’t all about how you will benefit from the department, but also about how they will benefit from your presence. This brings us to a very important point made by @Warelin, that the whole application process helps us to understand what different universities and their scholars are doing, and it prepares us for the job hunt after grad school and other application processes we will likely face during grad school (fellowships, research grants, summer opportunities, etc.). My thesis has absolutely benefited from reading the work of countless scholars from universities that I applied to, as well as those to which I did not end up applying. It’s a difficult and painful process, with plenty of missed opportunities: this sentiment can be applied to the experiences of applying to and attending grad school equally.

Edited February 1, 2019 by j.alicea