If I knew then what I know now...

[Munashi]

This may have been mentioned already, but it never hurts to just ask a program is they offer application fee waivers.  Some places don't at all, some will want documentation or at least an explanation, aaaaaand others will just waive the fee then and there for you.  Asking never hurts and you can save yourself some money!  Most of us are not millionaires and the application process can be financially stressful.  If you feel like a fee waiver could help you out, ask.  Just make sure you read the department's website carefully - some places pre-empt inquires with a blanket "no".

[gr8pumpkin]

God, I just wish I would have stuck with Plan A.  That's all.

[bsharpe269]

Yes, I'm talking specifically about biomedical fields, since that's what I'm familiar with.

Clinical psychology is an unusually competitive field. But the point still stands. I'd always err on the side of applying to fewer programs rather than more. Of course, it's a balancing act, no matter how focused you are; how far can I spread the risk before I look like someone who hasn't even researched the programs? It's another one of those judgment calls we're all called upon to make, but it's something I'd be very careful about. The more prestigious the program, the more they are going to view people who cast an extremely wide net with suspicion. International students often make this mistake, thinking it will help them, when it actually does considerable damage to their application.

 

Hmm I am in bioinformatics/biopysics and will be applying to 9 programs. I actual have very specific research interests too since I will be applying with a masters but there are that many programs in the country who are very strong in my specific subfield so I will be applying to all 9. I don't see any reason to limit myself to only a few when all of those schools have very strong departments in my specific interests and multiple PIs who are doing exactly what I want to do. Any of those 9 would give me perfect education for my future plans.

[aphdapplicant]

This may have been mentioned already, but it never hurts to just ask a program is they offer application fee waivers.  Some places don't at all, some will want documentation or at least an explanation, aaaaaand others will just waive the fee then and there for you.  Asking never hurts and you can save yourself some money!  Most of us are not millionaires and the application process can be financially stressful.  If you feel like a fee waiver could help you out, ask.  Just make sure you read the department's website carefully - some places pre-empt inquires with a blanket "no".

Relatedly, wouldn't it be great if you could upload your GREs like you can your transcripts at some places? Seriously adds up...

[Vene]

Relatedly, wouldn't it be great if you could upload your GREs like you can your transcripts at some places? Seriously adds up...

There's a reason I applied to 4 different universities, I could send out the GRE score for free. Granted, this meant I had to commit to such before seeing my results, but I'm okay with that kind of risk.

[jamebex]

I don't know if this is the right place to ask this.

l'm a recent graduate of biochemistry interested in doing a research assistantship abroad -Germany or US.

I'm having difficulty in securing this probably I'm doing it the wrong way because I saw couple of people who said they went abroad for a RA job before coming back to apply for graduate school.

What have I been doing? Ve been searching for summer research programmes and they all seem to be taking Undergraduates only and also for US residents.

Should I just apply directly to the lab I'm very interested in?

please I need help on this.

thanks

[victorydance]

Hmm I am in bioinformatics/biopysics and will be applying to 9 programs. I actual have very specific research interests too since I will be applying with a masters but there are that many programs in the country who are very strong in my specific subfield so I will be applying to all 9. I don't see any reason to limit myself to only a few when all of those schools have very strong departments in my specific interests and multiple PIs who are doing exactly what I want to do. Any of those 9 would give me perfect education for my future plans.

 

I think it's the right move. Honestly, there really isn't much of a opportunity cost to applying to a few more programs. As long as you can afford the application fees, ect., there really is not point not to.

[personalityresearcher]

Finding POIs and programs were more challenging, more work, and more stressful than the SOP and GREs; start looking for POIs & programs early - fit is huge!

[WriterTyger]

I'm not sure if this has been stated already, but...

1. Make sure your research topic is broad enough to give you a lot of choices but narrow enough to attract specific POIs. This is something I'll be working on for this coming application season.

Also 2. Find ways to connect with your potential departments. I wish I would have done both of these things, as I feel they might have helped nudge me off a wait list and into acceptance.

[bsharpe269]

Also 2. Find ways to connect with your potential departments. I wish I would have done both of these things, as I feel they might have helped nudge me off a wait list and into acceptance.

 

Can you give any more info on what you mean by this? Like an example of what you wish you would have done?

[WriterTyger]

Can you give any more info on what you mean by this? Like an example of what you wish you would have done?

I can sure try. A lot of people find ways to start email conversations with faculty they wish to work with.  

 

As a literature student, I wish that I would have been able to read more writing produced by the professors in wanted to work with.  With that basis, I would have been able to better tailor my SOP to best fit the program that I wanted to work within.  I really wish that I had emailed professors within the department or found places that they were speaking (lectures or conferences) so that I could have made a personal connection and thus maybe have a POI who would be willing to serve as an advisor for my research goals. 

 

I'm sorry, that was probably rambling...did that help to clarify at all?

[RunnerGrad]

1) Apply to at least 10 schools, and be prepared to only get to choose between 3 if your lucky. Getting a bunch of interviews does not mean you are likely to be admitted to any one of them.

 

2) have a back up plan. apply early for a post-bacc, real job, internship, or you might end up like me, a reject coming in late to the job process.

10 schools? I guess that's the difference between the U.S. And Canada. There aren't even 10 schools that offer my program. Only 7 offer my general program (combined masters-dietetic internship) and only 2 my specific area of interest (combined public health-dietetic internship).

[bsharpe269]

I can sure try. A lot of people find ways to start email conversations with faculty they wish to work with.

As a literature student, I wish that I would have been able to read more writing produced by the professors in wanted to work with. With that basis, I would have been able to better tailor my SOP to best fit the program that I wanted to work within. I really wish that I had emailed professors within the department or found places that they were speaking (lectures or conferences) so that I could have made a personal connection and thus maybe have a POI who would be willing to serve as an advisor for my research goals.

I'm sorry, that was probably rambling...did that help to clarify at all?

Thanks, that's very helpful advice! I am applying next season and am currently working on reading publications from all of the professors who I want to work with.

[victorydance]

10 schools? I guess that's the difference between the U.S. And Canada. There aren't even 10 schools that offer my program. Only 7 offer my general program (combined masters-dietetic internship) and only 2 my specific area of interest (combined public health-dietetic internship).

 

Well that's because the programs you applied to are very specific. It's more of a difference between professional and academic programs than anything else.

[maelia8]

I would have tried harder to get fee waivers for the GRE and for grad school application. It really exhausted my savings, and neither I nor my family are rich. I didn't take time to look at the fine print to see if I could have qualified for any fee waivers, and I know several of my friends who were successful in getting them after a little bit of extra research.

[RunnerGrad]

Well that's because the programs you applied to are very specific. It's more of a difference between professional and academic programs than anything else.

 

Not really.  If I go on to do a PhD afterwards, there are only 9 universities in Canada, accredited by the Dietitians of Canada, that offer PhD programs in English.  The other Dietitians of Canada accredited universities are either in French, or undergraduate only.  So it would be totally impossible for me to apply to 10 schools, not to mention financially difficult (I've never heard of universities in Canada waiving the admission fees, unlike in the U.S.)

 

So I think it really does come down to the difference between Canada and the U.S.

 

Besides, my chosen program is both an academic and a professional program.  Yes, it allows me to complete the internships required to become a registered dietitan, but it also prepares me for a PhD program.  In Canada, you just don't go straight from undergrad to PhD - most PhD programs (and all PhD programs in my field) require a Master's degree.  Without a Master's degree you simply won't be accepted to a PhD program.

[victorydance]

Not really.  If I go on to do a PhD afterwards, there are only 9 universities in Canada, accredited by the Dietitians of Canada, that offer PhD programs in English.  The other Dietitians of Canada accredited universities are either in French, or undergraduate only.  So it would be totally impossible for me to apply to 10 schools, not to mention financially difficult (I've never heard of universities in Canada waiving the admission fees, unlike in the U.S.)

 

So I think it really does come down to the difference between Canada and the U.S.

 

Besides, my chosen program is both an academic and a professional program.  Yes, it allows me to complete the internships required to become a registered dietitan, but it also prepares me for a PhD program.  In Canada, you just don't go straight from undergrad to PhD - most PhD programs (and all PhD programs in my field) require a Master's degree.  Without a Master's degree you simply won't be accepted to a PhD program.

 

I am Canadian, I am aware of the differences in school systems.

 

Dietetics is a very small field, actually it is a sub-field within a field. You would be hard pressed to find copious programs in the field in any country. 

 

If you take a more traditional program like economics or biology, you would be able to find graduate programs in these disciplines in virtually any major university in the country. 

 

And yes, your program is a professional program. The vast majority of courses are geared towards professional settings, not research. And this is what it says on your program info page:

 

Program Objectives

Graduates will:

• Demonstrate critical thinking skills to analyze information and solve problems creatively;
• Review and discuss the ethical challenges in Community Nutrition in order to respond appropriately in practice;
• Achieve core competency of an entry level dietetic practitioner as outlined by the College of Dietitians  of Ontario and the Partnership for Professional Dietetic Education and Practice;
• Understand the scope of and conceptual basis underlying advanced community nutrition practice;
• Develop their capacities, knowledge and skills to work as partners in interdisciplinary community health teams in a variety of work settings;
• Develop expertise according to their own unique interests and needs; and
• Develop the capacity to assess and find ways to satisfy life-long learning needs

Career Opportunities

Graduates are employed as nutritionists and consultants in public health departments, and local, provincial and federal levels of government. They are also employed by community health centres, not-for-profit organizations and the food industry.

 

 

 

Do you see anything related to research on there? I don't. You are in a professional program.

 

You are conflating your situation with the vast majority of everyone's else on this board. Most people on this message board are interested in academic programs. Doesn't matter what country you are from, applying to upwards of 10 or more programs is sound advice for any prospective graduate student, particularly those interested in pursuing doctoral programs. 

[RunnerGrad]

I am Canadian, I am aware of the differences in school systems.

 

Dietetics is a very small field, actually it is a sub-field within a field. You would be hard pressed to find copious programs in the field in any country. 

 

If you take a more traditional program like economics or biology, you would be able to find graduate programs in these disciplines in virtually any major university in the country. 

 

And yes, your program is a professional program. The vast majority of courses are geared towards professional settings, not research. And this is what it says on your program info page:

 

 

 

Do you see anything related to research on there? I don't. You are in a professional program.

 

You are conflating your situation with the vast majority of everyone's else on this board. Most people on this message board are interested in academic programs. Doesn't matter what country you are from, applying to upwards of 10 or more programs is sound advice for any prospective graduate student, particularly those interested in pursuing doctoral programs. 

 

You are cherry-picking information to support what you are saying.  The program I will be attending is both a professional and an academic program.  It does, in fact, mention research.  In fact, this is why it says:

 

"Preparation for Doctoral Studies

The MPH program in Community Nutrition and its Advanced Standing Option does not require students to complete a thesis.  However, students have the opportunity to complete research practica and research papers, and are eligible for most PhD programs. Applicants wishing to pursue doctoral studies should familiarize themselves with the specific admission requirements of doctoral programs of interest."

 

As someone who is in nutrition/dietetics, I think I know more about nutrition/dietetics programs than someone studying political science.

 

As I said, Canada is not the U.S.  Most PhD programs in Canada require a Master's degree.  Most PhD programs in the U.S. do not.  That is one major difference, right there.

 

The fact of the matter is that it would be impossible to apply for 10 programs, in my field, in Canada.  Both at the master's and the PhD level, there are simply not 10 programs out there.  In the U.S., there are considerably more programs.  I don't care how many programs there are in other fields.  Those are irrelevant to me.  So I think the advice to apply to 10 programs depends both on the country and the field of interest.  I wouldn't apply to 10 programs just for the sake of applying to 10. 

 

And no, my situation is not vastly different from that of the rest of the people on these forums. I hope to pursue a PhD after I complete my Master's degree. I plan on being involved in research. The only difference is that I cannot go straight from undergrad to PhD.  That simply doesn't happen (except in very, very rare cases) in Canada, and most of the time, when it happens, it happens to a strong student during their master's program - they are allowed to proceed directly to the PhD without completing the master's as such. 

 

I have chosen a Master's program that, in addition to preparing me for PhD studies, allows me to complete the internships required to become a registered dietitians because I don't want to have to spend yet another year completing a dietetic internship on top of a more typical master's degree.  So please, if you don't understand how dietetics works in Canada, don't comment.  The fact of the matter is that I need a master's to apply for dietetic PhD programs in Canada.  I can't be admitted straight out of undergrad.  I also need to complete an internship in order to become a registered dietitian.  The UofT program allows me to complete both a master's degree and a dietetic internship at the same time, while still providing me with the background necessary to apply for PhD programs when I am finished (see the appropriate quote above from the Dalla Lana website, not the cherry-picked information you copied).  Since the master's program I will be attending prepares me for Doctoral Studies, it is just as academic as any other master's program.  It simply doesn't require a thesis, but that doesn't mean it isn't academic.  Or else your definition of "academic" is greatly different from mine.

 

(I was also admited to a pure academic MSc program, so I would say my experiences applying to that program, and being accepted to that program, are no different for anyone else applying to either a master's, from Canada, or a PhD, in the U.S., as I still had to have research experience, an appropriate letter of intent, strong letters of recommendation, etc.  Again, there simply aren't 10 programs in my field, in Canada, even when looking at "pure" academic programs (i.e. master's that require a thesis).  So again, how many programs you "should" apply to depends on your field of interest, and where you are located.)

Edited April 20, 2014 by RunnerGrad

[victorydance]

You're not understanding the overarching purpose of my argument. You are an exception to the rule, not the norm. This thread is about general advice, not exceptions. Applying to a number of programs for academic programs is sound advice, this isn't about you. 

 

Cherry picked? I didn't realize that quoting the objective of the program and career opportunities is cherry-picking. Seem like pretty crucial aspects of the program, no?

 

Just because you can parlay a professional masters program into an acceptance to a doctoral program doesn't mean that your program isn't a professional program. I could get acceptance to a doctoral program in political science with a MPP, doesn't mean that a MPP isn't a professional program.

 

Academic programs DO NOT have internships as a crucial component of the program. Academic programs DO NOT have no research based courses, and DO NOT lack a option for a thesis. 

 

My definition for graduate academic programs is pretty simple: they are geared towards research. Professional programs are geared towards practical skills for the workplace. Guess which category your program falls into? I mean, christ, two of your four semesters are practicum semesters.

 

You even said yourself that you could theoretically apply to 9 programs. So even in your exception case, it is still possible to apply to a large number of programs. 

[AvatarPsych]

I would have tried harder to get fee waivers for the GRE and for grad school application. It really exhausted my savings, and neither I nor my family are rich. I didn't take time to look at the fine print to see if I could have qualified for any fee waivers, and I know several of my friends who were successful in getting them after a little bit of extra research.

 

Agreed. After $2500+ in applications and traveling, the one school I got into was my top choice and the school that didn't even require application fees. Could have saved a ton of $$ if I did this. My gap year was there to fund my application cycle pretty much.

[geographyrocks]

If I would've known then what I know now:

I would've applied to more scholarships during my UG.

I would've applied to more research opportunities

I would've looked into being an undergraduate teaching assistant my junior year of UG

I would've went to at least 1 major conference to network

I wouldn't have applied to schools where fit was a stretch

[stressedapplicant]

Would never have applied to a part time masters program in a low ranked university in my country immediately after my undergraduate, while also doing a full time job. Now, 4 years down the road, i am have still not been able to complete my masters, (partly due to administrative issues and lack of quality education in the university and partly due to the demands of a full time job).

 

I still have time but now i am lost all motivation to continue in this university. I want to apply to a better masters program abroad, but my profile looks quite bad with a incomplete masters( with bad grades).

 

I had reasonably good GPA in undergraduate (3.5/4), and had i waited and applied to a better university i could easily have gotten admission. Now i am stuck with this crappy MSc.    

[gradadvisor]

For the record, I appplied to 10 programs, got interviewed at 9 (withdrew from 1), and was subsequently admitted to 7 and waitlisted at 1. I won't say where I applied, but there were mostly all top 10 programs. I originally thought I would get in nowhere, so this was a nice surprise. Needless to say, I feel somewhat well qualified to give application advice.

1) Admissions, contrary to what many say, is NOT random. I did a ridiculous amount of interviews and saw many of the same candidates at multiple schools. Were they just overly lucky? I think not. If you're application is strong, you will be given the proper consideration. The hard part is gaging where in the pack you lie (I didn't know this until well into March).

2) I felt like I applied to too many programs. It's a good situation to be in, yes, but turning down people is very, very difficult. I think 5-6 is a good number. Like I said before, admissions is NOT like the lottery.

3) Focus on what you have to offer in terms of skills in your statement of purpose. Why should the grad school choose you? I was applying right out of undergrad and as sophisticated as I thought my research interests were then, I look back and realize how naive this portion of my statement must have sounded. I spent maybe three sentences on what I'd like to work on. The rest was focused on how my past helped shape those interests and provided me with the skills to pursue research in those interests.

4) I'm under the impression that schools already have a ranked list pre interviews, and that the order is unlikely to change except in extreme cases. So don't fret, and just be yourself.

5) It's not necessarily to contact professors beforehand. It's sometimes useful to do so however, to see if a professor's interest in a particular area not necessarily listed online. Also useful to see if prof is taking new students. Completely optional though, just make it clear who you want to work with in your ststament.

6) write down your thoughts after each day during interview weekend for each school. Make notes of first impressions of professors. You will be grateful come decision time

Edited November 13, 2014 by gradadvisor

[Crucial BBQ]

Generally, being a prof is just another step on the ladder for researchers. Most professors in my field are research scientists who just happen to teach. Do you mean that you want to be a technician and never have to stop working in the lab/field? That's what I think I'd like to do.

I would not mind teaching; some of my favorite professors taught at community colleges.  Those were people who were very approachable, always made time for students, had mad love for the subjects they taught, and ultimately seemed to have a better understanding of what was going on in the real world and in the broader scope of their disciplines.  They were not pinned down by rules of academia and were free to read, do, and pursue various topics as they pleased.  There is a joke:  Ph.D. students are full of hopes, dreams, and ambitions of the future; academics have no hopes or dreams of the future.  Of course it is not funny, it's not supposed to be.  But it is a joke none-the-less.  

 

I had great profs at university, don't get me wrong.  The younger ones, mostly adjuncts who also still worked in industry, were the best.  Same with those who were only lecturers.  Of the full-time and tenured, it was those who were not in STEM that were also very cool. The rest, the tenured and the tenure-track in STEM, seemed to be bogged down by office politics, seemed to have little concern for the rest of the school, seemed to look down on students who were into their non-science courses, seemed to look down on students who worked, and seemed to have zero sense of what was going on outside of not only their own departments but also outside of the niche area they studied. 

 

Those are the impressions I got.  I could be wrong but it does not matter as I am not interested in academia.  The bottom line is that I do not want my "job promotions" to be based on how many papers my advisees publish.  I do not want to use students as a means to acquire funding of my own.    

 

I come from a solid blue-collar working class family (a clue to how my CV is three pages long cut and why my GPA totally blows).  Living the life of an academic would frustrate me to no end.  I do not believe that Master's degrees are "for those who can't hack it" or are consolation prizes.  I do not believe that getting a job in industry is selling out.  I do not believe that adjuncts or lecturers hold lowly positions.  

 

Of course my perspective could change in a few years.  I could revisit this thread and say If I knew then what I know now I would not have written that post.  It wouldn't be the first time I had to eat crow.  

Edited November 26, 2014 by Crucial BBQ

[eeee1923]

On top of all the nuggets of wisdom that have already been given, I probably would not have applied to as many programs. All the programs that I applied to "fit" my research interests but trying to balance interviewing while finishing off my master's thesis may have been made easier if I was just dealing with 4 schools. Also I would have tried harder to get fee waivers because I didn't realize how large of an investment this process would be until after the fact.