Welcome to the 2012-2013 cycle

[Tupamaros]

Question in relation to the recent MIT rejection. I was dinged in the first slaughter, and then people seem to be rejected together a bit later and in lesser numbers. Would it be safe to say that this is reflective of a 'round' system to reduce numbers, and that us dinged in the first instance didn't  get very far?

[grantman]

In honor of President's Day I present the following:

 

[Wemayet]

Received an email from the Wilson School (Princeton).  Infromation from that includes: 555 applicants "completed the admissions survey", they will announce admissions "on or before" the "Ides of March" ~ so around the 15th, and their hosting date for admitants will be April 6th.

[brkrgal85]

Congrats! =) 

 

If I may ask, what subfield are you? And how did you get to know? I applied there too and actually thought it was one of my best fits so now I'm anxious. 

The DGS called me.  I'm comparative/international relations.  Good luck! 

[brkrgal85]

I noticed that as well. Young and immature. Was probably told his/her entire life how wonderful they are by their parents/professors. Wait until they enter the real world. They are in for a shock, but will hopefully grow up quickly. 

Actually, grad school reflects the real world more than undergrad.  A lot of people are in for a rude awakening.  I've been working for 5 years.  No regrets!!

[PhDhopeful2013]

Question in relation to the recent MIT rejection. I was dinged in the first slaughter, and then people seem to be rejected together a bit later and in lesser numbers. Would it be safe to say that this is reflective of a 'round' system to reduce numbers, and that us dinged in the first instance didn't  get very far?

 (I was also dinged in the first round) But I wouldn't read too much into it, in my opinion.  One of the rejections posted today says he/she received the email on the 13th, same as everyone else.  As for the possibility of a blind waitlist, the department probably wouldn't have enough info yet to reject the second round.  i doubt enough people who were admitted have already committed to going there, so the dept may not know yet if it has to admit or reject people from the wait list.  plus the original email may have gotten kicked back from some people's emails.. it was from XXX@mit afterall!

[Wemayet]

You know... at $90 per application (not taking into account any waivers that might have been given and assuming all applications cost the same) the Wilson School took in just shy of $50,000 on application fees for all programs.  For the PhD program, according to their website, there are only six spots.  How many of these applications are receiving $90 worth of consideration, do you think?  Unlike other schools, who have had the manners of a starving monkey dropped into a bowl of bananas in their rejection notices, at least the Wilson School has sent me a note essentially apologizing for taking so long; but they also had the highest fee of any school to which I have applied, perhaps for a higher fee you get a more gentle rejection.  Ultimately, if Vanderbilt mails me a box of elephant dung (btw, you really can order this to send to people) as a rejection I'll welcome it because they had no application fee.

 

Obviously, this has been an expensive process for us all. Not including lost income from the prodigeous amount of time spent on applications, I dished out around two thousand dollars in various primary, secondary and incidental expenses.  This could have easily doubled if I had taken the GRE a second time and one of those study courses; in fact, I couldn't have afforded to do so.  Anyone's application could be stronger if they could afford unlimited coaching and opportunities to take the GRE; being financially limited is obviously limiting in this sense, and going further into debt to achieve these objectives is a dangerous game being played with brilliant people. 

[PhDhopeful2013]

congrats to the newest admits today!!

[GopherGrad]

Question in relation to the recent MIT rejection. I was dinged in the first slaughter, and then people seem to be rejected together a bit later and in lesser numbers. Would it be safe to say that this is reflective of a 'round' system to reduce numbers, and that us dinged in the first instance didn't  get very far?

 

Resist the urge to read the tea leaves.

 

It's like trying to explain why some people are attracted to you and others aren't.

[Tupamaros]

 (I was also dinged in the first round) But I wouldn't read too much into it, in my opinion.  One of the rejections posted today says he/she received the email on the 13th, same as everyone else.  As for the possibility of a blind waitlist, the department probably wouldn't have enough info yet to reject the second round.  i doubt enough people who were admitted have already committed to going there, so the dept may not know yet if it has to admit or reject people from the wait list.  plus the original email may have gotten kicked back from some people's emails.. it was from XXX@mit afterall!

 

Yeah I see the points your making. Not sure about the xxx point, though it may be valid in this case, it seems a number of people got rejected from UCSD later than the monster first batch, which does maybe suggest that they may have been in the mix a little longer?

[brkrgal85]

You know... at $90 per application (not taking into account any waivers that might have been given and assuming all applications cost the same) the Wilson School took in just shy of $50,000 on application fees for all programs.  For the PhD program, according to their website, there are only six spots.  How many of these applications are receiving $90 worth of consideration, do you think?  Unlike other schools, who have had the manners of a starving monkey dropped into a bowl of bananas in their rejection notices, at least the Wilson School has sent me a note essentially apologizing for taking so long; but they also had the highest fee of any school to which I have applied, perhaps for a higher fee you get a more gentle rejection.  Ultimately, if Vanderbilt mails me a box of elephant dung (btw, you really can order this to send to people) as a rejection I'll welcome it because they had no application fee.

 

Obviously, this has been an expensive process for us all. Not including lost income from the prodigeous amount of time spent on applications, I dished out around two thousand dollars in various primary, secondary and incidental expenses.  This could have easily doubled if I had taken the GRE a second time and one of those study courses; in fact, I couldn't have afforded to do so.  Anyone's application could be stronger if they could afford unlimited coaching and opportunities to take the GRE; being financially limited is obviously limiting in this sense, and going further into debt to achieve these objectives is a dangerous game being played with brilliant people. 

Also, no offense to the undergrads on the board going straight to graduate school, but the amount of time to study for the GRE is reduced big time if you are working.  I did take a study course, but it was online, and it was a secondary company (I didn't use Kaplan and the companies that will charge 1000+).  Another big pet peeve - the cost of sending the GRE scores PER report to the institutions.  25 bucks for each score beyond your 4 "free" ones.  Wooow...

[raptureonfire]

Some kids seem to think way too highly of themselves judging from the comments in the results search.

 

With the rejections, I tend to give people some slack.  Many people, especially the younger ones just out of undergrad, aren't familiar with the competitive nature of the doctoral application process, and don't know how to process a rejection.  The first instinct is to demean or belittle the school as a defense mechanism.  After all, if they profess to have a low opinion of the school, they don't feel like they lose face for being rejected.

 

For example, in response to being rejected from UC Santa Barbara:

 

Haha so funny went to Uchicago undergrad, nothing but a safety school just in case of all rejection to top10 program

 

What people need to learn is that we're all in the same boat here; nobody loses face for being rejected from a school.  We all expect to be rejected from a few schools.  That's part of the process.

 

Edit: I should probably note that, while I do give people slack when it comes to these knee-jerk responses, I'm not terribly impressed by them.  They're certainly obnoxious, but I tend to think of them as evidence of immaturity instead of character flaw.

Edited February 18, 2013 by raptureonfire

[raptureonfire]

 Another big pet peeve - the cost of sending the GRE scores PER report to the institutions.  25 bucks for each score beyond your 4 "free" ones.  Wooow...

 

It's a racket.

[brkrgal85]

With the rejections, I tend to give people some slack.  Many people, especially the younger ones just out of undergrad, aren't familiar with the competitive nature of the doctoral application process, and don't know how to process a rejection.  The first instinct is to demean or belittle the school as a defense mechanism.  After all, if they profess to have a low opinion of the school, they don't feel like they lose face for being rejected.

 

For example, in response to being rejected from UC Santa Barbara:

 

 

What people need to learn is that we're all in the same boat here; nobody loses face for being rejected from a school.  We all expect to be rejected from a few schools.  That's part of the process.

People better learn rejection very quickly if they plan to compete in academia.  The doctoral application process is about as grueling as getting a job on Wall Street.

[brkrgal85]

It's a racket.

Agreed 100% - I found out they weren't even mailing them to institutions.  Just PDF'ing it and emailing it. 

[student90210]

With the rejections, I tend to give people some slack.  Many people, especially the younger ones just out of undergrad, aren't familiar with the competitive nature of the doctoral application process, and don't know how to process a rejection.  The first instinct is to demean or belittle the school as a defense mechanism.  After all, if they profess to have a low opinion of the school, they don't feel like they lose face for being rejected.

 

For example, in response to being rejected from UC Santa Barbara:

 

 

What people need to learn is that we're all in the same boat here; nobody loses face for being rejected from a school.  We all expect to be rejected from a few schools.  That's part of the process.

 

I totally agree with you and it is understandable, especially if you see rejection after rejection. I do think it is a very dry process, in which it is hard for schools to evaluate you at your real potential, but it's the same way on the job market. All it matters is to get in somewhere and prove yourself. You can do great research regardless of the school you're at, as long as you're hardworking and dedicated. I don't blame anyone that gets upset with a school for rejecting them, as you said, it's a coping mechanism and that's fine. Everyone goes through an existential crisis when they graduate and think: "Now what?" so being rejected by the academia and having to go find a job is really difficult. 

[PhDhopeful2013]

Yeah I see the points your making. Not sure about the xxx point, though it may be valid in this case, it seems a number of people got rejected from UCSD later than the monster first batch, which does maybe suggest that they may have been in the mix a little longer?

 i was half (only half!) joking about the XXX email address getting rejected from someone's email account.   and yes, depending on the timeframe of a rejection or group of rejections you may be able to discern how far you may have made it in the process, but even then, you never know.  I was specifically thinking this wouldn't be the case for MIT because the turnaround time between acceptances (slightly over a week ago) and committed matriculants would be too short... of course i can't pretend to know the ins and outs of this torturous process!

[PhDhopeful2013]

It's a racket.

 Yes ETS is a true scam... $25 per score report is nuts.

[student90210]

 Yes ETS is a true scam... $25 per score report is nuts.

 

It's like a mafia, all together in this: schools, publishing companies, testing companies. I think it is a more broad issue, which concerns the costs of higher education skyrocketing in America and education being just for those privileged enough to have the resources to afford it. Sometimes I think about going back to Europe...

[chaetzli]

The issue about the costs of these standardize tests has just been covered in The Economist (not sure if someone mentioned it above):

http://www.economist.com/news/leaders/21571417-how-prevent-virtuous-meritocracy-entrenching-itself-top-repairing-rungs

Edited February 18, 2013 by chaetzli

[Wemayet]

The issue about the costs of these standardize tests has just been covered in The Economist (not sure if someone mentioned it above):

http://www.economist.com/news/leaders/21571417-how-prevent-virtuous-meritocracy-entrenching-itself-top-repairing-rungs

 

Typically excellent coverage by the Economist... my very favorite publication.  Nice link, +1 for you!

[student90210]

The issue about the costs of these standardize tests has just been covered in The Economist (not sure if someone mentioned it above):

http://www.economist.com/news/leaders/21571417-how-prevent-virtuous-meritocracy-entrenching-itself-top-repairing-rungs

 

Stiglitz talks about the same thing, more or less... 

 

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/02/16/equal-opportunity-our-national-myth/?hp

[Cesare]

With the rejections, I tend to give people some slack.  Many people, especially the younger ones just out of undergrad, aren't familiar with the competitive nature of the doctoral application process, and don't know how to process a rejection.  The first instinct is to demean or belittle the school as a defense mechanism.  After all, if they profess to have a low opinion of the school, they don't feel like they lose face for being rejected.

 

For example, in response to being rejected from UC Santa Barbara:

 

 

What people need to learn is that we're all in the same boat here; nobody loses face for being rejected from a school.  We all expect to be rejected from a few schools.  That's part of the process.

 

Edit: I should probably note that, while I do give people slack when it comes to these knee-jerk responses, I'm not terribly impressed by them.  They're certainly obnoxious, but I tend to think of them as evidence of immaturity instead of character flaw.

I agree with giving people slack because these are tough times on all of us, but for those reading this forum here is a word of advice - do not identify yourself as a Uchicago undergrad or whatever school you came from. It not only looks bad for the school you came from (it probably doesn't help that a few pages back a Uchicago person blatantly said that prospective students were laughed at), but your own Professors can identify you (I am fairly sure that Professors do read this thread). If you want to vent, that is fine because I am all for venting, but be smart about it.  

[PoliSwede]

 

With the rejections, I tend to give people some slack.  Many people, especially the younger ones just out of undergrad, aren't familiar with the competitive nature of the doctoral application process, and don't know how to process a rejection.  The first instinct is to demean or belittle the school as a defense mechanism.  After all, if they profess to have a low opinion of the school, they don't feel like they lose face for being rejected.

Even considering the fact that some might use it as a venting/coping-mechanism, I still have a hard time understanding the need to slag off on schools or act like a toddler.

 

We all expect to be rejected from a few schools.

 

I hope that's the case. I'm not too sure though. I think there are those who expect to gain admission to every school which they have applied to.

 

I sincerely wish for everyone to get in somewhere where they'll be happy. It might not be your "dream"-school, but if you end up in a good environment with supportive faculty and a good cohort, it'll be as pleasant of an experience as it can be.

[Wemayet]

Let's assume that professors do read this thread for a moment.  I for one am glad if they do!  If in ten years I'm in the position they are currently in (a professor), I think I too will read whatever version of this thread exists then... for one very good reason... to identify the unnecessary angst stiffling those joining the highest ranks of academia; presumably in order to do something good with that knowledge, such as help alleviate the causes.

 

I vent on here for three reasons: I feel better, it is vaguely therapeutic; perhaps in my sharing, someone else will feel better as well; and because deep down inside, I hope the people that can do something about the process are listening.  If they wanted to identify me, I have no doubt they could piece together my information and with an application in hand figure it out.  I also welcome that.  Just perhaps, one of the incentives of making quality comments on here could be that there is a slim chance a professor at one of the schools to which you have applied identifies you as a thought provoking individual and will reward you with their support in admissions.  <yeah, right... but I've had sillier thoughts!>