Fall 2013 Applicants?

[Sigaba]

I don't know that I realized you were in military history (if you've previously said so, please forgive my memory!) - are you at the conference? What's your area of study?

No, I am not at the conference. It just seemed like you were talking about Professor Reardon given your interests and her background Also, I was this [] close to buying her most recent book late last night on Amazon, so her scholarship was on my mind when I read your post.

FWIW, my areas of interest (in chronological order) include the reform and modernization of the United States Army during the Gilded Age, the formulation of naval strategy and policy during the Carter and Reagan presidencies, and the impact of the RMA debate on U.S. grand strategy during GWOT,

[TMP]

Relax. Hardly anyone's a super applicant. I'm surprised that this woman didn't mention that Penn State's been making a move towards not accepting people interested in US or European history. I'm not sure if the program will bend rules for 19th century. Just keep an eye on the website.

I agree with Sigaba. Be your own person. You will realize that academics are truly individuals with their own paths and there are hardly any basis for comparisons. Even (good) advisers recognize that and respect the individuality in their graduate students.

Also, being working with a scholar who's encouraging you to explore areas outside of your interests, that is a consideration you will have to make when you do have to decide between programs. Right now, you need to get in. The best you can do is simply show that you are open-minded while having a solid focus on what you'd like to do in the program. Also, I don't know if you introduced yourself as someone with a BA (but I am guessing yes). But the fact that you do not have a MA allows professors to make those kind of suggestions because you still do not have that broad understanding of your field and be able to determine that what you want to study is what you want to study. In a way, really make sure that Vietnam War or the Civil War in South Africa or the military dictatorships in Latin America do not hold enough of interest to you before settling on the specifics of the US Civil War.

Also, I had one professor say to me, "I'd rather accept someone who has no clue what he wants to do than to take someone who's absolutely set on a topic. Someone who's narrow tends to be difficult to work with."

Indeed, your SOP will be your greatest challenge.

[Sigaba]

I'm surprised that this woman didn't mention that Penn State's been making a move towards not accepting people interested in US or European history. I'm not sure if the program will bend rules for 19th century.

TMP--

Maybe it is possible that "this woman" is a really big deal in American military history, that she has a different (if not more accurate) view as to what is going on in the black box than your sources of information.

Also--and at the risk of sounding curt--I don't know how one can interpret a well defined interest in nineteenth century American military history as a potential interest in Latin American dictatorships or civil war in South Africa, especially given the vibrant ongoing historiographical debates over the Mexican-American War and the American Civil War.

IMO, unforth has articulated a clear, sustainable, and appropriately general vision of what she wants to study that is clearly informed by previous research and reading. (Joseph Glatthaar is not a household name but he, like Reardon, is a big deal to those who have invested the time and effort to study the field in question.) IMO, the focus should be to empower aspiring graduate students in history so that they can get to where they want to go and to be the types of historians they want to be, not to discourage them by suggesting that what they want to study may not really be what they want to study after all.

My $0.02.

[alleykat]

Has anyone else here "changed fields", or is thinking of doing so if you are like me and wanting to apply, from undergrad to graduate programs?

Hi KendraSevilla,

I switched from International Relations to History and applied for the Fall 2012 season. To be honest, I was really nervous throughout the whole process, thinking that without a solid background in History, it'd be extremely difficult for me to get in a program with funding. But luckily I did. I do not know exactly how a lack of history major could actually hurt your chance because it may vary from one program to another. All I can say is that if you truly want to do this, just show the admission committees the best of you as an applicant who loves history and has the ability to study the past. In order to do so, you may want to work hard on your writing sample and personal statement.

[KendraSevilla]

Hi alleykat,

I'm glad to hear that you got into a program without having a History degree. It is quite nerve wracking when you dont have the background in that field. I appreciate the input, and I'm thinking that I will most likely have to create my own writing sample, rather than using a paper from a class.

[Sigaba]

Hi alleykat,

I'm glad to hear that you got into a program without having a History degree. It is quite nerve wracking when you dont have the background in that field. I appreciate the input, and I'm thinking that I will most likely have to create my own writing sample, rather than using a paper from a class.

KS--

Could you use one (or more) of your four required history courses as an opportunity to prepare a research paper that you can later turn into your writing sample? IMO, writing such a paper in a directed environment may be a more productive use of your time.

Also, please do keep in mind that it doesn't necessarily have to be either/or when it comes to deciding between history and Spanish literature. For example, you can make use of your work in Spanish to become a historian of a specific literary style or period. Or, you can focus on Spain's culture and use literary works as sources.

Please don't psych yourself out worrying about your background in history not being adequate for graduate work. Yes, you may have some catching up to do and yes that extra work may see you upping significantly your caffeine intake for weeks at a time. But have confidence in yourself--you can do it if you apply yourself and if you put yourself in a position to ask for help when you need it.

HTH.

[TMP]

Sugars- it was on the site last fall. It appears that they have updated it since. These days prospective applicants. Should keep checking throughout the fall to be sure that nothing is being suspended.

That was just my interpretation of the eoman's suggestion based on previous conversations even when I had a defied idea of what I want to do.

As for your last pint, I couldn't agree more. But there are definitely advisers out there who don't have the level of confidence to let their students be the kind of scholar the students want to be. Instead, these advisers steer their students towards a path they are more comfortable with.

[annieca]

I wonder, if being narrow is also a plus. It makes finding a POI incredibly difficult at some times, incredibly easy at others. It certainly makes your SOP more focused. And I would imagine (correct me if I'm wrong) that schools don't hold you down and force feed you only your SOP research topics. SOPs are so short that if I said everything I wanted to study within the subfield I'd have no room!

[TMP]

It's about a careful balance between the two ends of the spectrum. It's your choice to decide where you want to fall on the spectrum and hope that it's in your cards.

[aje1988]

Hey everyone. Just thought I'd introduce myself and ask a few questions. I graduated from Indiana University Bloomington in the Spring of 2011 with degrees in History and Religious Studies (minor in Arabic). I wrote an honors thesis concerning desegregation of schools by busing in a city in Indiana in the 1970s, using a lot of primary sources (will be my writing sample after a bit of work, probably). I scored a 162 Verbal, 155 Math, and 4.5 on Analytical Writing. I graduated with a 3.86 GPA, with a 4.0 in Religious Studies and a damnable 3.94 in History. I also interned for a year at the IMH at IUB. I have a couple essay contests under my belt as well.

My biggest difficulty - and what I'm seeking you for - is trying to narrow down a field of interest. My interests vary wildly. I'm very interested in the American South & its historical memory, the Nation of Islam and other New Religious Movements, the modern civil rights movement, Indiana History, and I have other areas of interest in Ancient Greece, historicity of the Old & New Testaments, ww2, and historical memory of more modern events (crm, 9/11, columbine, etc.).

How did you guys figure out what you really wanted to study? I'm sorta stumped because I'm really interested in a lot of them, but obviously I need to narrow it down in order to begin the search for POIs, etc.

Also, with my stated qualifications, do you think I would be able to obtain funding somewhere? (my most important question, lol)

Edited May 19, 2012 by aje1988

[CageFree]

A lot of programs have you do a major field and a minor field, so the minor field can be another area of interest for you.

One thing to consider for some of those fields (like Ancient Greece, etc.) is the need for languages. For Greece, you'll be expected to know Latin, Greek, German and likely French for competitive programs. For the Old Testament you may have to know Hebrew.

Perhaps one way to narrow things down would be to look for common themes in your interests. For example, let's say you're interested in social movements... you can do comparative studies within that theme. What kinds of questions are you asking yourself about social movements? How can you use history to answer those questions?

Hope that helps a bit

I would think you can definitely get into a funded program with those grades/scores, but only as long as your writing sample and personal statement are strong and you find a school where you're a good fit.

[elblack]

Hello everyone!

I am currently entering my last year of undergraduate study at Purdue University. My degree involves a double major in political science and history as well as a minor in sociology. Academically my interests lie in the intersectionality of American society and the legal system. Particularly in issues surrounding citizenship including race, gender, and sexual orientation.

To add to the discussion of trying to find a focus, I agree with the advice of trying to find a common thread in your interests. That is exactly the advice I've been given and would suggest to anyone else. There's definitely no need to know the title of your thesis/dissertation but knowing an area of the world wouldn't be a bad thing.

[unforth]

Hey everyone. Just thought I'd introduce myself and ask a few questions. I graduated from Indiana University Bloomington in the Spring of 2011 with degrees in History and Religious Studies (minor in Arabic). I wrote an honors thesis concerning desegregation of schools by busing in a city in Indiana in the 1970s, using a lot of primary sources (will be my writing sample after a bit of work, probably). I scored a 162 Verbal, 155 Math, and 4.5 on Analytical Writing. I graduated with a 3.86 GPA, with a 4.0 in Religious Studies and a damnable 3.94 in History. I also interned for a year at the IMH at IUB. I have a couple essay contests under my belt as well.

My biggest difficulty - and what I'm seeking you for - is trying to narrow down a field of interest. My interests vary wildly. I'm very interested in the American South & its historical memory, the Nation of Islam and other New Religious Movements, the modern civil rights movement, Indiana History, and I have other areas of interest in Ancient Greece, historicity of the Old & New Testaments, ww2, and historical memory of more modern events (crm, 9/11, columbine, etc.).

How did you guys figure out what you really wanted to study? I'm sorta stumped because I'm really interested in a lot of them, but obviously I need to narrow it down in order to begin the search for POIs, etc.

Also, with my stated qualifications, do you think I would be able to obtain funding somewhere? (my most important question, lol)

Howdy! I was at IUB for two years studying at SLIS! It's awesome to meet another Bloomington-ite.

To answer the "interests" questions...

I've been out of school for a number of years. What I found was that my interests showed themselves to me pretty clearly over the years: confronted with a bookshelf full of books on various fiction and non-fiction topics, books I'd already bought, none of which I'd read, I invariably picked out the ones on the US Civil War and the Antebellum years. Most was military history, some political, and occasionally cultural, but it was hard to argue with the consensus: when I had to pick how to spend my time, when I could read ANYTHING, I chose to read US Civil War history.

That's how I knew. Hope it helps!

[Sigaba]

I've been out of school for a number of years. What I found was that my interests showed themselves to me pretty clearly over the years: confronted with a bookshelf full of books on various fiction and non-fiction topics, books I'd already bought, none of which I'd read, I invariably picked out the ones on the US Civil War and the Antebellum years. Most was military history, some political, and occasionally cultural, but it was hard to argue with the consensus: when I had to pick how to spend my time, when I could read ANYTHING, I chose to read US Civil War history.

unforth--

Please split the hair again. Are you an Americanist who focuses on the military and political history of the United States during the antebellum and Civil War era? Or are you a military historian who focuses on America's military experiences during the nineteenth century with an emphasis on the American Civil War? Or are you a hybrid of both? Or do you see yourself as a bird of a different feather altogether?

However you address the above questions, I foresee that your single greatest challenge as an applicant will be to craft SOPs that make convincing arguments regarding the relevance of your areas of interest to readers who may be profoundly disinterested in military history (regardless of how one approaches it)--especially if your focus is on operations.

My $0.02.

[CageFree]

I think Sigaba's point is very valid, and actually applies to other fields as well. I think it is important to ask yourself questions that haven't been asked before, rather than go in thinking you are going to study what you currently are interested in. Those things you are reading should be a jumping-off point to new and hopefully exciting research. Studying something that isn't "in vogue" is tricky because not only do you have to convince an adcom and find advisers, but then you have to find a job. If schools are cutting back on the size of some fields, that's something to think about.

My original research plans changed dramatically just from phone conversations with professors who told me that what I wanted to study had already been done to death... they then told me about areas where people are currently doing work.. and that was very helpful, especially since I've been out of school for so long AND I'm switching time periods and continents from my undergrad work. I know that as I go through my coursework I may change direction again, and I'm OK with that. I have found that I have a few thematic interests that tie everything I've studied together, so I think I may do a minor field in yet another part of the world and ask the same questions. Flexibility is key nowadays, considering how much more competitive the admissions are, and how hard it is to find a job.

I am not saying people should forgo what they are interested in and do what's "marketable" instead. That's intellectually dishonest, and in the end it's very difficult impossible to sustain an academic career when you don't care about what you're studying. I'm only suggesting that people go in with an open mind, and find ways of making your work fresh and relevant to today.

Edited May 23, 2012 by CageFree

[theregalrenegade]

I'm only suggesting that people go in with an open mind, and find ways of making your work fresh and relevant to today.

This. I'm constantly evaluating my research interests toward this end.

[oceansize]

I just read this whole thread so I wanted to poke my head in and say hi! I'm currently trying to decide whether or not it makes the most sense to apply for Fall 2013 or wait until Fall 2014, so I'm not sure if I'll be going through the process with you all. Either way, I'll likely be lurking around the forums for the next couple years. I'm working full time right now and taking a couple of history grad classes at night to refine my interests and prepare myself for the application process. I have a BA in history and am confident that I want to go for a PhD, but still evaluating whether it makes sense to apply for an MA first.

[runaway]

Hey everyone-- haven't posted for a while, but I'm (finally!) getting into the swing of checking things off my application-to-do list. First up: narrowing down my list of schools, and deciding whether I'll be applying to Art History or History programs (although likely a mixture of both.)

After going over all the logical things (fit, POI, location, etc) I have found myself starting to make ridiculous pro/con lists that include everything from funding opportunities to my opinion of the mascots. My list is still far too long. Any advice?

[oceansize]

Obviously I'm no expert, but what about recent placement of grads? I'm not sure how useful that actually is, but if you're including the mascots...

Other things are cost of living/housing opportunities, but you may have already rolled those in with location.

ETA because I didn't want to double post - another thought is, maybe you could ask a mentor/someone who's writing a LoR for you for their thoughts. Since they presumably know both you and the field well, they might be able to give you some insight on different programs that you haven't already thought of before.

Edited May 23, 2012 by oceansize

[oseirus]

I am not saying people should forgo what they are interested in and do what's "marketable" instead. That's intellectually dishonest, and in the end it's very difficult impossible to sustain an academic career when you don't care about what you're studying. I'm only suggesting that people go in with an open mind, and find ways of making your work fresh and relevant to today.

If you could sell out in history ... you'd be working for the history channel already and not on here ... but totally agree w/your sentiment

on an unrelated note, greetings y'all been far too long!

[TMP]

I am with CageFree and Sigaba. See my post, Point #2

You narrow down your topics by taking classes, reading, and having conversations with others. People go through the archives and read journal articles and come up with questions. We all have more questions than we can handle or simply not in our particular area or are not qualified to actually pursue those kind of questions (like a German historian would not be qualified to study Soviet politics of repatriation of its citizens in Germany despite the location being in Germany). So you may pick up some ideas there and there. Like Sigaba and CageFree said, you also need to find themes that you've been interested in for a long time. There is no way that an Americanist can truly be interested in everything in American history. For example, I'm really not into early American history unless someone's questioning whether or not the colonists were attempting to commit genocide against the Native Americans through forced labor and migration. That would get my attention in an early America seminar, as opposed to discussing the logistics of pulling off the Boston Tea Party.

As Sigaba said and I've gone through this trouble, you really do need to be able to convince someone outside of your field or has zero interest in military history (particularly that most people aren't interested in the military) that what you are interested in is genuine.

[annieca]

@runaway -

Looking at mascots? (Go Puddles!) I think you suffer from some over-research of schools. I know logistically I narrowed down my list to 7 schools with the program that I wanted to apply to. Some are *way* better fits than others but there isn't a school that I wouldn't be happy to attend.

So I would start, first by narrowing. Ranking (which it sounds like you're doing with the pro/con lists) can come after that. It's hard to do both at the same time.

I don't know what your field is, but I think the average student applies to between 6-10 grad programs in History so if you can find 6-10 professors you would instantly move across the country to work with, then there you go. As to how many programs... that's up to your checkbook and how comfortable you are with schools that are about an 85% fit and not a 100% fit. (I actually don't think 100% fit exists but that's beside the point.)

I would say that you can even through out schools you don't get a good feeling about. At one point I was looking at a school in the South but I couldn't find ANYTHING on their website and I decided "it's not worth my time." That helped narrow it down some more.

Lastly, I think the third most important factor (after POI, funding/cost of living) is just the environment of the university. Does it have great alumni office/career center? Is it an undergrad huge center with a small grad school? You have to pick what you know you can thrive in and will work well for you.

My own $0.02

[runaway]

Thanks, annieca! I think part of my problem, too, is that the schools I'm looking at are all fairly similar. Same region, all fairly urban, places I know I would like to live. So it's hard to find 'dealbreakers' that make them easy to cross off my list with no regrets.

And then there's one school that's not quite the profile I would like (suburban, small grad program, etc) but has the POI that's far and away the best fit for me. So that's frustrating too.

Maybe I should just start working on the application and writing my SOP. It might be a good way to feel out whether I'm really enthusiastic about each school or if I'm just trying to make myself sound like a good fit because the school seems like the right place for me on paper...

[TMP]

Maybe I should just start working on the application and writing my SOP. It might be a good way to feel out whether I'm really enthusiastic about each school or if I'm just trying to make myself sound like a good fit because the school seems like the right place for me on paper...

Do it. Before I wrote my SOP, I couldn't see how the schools that I was accepted at this year could be my top choices. When I wrote it and drafted it (and again and again), it became so clear. My personal ranking changed around. I remember e-mailing one of the POIs (who had rejected me the year before and wrote that she couldn't see why her program would be a good place for me) and said, "You know, after re-writing my SOP, I think this program is really an excellent fit!" It was kind of bizarre how things happened like that and thereafter. Now I am going there and every week I find another thing to like about my program in a way I could not imagine myself elsewhere. My list also was smaller- I couldn't expand it without sacrificing my ideas and questions.

So try this "backward" strategy of writing the SOP and find programs that fit IT, not trying to make your SOP framework fit the programs.

As a friend said, it takes a while to find that Program.

[CageFree]

I saved myself a bit of money as I was writing the SOPs because I realized that two schools I had been strongly considering were NOT good fits. I couldn't explain why I wanted to go there. I just didn't feel a connection to the POIs. Interestingly, during the welcome weekend I met someone who went to one of those programs as an undergrad, and confirmed my hunch.