ZacharyObama

Are you trying to go on to a PhD program or go into a professional capacity after school?

My thoughts on your situation: 1. Have you tried begging Indiana for funding? Can't hurt to try. 2. Calculate out how much debt you could potentially be in going to Florida - I'm not familiar with the cost of living in that area of the country, but it sounds like you're looking at something like $7k in debt right off the bat. Did they give you funding for your entire program? Are you likely to be funded? 3. I can't tell if you've gone and visited the department at Davis. If you have not, do so. Also look not just at your potential adviser but what classes you're going to take. Talk to the other students at Davis. Find out more about funding after the first year. You need to do more first person research into these programs. No one on here is really going to be able to give you the sort of fine tuned advice into these programs. GO GO GO GO Time is running out. You want the maximum amount of information before making a decision like this one. Hope that helps.

I strongly second whirldpeas13's advice and encourage you to take her up on her offer. Career services offices can really suck sometimes and smart friends/family/acquaintances etc. can be a lot more helpful. I've been flat broke and on the verge of homelessness before, there are ways to get ahead. Look past the immediate circumstances, think really hard about what you can do week by week to try to get ahead, be open to suggestions both large and small, and above all remember that you are not alone in life, people here and in your life want you to succeed. I hope this might be of some comfort: - I also have a sub-3.0 GPA (2.7-8) and an D- on my transcript in a relevant course. I hope my advice above wasn't too blunt, but you would do well to think big plan even if it seems foolish in the moment. A lot things may be a crapshoot, but there are things you can do to learn to be a good craps player. One final thing I'm going to offer up and without knowing what your family situation is (housing is obviously one of the most important things in life) is to look into both Federal and local programs to help improve your housing situation: http://portal.hud.gov/hudportal/HUD?src=/topics/avoiding_foreclosure

@CharKel - Hope you're having fun. You should probably decide solely on the basis of weather.

I think that Berkeley program looks way cool even if it is new. It looks like you're going to have access to profs from a lot of great Berkeley departments (I'm biased as a Californian). You might want to search for and peruse through a lot of the threads on American in the Government Affairs sub-forum: http://forum.thegradcafe.com/forum/11-government-affairs/ - From what I've seen there are mixed reviews on American - people say it's kind of set off from the rest of DC. I would also keep in mind that DC is a large town with a number of great international development (JHU SAIS, Georgetown, GWU etc.) programs whose students you would likely be competing with for internships/fellowships. I also wouldn't take the US News rankings too seriously especially since you're planning on going into the Peace Corps. I think employers would see Berkeley/Peace Corps and that would be just fine in terms of professional credibility. Are you considered in-state for Berkeley? Did either program offer you a scholarship? If your professional interests are in Asia being on the West Coast might be a real advantage. Best of Luck.

The sense I have about Price school is that the USC Greek scene isn't a big factor at Price itself. In fact, my guess is that it's dominated by undergrads and by grad students who went to USC for undergrad. I went to an undergrad that didn't have a Greek system and I honestly did not sense any Greek presence at Price over the course of the two days that are there. Football of course did come up, but more in the sense of hey tailgating is a great opportunity for campus-wide networking. I'm not saying you can't fit in a Greek life while at Price but rather that most of your classmates are probably not going to be interested, it seemed to be about 1/3rd recent grads (not too USC heavy), 1/3rd sort of mid-20s types with some work experience (myself), and 1/3rd relatively established professionals, plus international students. In short, it seemed like a really good mix of people with a very wide range of experiences and ambitions. I think the trade off is that the students at Price all seemed really tight, they spend a lot of time in class/lectures and working on projects together. There seemed to be a real sense of community that extended from current students to alums. The so-called USC "Network" is a sort of for life thing, I'm not sure NYU is really like that per say. So I honestly don't think that's an immature consideration, we're not humanities PhD's working away in relative isolation, we're being trained to be public service professionals and that requires a great sense of collaboration and community. So in short, your frat will likely be Price School. You might want to ask Career Services what they can tell you about Alums who have gone on to international orgs like the World Bank. I think if you were interested in working abroad in parts of Latin America and China that Price has some really great folks for that at USC. There was talk that there are active Price Alum groups around the world, but I'm not quite sure how accurate/encompassing, I'm sure there are general USC alum groups. The alum panel did bring up the topic of employment in DC and the gist of it was that there are a lot of USC Price folks in DC including one of the panelists who works for DHS.

Well I'm not going into a PhD program at this point and there's not much talk about my field at CHE, so I found this board to be a more useful resource (thank you for helping maintain it). A few counterpoints: 1. I think you slightly misinterpreted my comment about the CHE forums - most of the professors etc. there are very nice people and they're not making that argument, but that so much energy is expended refuting it suggests that at least some people are making it at some point in time: in fact, the expectation that this is the goal of PhD programs is central to the argument: without it, there is no discussion of this topic (as the Slate piece amply demonstrates). 2. I know California did allow you to earn those credits while you were teaching. It's not as if it can't be done and teaching high school is always a better option than wallowing in the academic mud for eternity. Some credits might be transferable so you might not need to do a full load. 3. I went to a very-well regarded undergrad with one of the highest rates of PhD program placements in the country. In fact, I'm going to be rather the exception going to a professional school (well besides law or medicine) rather than an academic school. I'm not saying shut off CHE, but don't get swallowed up into it. Talking to your own professors and peers will give you a much better idea of how you might stack up than the CHE forums. CHE is not geared toward prospective graduate students at all, there's not even a dedicated forum for it there. It's not a very supportive or useful place IMHO to a prospective grad school applicant. I think it's probably more useful once you're well-into your PhD program and looking to make the transition and I think it's useful if you're already a prof. 4. I pay close attention to everything! I had dreams once of being a Professor of History ferchristsakes

I second the take the weekend off suggestion - in fact, take a vacation this summer preferably to somewhere adjacent to a large body of water. Also, increase your nutrition, caffeine, and alcohol intakes and get some exercise.

See that's why I stopped reading the CHE forums...people set up this you must become a tenure-track prof at an R1 in the US or otherwise you're a complete failure and will always be. It's just not true. I think there are other perfectly fine well-paying jobs in the US that are not R1 universities. I had several teachers in high school who had PhDs (in English, Chemistry, and Biology respectively) and had at some point discovered that they really actually enjoyed teaching high school students. They were admittedly in their 40's-50's but I don't see why one couldn't fall back on that as an option. I would imagine that most state's still have credentialing programs for people like that and then if you're in the regular public schools you can eventually get tenured, be unionized, have decent pay and a good retirement package. The same is also somewhat true for community college positions. At this point, you might say, wait wait wait you're telling people who put 5-7 years into a PhD for the most part to go do something which does not require a PhD how dare you! To that I say, is the point here the prestige of being an R1 research prof or is the point to be a financially stable person who is contributing to society. I also think that there are currently and will be even more options for people to teach overseas. The world is hungry for people who can work in a global environment. I have an old friend who is currently a tenured professor at a university in Western Africa - admittedly her field is social sciences she has always been interested in Africa, but it's naive to think that there are not places all over the world where someone with a fine American higher education can't go to share that knowledge. I mean really - what's the difference between teaching Kafka in North Dakota and teaching Kafka in Siberia other than the language? I think this takes me to my final point about all these arguments - the article OP writes: This person to me strikes me as someone who has been far too interested for far too long in totalizing their entire life into that of what one might call a wanker. Instead of doing something new and innovative this person has taken the approach that they should be the mirror image of their advisers work. I mean seriously, did they think that a recapitulation of what likely has been done many times before and not worked was going to be a successful approach? If you're going to go to graduate school your goal should be to do something marketable and new - this person is a Visiting Assistant Professor of German - I'm going to go ahead and presume that they are literate/speak German at some level. Germany has been one of the most successful countries in weathering the Great Recession, I would hazard since there is no mention of any attempt to find a work in Europe that they have not done so at all because they are too wrapped up in being tenure-track at high-level American institution. So in conclusion, if you think you want to be an academic in life, don't let shitty articles like this hold you back, but go into it having a plan to make yourself highly marketable with teaching, language, and life skills beyond what the status quo says you should be doing. I feel sorry for the undergrads this person is presumably teaching and think they would have been better served to not put their name on this tripe. You Ms. Schuman, are no Professor Pannapacker and your echo is not so loud.

Well grad school really isn't the thing you do when you don't know what you want to do - it's not like undergrad, you can't and shouldn't be wandering about too much, you should have some pretty solid idea of what you want to study and why you want to study it. Sending that message to an admissions committee in your SOP will just get you rejected and you'll be out your time and application fees. One thing I'm betting at least is that your overall GPA is now over 3.0 which is the cut-off for most programs, so that's a good thing for future consideration. Without knowing what region of the country you're in or if you're applying to jobs outside of your area, you might consider further expanding the area you're looking for jobs in. To me it doesn't sound like you're getting much help from the career center since you still don't really have too much of an idea of exactly what field you want to go into: employers like two things: background in their field and confidence you're willing to dedicate yourself to their position. No one except for the most charitable is going to hire you if you're down on yourself and your skills. You need to demonstrate a strong sense of direction even if you don't feel like you really have that at the moment. The other suggestion I might make is to consider something like the Peace Corps or the military (unfortunately AmeriCorps has been pretty defunded and doesn't really pay out great - but check that out too). Many schools have Peace Corps Fellowships and the military has great tuition benefits. You might also look into teaching English overseas - I know a number of people who have gone to China, Korea and Japan to do that and it's helped them greatly. Doing those sorts of things will greatly help your competitiveness if you do choose eventually to apply to graduate school. I hope this response is somewhat helpful, and having been pretty down and out of it before myself, I just want to let you know I can relate.

@acast032 - I sent you a private message. If you look at where your username is at the top right of the window you should see a red exclamation mark over the envelop - click on it. For the reference of future applicants, I still can't access camel - the way the system works i think is that if you've been offered a Dean's Merit or City/County Management Fellowship then you would be able to access it since you already have a partial aid package. The camel accounts seem to be controlled by the main USC admissions office. So if you can't access it that doesn't mean you're not accepted, you just haven't been offered an entrance scholarship - BTW - USC Price does not offer RA or TA at admission, but they can be had.

So I'll be attending USC next Fall and I'm from Los Angeles - so I'm biased in that regard. But I thought it might be useful to address some of the recent incidents of violence. I think you're probably referring principally to the murder of Ying Wu and Ming Qu last Spring. This was a tragic incident and was really shocking by Los Angeles standards because it was completely senseless. They were out in the neighborhood off-campus just outside of the area that USC security patrols at 1 a.m. in what for that neighborhood is a pretty nice car. The culprits weren't hardened gang members, they were stupid kids only 18 and 19 years old. It was a pretty random crime and is not something that happens with any regularity in a metro area of over 10 million people. The other incident you might be thinking of was the shooting on campus that occurred last Halloween which involved non-USC students who were attending a student group party. As a result of that incident, USC has put a security gate around campus and now requires people entering campus after 9 pm to either have USC ID or be on an official guest list. I believe additional security cameras and patrols have also been added. The result of this is that property crime on the USC campus itself has dropped although this is a less than ideal solution since in a way it just pushes the problem away to the periphery. I would also note that crime in Los Angeles goes down and is less than that in many categories than in many other major American cities. I would also note that both schools are in major cities, crimes happen, and that something so tragic as what happened to those two USC students is not common place, not by a long mile. No matter where you go you are going to need to take the similar precautions for safety. In short, assuming the financial situation for both schools is the same (I think the cost of living i.e. rent, food etc is similar), I would focus on the academics in making your decision as those are two somewhat different programs. There are job opportunities in both cities whether you are successful is largely up to how hard you're prepared to approach finding work and how hard you're willing to work for it. You have a lot to think about - I would look very closely at how the programs meet your career goals and then compare living issues. Both are excellent programs but they really are somewhat different - the USC MPA curriculum is a more general program in government than something more specialized like "Global Communication" in a dedicated international relations school. I hope this was helpful. You might also want to contact both admissions offices and ask to be put in contact with a student from China or an international coordinator to talk to - picking a school in another country is a really big decision. The help you're seeking out is probably not best found on an internet discussion board.

So my takeaways from the admitted student event before the coffee wears off this morning...I went to the optional day on the 4th and to the regular session on the 5th (I shouldn't have put "mandatory" above - it's not accurate): - I'm really glad I went to 4th - I sat in on the lecture/class from a visiting professor that MPA's were assigned to and I got to chit chat with my assigned adviser a little bit along with some other students and profs. The lecture was pretty interactive with both the students and profs in attendance asking questions, the atmosphere was very relaxed and that's a big plus in my book for any educational program. I then went on a small-group tour with a first year student that was really less of a tour per say than a chance to ask questions in a more relaxed environment. We chit-chatted for about half an hour past when it was supposed to end. - I then went and visited the financial aid office which has a walk-in ticket system and tried to finalize my anticipated finances for the first year. At that point, I felt like i had done my homework on the program and how I could make attendance work both financially and in terms of time-management. I turned in my commitment form to the admissions office. I think I'm a pretty easy sell on USC given my lengthy familiarity with the school being from the area and knowing alums and a former Price Prof through work so your mileage may vary in this regard. - Day 2 started at 8 am with continental breakfast - I chit-chatted with more profs and with a current student MPA student who had applied and been accepted to the MPL program. The formal program started after that with introductions and talks from one of the assistant deans, from the MPA program director, with the international initiative program director, and from career services. We then had a really informal panel with current MPA students that was really forthcoming about the school and I found really useful and refreshing that confirmed why I really like what USC Price is doing and which was consistent with the message throughout the day: that Price gives you a sound academic basis but that the point of this is to allow you to maximize your career development and that the program really tries to let you balance these two things. Students at Price study hard and play hard - but that as a professional program the goal is be become working public service professionals with cross-sector skills. - We were then ushered across the street to a hotel for lunch after which Dean Knott gave a straightforward talk on why we should come to USC. I think perhaps one of the more salient points he made is that while Price does take the US News rankings at face value, it's only because they want to be #1. USC Price is raising a boatload of money for new research centers, for growing the school, for financial aid, and for faculty. I think that while I'm making an investment by going that Price is also making a massive investment in providing me with world-class education and opportunities. USC in general is in the middle of a $5 billion dollar capital campaign and Price is pretty front and center in that endeavor. This was followed by a kind of half-put together chance to get a feel for the research center in the lobby to the ballroom which kind of fell flat because of the echo from so many people talking at once in a place with poor acoustics. - We then were ushered back into the ballroom and got kind of brief presentation from the general USC Financial Aid office (I felt this could have been better) and from USC Price financial aid coordinator who seems pretty fantastic. There was a pretty sincere and compelling panel with alums and then we went back to campus for a reception. The reception was fun, I had the chance to speak with a the Price financial aid coordinator about scholarships, with a couple more profs at length, with some more students and one of the alums. I ended up being one the last to leave as I wanted to wait out Friday evening rush hour a bit. I know there were a couple more chances to go out with student groups but at that point the coffee had worn off. - A couple things I found out - there are no RA/TA positions assigned to admits but if you chase them down they're there - several of the student panelists had RA positions in their second semester. It seemed like many of these were decent paying hourly positions and that some might include some level of tuition remission. Another great way to knock off tuition is to become a USC employee. I've looked at University employment and that definitely seems to be a great way to go about funding your education. BTW - transit passes seem to be really well subsidized for grad students - there's a special TAP card you can get through the campus grad student gov ($$$ sounds). - I would strongly second Muro that the Trojan "Network" is very strong and real with some national/global reach. USC can just be school for some people, but for a lot of people, it's a way of life - it's a real pay it forward type of deal. The Alums were helped and so they want to help students. One final cool thing is we all got business card holders and you can get 500 business cards through career services for like $15. I think that's about long enough. I hope people will find this useful now and in the future - I know I read threads for preceding years and feel that the more information I can provide for people in the future the better (apologies, I was a history major) Aloha!

Sounds like NYU is probably a better fit since you're interested in international orgs. Price seems really great for setting you up to do actual field work overseas (with a tilt toward Asia and Latin America) but it's not really trying to compete to place you at the UN or World Bank.

Thanks Muro! I'm going to turn in my commitment paperwork probably today. I'm doing their optional day today and then the mandatory one tomorrow. After that, I'll post my thoughts at some point soon. Excited!

@jwaller2 - Your profile looks really good. You should aim to do well on the GRE - and try to save for and plan to take it twice (I wish I had done that just for maybe a 2-4 point improvement in Quant and Verbal). That should help to offset your lower GPA. Make sure to customize your SOP for each school you apply to and encourage your LOR's to do the same. Also, I think most schools are going to ask for a letter from a professor (did you take classes with the dean?) so plan on that. Finely tune your SOP and resume. I'm also very interested in higher-level park/conservation/enviro management/planning and currently work for a pretty highly recognized municipal parks department, I did AmeriCorps before that for a state parks division. Look for jobs as well as applying to school so if you don't get in to school you want (I think you will) or get the funding (crap shoot) you want so that you will have something to fall back on during a gap year. Definitely consider USC and UCLA if you're interested in the West Coast - both have strong planning programs alongside their policy/admin offerings. Berkeley seems way more you need to have a couple years work experience. Without knowing all that much about them - you might want to look at UW-Madison, Indiana, CMU, and Duke which all seem to pair administration/enviro/planning/management. You also really should consider what area of the country you want to work in if your goal is local/state is your goal so you can build immediate connections while in school. Federal hiring is less regionally particular. Good luck and don't take this board too seriously.

This looks and reads like something this guy: http://www.fandm.edu/dean-hammer - put together in his spare time for his undergrads on the fly a couple years ago. It doesn't appear he teaches graduate courses so I would take that list with a grain of salt. It likely reflects his own biases and hasn't been updated in a couple years. I'd say this is no more or less useful than the US News rankings. I'm biased against rankings in general though so YMMV

Pointless Death

Robot Parade

You might want to edit out name and address.

Yes. Grad Plus loans do qualify, Parent PLUS loans from undergrad do not and if you consolidate them with loans that do qualify the consolidated loan will not qualify. Qualifying loans: http://studentaid.ed.gov/repay-loans/understand/plans/income-based Edit: In short the Federal Government (taxpayers), underwrote (subsidized) the Federal Family Educational Loan Program for decades under which Parent PLUS loans were made so that parents could send their kids to college, but the loans cannot be considered for IBR or PLSF which is designed to help the American public and encourage good citizenship. Go figure. Fortunately at least now they can't gamble with new student debts because the US Dept. of Ed. is now the loan originator for future loans created under the FFELP. Estimated savings to tax-payers - $68 billion over 11 years: http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/03/30/obama-signs-bill-on-student-loans-health-care/

I'm liking the sound of IBR/PLSF. In my case though it's really only a partial solution thanks to Parent PLUS Loans from undergrad (thanks California housing bubble). I still think our best solution to the student loan debt crisis in this country after looking at my interest projections is for the bankers to be uprooted from their boardrooms and vacation houses and sent en masse to reeducation camps in remote regions until they renounce their past lives and capitalism in general. I think it's fair to say that perhaps next to their shameful practices in the housing and health insurance markets, that the usurious interest rates they're charging are a massive drag on our economy and our national interest. My parents can't get a home-equity loan despite having stable income and sufficient equity several times over and having never missed or even been late on a payment of any mortgage. Bankers are thieves or worse.

I'm biased - YMMV. I think the difference between the IPPAM and the other two options is that it's not the basic program at the school. She must have substantial internships, be a special case, or have some other type of related work experience? Also, I just looked and doesn't it start this summer already or do they give her the option to wait until Fall: http://priceschool.usc.edu/programs/masters/ippam/ I also am no expert on our immigration laws, but I'm not sure how far her student visa goes in terms of getting a work visa albeit she could take unpaid internships without one. I'm not sure how you've concluded she wouldn't need a work visa to get a job anywhere. That part of your post doesn't make sense to me, but again, I'm not an expert. I don't recall any of my international friends in undergrad getting any jobs on campus or otherwise. If her goal and your goal is live in the US for an extended period you should take a long hard look at the likelihood of that working out ASAP. And let's be honest, our job market here isn't that great right now unless you're in a few select fields like energy development/mining. It's also hard to respond to this post without any indication of if $ is a factor in these decisions. Was she offered any scholarships? How important is that? If all things are equal I would say take the best cool with the best climate. The other thing you might consider is the size of immigrant communities from your country (?) in the city. Hope that was helpful.

I say take the money.

Good Luck