PhD Applications Fall '17 Season

[KnightGeorge]

On 1/22/2017 at 1:01 PM, xypathos said:

It's a mutual concern for most of us and its has been noted in the History and Philosophy sections as well, participation in the forums has dropped off significantly.

On the flip though, the subreddit for Graduate School is very active, there's a subreddit for theology, and a separate one for Religious Studies but the activeness of the last fluctuates significantly. I'm not particularly active or aware in any others so I can't say much more.

It doesn't seem to be getting any better as the month progresses, either. Oh well, I guess we'll all just fly blind.

[Body Politics]

As someone who went through the process during an active year for the GradCafe forums, I honestly can't say that flying blind would've been worse. Probably better, in fact. I fretted over this board and checked the results daily, while my colleague in the next carrel over didn't check GradCafe til the day before he accepted an offer. That guy was way more at ease throughout the process than I was, and I think GC was probably part of it.

But, like I said, I hung out here during my app season, so don't hear me telling you that you absolutely shouldn't. It was a pressure release sometimes. Y'all do you. Whatever works. The process sucks ass however you go through it.

[mattieb]

Does anyone know about the UT Austin interviews? I also applied there under the Religion in the Americas track and am wondering if I'm out of the running since I didn't get one. 

[FlyPiper]

30 minutes ago, mattieb said:

Does anyone know about the UT Austin interviews? I also applied there under the Religion in the Americas track and am wondering if I'm out of the running since I didn't get one. 

I also applied Religion In Americas at UT. I didn't get asked for an interview. I wonder if it was one POI refining their two top candidates. 

Also, did your housing application open up? The results feed was crazy about it all weekend, but no one from RS posted. Just wondering.

[mattieb]

Yes the housing application did open up for me but I didn't want to get my hopes up about that...

[FlyPiper]

2 minutes ago, mattieb said:

Yes the housing application did open up for me but I didn't want to get my hopes up about that...

Same here. I don't think that matters at all. I believe it opened up for all applicants.

[mattieb]

 

3 minutes ago, FlyPiper said:

Same here. I don't think that matters at all. I believe it opened up for all applicants.

Yeah I agree. Weird about the interviews though since in past years there's no mention on the results page of UT interviews. I guess we just continue to wait! 

[menge]

Good to see several americanists on here this season. Usually it seems like most are Theo or Bib Studies. Where all did you end up applying @mattieb, @FlyPiper, & @OneLastHope? 

[HBgrad2017]

Longtime lurker, figured I might as well join the conversation.

 

Applying for Hebrew Bible/Near Eastern studies, interested in Pentateuchal criticism, law, and cult.

 

Any fellow UChicago/Notre Dame/Yale applicants? I'm primarily interested to see if anyone knows anything about the Yale admissions process? I noticed that there was an NT interviewee who posted about a week ago. Anyone know how the HB admissions usually goes over there?

[OneLastHope]

21 hours ago, menge said:

Good to see several americanists on here this season. Usually it seems like most are Theo or Bib Studies. Where all did you end up applying @mattieb, @FlyPiper, & @OneLastHope? 

Just Indiana University. Thought about Northwestern and decided not to.

[NT PhD ... Hopefully]

I also have been a long time lurker.  I have failed to post previously because most applicants on this sight seem so much more estimable than I. 

MDiv 'er (3.88) at a medium sized, moderately conservative, Baptist University in the south. So - so GRE (162/146/4.5; I know ... the math is embarrassing). Decent languages though, 18 hours Greek, 9 hours Hebrew, 4.0.  Applied to NT PhD programs this season, of which I am not confident of acceptance:  Baylor; SMU; Emory; Chapel Hill; Fuller; Asbury; Trinity Evangelical. 

Distinguished (moderately so) military record, including two years in Iraq. Don't know if that helps me or hurts me though. Lol. 

 

[Wantingtogetinsomewhere]

On 1/24/2017 at 4:07 PM, FlyPiper said:

I also applied Religion In Americas at UT. I didn't get asked for an interview. I wonder if it was one POI refining their two top candidates. 

Also, did your housing application open up? The results feed was crazy about it all weekend, but no one from RS posted. Just wondering.

 

On 1/24/2017 at 4:26 PM, mattieb said:

 

Yeah I agree. Weird about the interviews though since in past years there's no mention on the results page of UT interviews. I guess we just continue to wait! 

The interviews were for Mediterranean religions. The interviews are a new part of the process for that subfield, but I don't think that the other areas necessarily held their own interviews. Results should be out soon enough, however, since they normally fly their admitted candidates to campus in very early February. 

[Wantingtogetinsomewhere]

13 hours ago, NT PhD ... Hopefully said:

I also have been a long time lurker.  I have failed to post previously because most applicants on this sight seem so much more estimable than I. 

MDiv 'er (3.88) at a medium sized, moderately conservative, Baptist University in the south. So - so GRE (162/146/4.5; I know ... the math is embarrassing). Decent languages though, 18 hours Greek, 9 hours Hebrew, 4.0.  Applied to NT PhD programs this season, of which I am not confident of acceptance:  Baylor; SMU; Emory; Chapel Hill; Fuller; Asbury; Trinity Evangelical. 

Distinguished (moderately so) military record, including two years in Iraq. Don't know if that helps me or hurts me though. Lol. 

 

I think Baylor has already extended invitations for NT and HB for their interview weekend. You could be placed on a waitlist. I would add that they rarely take Baptists into their biblical studies PhD. They tend to draw from moderate pools avoiding conservative and liberal bastions. People from the ivy leagues routinely apply but are nearly immediately shut out. Same goes for those from SEBTS, SBTS, SWBTS, etc. Myopic, I know, but every program is entitled to create the culture they see as most ideal for learning. As for SMU, they don't take traditional NT. They have an application, but Chancy has moved on from Galilee and has focused mostly on religion and public life in America. The last PhD student in NT they had was a couple years back and worked on fertility and infertility in the NT. She went on to the pastorate after not landing a professorship. Chapel Hill has already done interviews and unless something happens, I wouldn't expect a nod from them. They are also big on auxiliary languages, especially Coptic, which is not normally taught at non-research institution or seminaries. Emory, like Baylor, has already dispatched interview requests for next weekend (02/03). Again, a waitlist is still possible here and Emory continues to pull from that list far into the process. As for Fuller, Asbury, and Trinity I couldn't say. I would hasten that the financial aid packages at Fuller and Trinity are not large enough to make doctoral work bearable. A part time job would be necessary throughout.

My advice, just my advice. If you have some GI bill money, do UK. They are far more relaxed about your religious background (i.e. they don't assume you can't do solid critical work based on modern theories and methods just because you are from a Baptist University/seminary). I say UK because it works for evangelicals and Baptists as far as employment at a Baptist seminary (which are among the largest seminaries in the world) or Baptist liberal arts (of which there are many). UK doesn't work for liberals or moderates. The Ivy League schools, moderate institutions, and Catholic schools aren't routinely pulling from the UK. Also, the Baptist route is a good path if you are still in fact Baptist. I know that many Baptist seminaries have exceptional placement records for their PhDs. Contact the respective heads of doctoral programs at SBC seminaries to get the data from them. It is also important to keep in mind that Baptist schools like Union, DBU, OBU, Ouachita, etc. don't normally post openings on HigherEd etc. Employment in these schools is word of mouth: i.e. Union is looking for a NT guy, they call contacts at the major seminaries to get a listing of potential candidates. So, staying on at your university/seminary or diversifying by going to another Baptist university/seminary can be advantageous. 

However, all of this is moot if you are wanting to teach at a state school or a more traditional private research institute. Just know that that world is hard to penetrate and like east of Eden is barren job-wise. I may get lambasted for this, but I'll say it anyhow: it pays to be Catholic or Baptist. That doesn't mean there aren't examples of the unemployed Catholic or Baptist PhD, but it is to stress that these two groups command a chunk of jobs in religious studies that routinely exclude outside candidates.  

Edited January 26, 2017 by Wantingtogetinsomewhere
Correct a faulty assumption: University, not seminary

[menge]

12 hours ago, NT PhD ... Hopefully said:

I also have been a long time lurker.  I have failed to post previously because most applicants on this sight seem so much more estimable than I. 

MDiv 'er (3.88) at a medium sized, moderately conservative, Baptist University in the south. So - so GRE (162/146/4.5; I know ... the math is embarrassing). Decent languages though, 18 hours Greek, 9 hours Hebrew, 4.0.  Applied to NT PhD programs this season, of which I am not confident of acceptance:  Baylor; SMU; Emory; Chapel Hill; Fuller; Asbury; Trinity Evangelical. 

Distinguished (moderately so) military record, including two years in Iraq. Don't know if that helps me or hurts me though. Lol. 

 

Based on the range of programs, it seems like you will probably land an acceptance somewhere, though funding will probably be the biggest hurdle as @Wantingtogetinsomewhere mentioned. I'm not in Bib. Studies, but where you go very much does determine where you can end up — which can either be a positive or negative, which I think @Wantingtogetinsomewhere also nicely explained. So, depending on your particular goals, any of these institutions may serve you fine. If you end up wanting to re-apply and aim for a Baylor or UNC, you might think about a ThM, an MA in Classics, or another 2nd masters from a school with some more name recognition. Good luck! 

[axiomness]

17 hours ago, HBgrad2017 said:

Longtime lurker, figured I might as well join the conversation.

 

Applying for Hebrew Bible/Near Eastern studies, interested in Pentateuchal criticism, law, and cult.

 

Any fellow UChicago/Notre Dame/Yale applicants? I'm primarily interested to see if anyone knows anything about the Yale admissions process? I noticed that there was an NT interviewee who posted about a week ago. Anyone know how the HB admissions usually goes over there?

 

 

 

I applied to all three of those, and I did last year as well.  I received a phone call saying I got the nomination for my area (Phil Religion) at Yale at the beginning of February, and they ended up taking an Islamic studies person in that stead (which I discovered a few weeks later). I received a waitlist notification for Chicago in mid February.

Those aren't in HB, though, but Phil Religion/Theo. 

Edited January 26, 2017 by axiomness

[NT PhD ... Hopefully]

Hey, thank you "wantingtogetinsomewhere" and "menge."  I appreciate your responses. It's good to vent right, lol, and this is mildly cathartic.  I would add that I am not at a Southern seminary, rather a divinity school at a Baptist "associated" university, though most of my professors are "pre-fall" Southern Seminary.  

As to SMU, one of our MA/MDiv students got in there last year and is focusing on the Gospel of Mark. As for Baylor, many of the professors there are Southern trained, and Baylor is a Baptist school, lol. But I know they draw from many traditions.  My mentor in seminary recieved his PhD under Parsons not too long ago. We recently got another OT graduate from Baylor, both of these got their MDiv from Gordon-Conwell. I hate the stigma that just because one is a Baptist, one is a uber-conservative fundy. My view is that being a Baptist makes me free from any doctrinal fundamentalism. I know UNC was a stretch, I was hoping for the MA-PhD track.  I also realize Emory was a stretch, but what the hay. 

I thought about U.K., but I used up my GI Bill getting a second undergrad and MDiv.  Good advice though.  I don't think my wife would let me drag us to Scotland, lol. 

Does no no one have any thoughts on Fuller, Asbury, or Trinity???  One thing I have going for me is a rather large pension from the VA (for very nearly getting my ass blown off in Baghdad).  Plus my wife has a full time job anywhere in the continental US, as she is a computer programmer and can work remotely (she has already been assured of keeping her current position). Therefore, I am in a better financial position than many of you whipper snappers, lol. 

Thanks again for your responses. Good luck to all!!!

[menge]

19 minutes ago, NT PhD ... Hopefully said:

Hey, thank you "wantingtogetinsomewhere" and "menge."  I appreciate your responses. It's good to vent right, lol, and this is mildly cathartic.  I would add that I am not at a Southern seminary, rather a divinity school at a Baptist "associated" university, though most of my professors are "pre-fall" Southern Seminary.  

As to SMU, one of our MA/MDiv students got in there last year and is focusing on the Gospel of Mark. As for Baylor, many of the professors there are Southern trained, and Baylor is a Baptist school, lol. But I know they draw from many traditions.  My mentor in seminary recieved his PhD under Parsons not too long ago. We recently got another OT graduate from Baylor, both of these got their MDiv from Gordon-Conwell. I hate the stigma that just because one is a Baptist, one is a uber-conservative fundy. My view is that being a Baptist makes me free from any doctrinal fundamentalism. I know UNC was a stretch, I was hoping for the MA-PhD track.  I also realize Emory was a stretch, but what the hay. 

I thought about U.K., but I used up my GI Bill getting a second undergrad and MDiv.  Good advice though.  I don't think my wife would let me drag us to Scotland, lol. 

Does no no one have any thoughts on Fuller, Asbury, or Trinity???  One thing I have going for me is a rather large pension from the VA (for very nearly getting my ass blown off in Baghdad).  Plus my wife has a full time job anywhere in the continental US, as she is a computer programmer and can work remotely (she has already been assured of keeping her current position). Therefore, I am in a better financial position than many of you whipper snappers, lol. 

Thanks again for your responses. Good luck to all!!!

I don't know anything about Asbury, and little about Fuller, though I know Fuller MA/MDiv grads who have done well in PhD admissions. I know someone at TEDS who did receive a good funding package, but there are very few of those. I know absolutely nothing about the placement rate of these schools... hopefully some others can chyme in with more helpful info. If those schools are successfully placing candidates at places you would like to teach, and the finances work out, seems like they could be a good fit for you. Again, I think it is all about what (and where) you hope to get out of your PhD. 

[NT PhD ... Hopefully]

Thanks menge. 

[Abdelazar]

Re: TEDS, as others have said, aside from a few scholarships, I believe most PhD students there are not funded. You may also want to ask about job placement. Evangelical seminaries/liberal arts universities are generally happy to hire TEDS grads, but it will be harder to engage in the wider world of academia (e.g. SBL and other conferences, publishing).

[mattieb]

2 hours ago, Wantingtogetinsomewhere said:

 

The interviews were for Mediterranean religions. The interviews are a new part of the process for that subfield, but I don't think that the other areas necessarily held their own interviews. Results should be out soon enough, however, since they normally fly their admitted candidates to campus in very early February. 

Great, thank you for the info! 

[NT PhD ... Hopefully]

Hey thanks Abdelazar. I was curious, aside from the funding question, what about reputations: Fuller, Asbury, Trinity?

[Wantingtogetinsomewhere]

I just got the 2015-6 SBL job report. Here are their key findings for those not members:

 

Key Findings

·         Positions advertised in AY16 declined 10.2% compared to AY15.

·         The discrete number of institutions posting a job in a given year declined each of the past five years from 311 in AY11 to 248 in AY16, a decline of 20.1%.

·         Research institutions have been the most stable, while baccalaureate institutions have seen the greatest declines.

·         Fewer than 300 faculty jobs were posted, the lowest number of faculty positions since AY02.

·         Course loads, in contrast to AY15, declined markedly.

·         The percentage of employers requiring or desiring interdisciplinary teaching or research abilities declined significantly.

·         Publishing a journal article and publishing a book/monograph are now more important than interdisciplinary teaching or research abilities.

·         Online course instruction experience continues to rise, up from 10.4% last year to 13.0% this year.

[xypathos]

1 hour ago, NT PhD ... Hopefully said:

Hey thanks Abdelazar. I was curious, aside from the funding question, what about reputations: Fuller, Asbury, Trinity?

Where are you wanting to end up teaching or doing? If you're looking to go back to the church, odds are it'll be received well (depending on denomination and style of Baptist), but you're chances of even making it to the shortlist of a major university with a Ph.D. from Fuller is minimal, and next to non-existent for Asbury and Trinity. As @Wantingtogetinsomewhere noted, it pays greatly in BS and Theo to be Baptist or Catholic for increased job chances (or at least educated in those institutions). You'll likely land a job at some small Baptist college but I can't say much about upward mobility beyond that. Asbury doesn't openly publish placement data (not that I could find anyway), but looking at their faculty listing - they show a preference for HUC, UTS (VA), Drew, and a spattering of others.

Edited January 26, 2017 by xypathos

[Wantingtogetinsomewhere]

4 minutes ago, xypathos said:

Where are you wanting to end up teaching or doing? If you're looking to go back to the church, odds are it'll be received well (depending on denomination and style of Baptist), but you're chances of even making it to the shortlist of a major university with a Ph.D. from Fuller is minimal, and next to non-existent for Asbury and Trinity. As @Wantingtogetinsomewhere noted, it pays greatly in BS and Theo to be Baptist or Catholic for increased job chances (or at least educated in those institutions). You'll likely land a job at some small Baptist college but I can't say much about upward mobility beyond that. Asbury doesn't openly publish placement data (not that I could fine anyway), but looking at their faculty listing - they show a preference for HUC, UTS (VA), Drew, and a spattering of others.

I would add that http://www.ats.edu/uploads/resources/publications-presentations/documents/tenure-and-other-faculty-facts-part-2.pdf is still a good general view into the world of placement. It goes without saying that many of these statistics are the products of certain hiring trends (i.e. Baptists hire mostly other Baptists and UK alumni).

[NT PhD ... Hopefully]

22 minutes ago, Wantingtogetinsomewhere said:

I would add that http://www.ats.edu/uploads/resources/publications-presentations/documents/tenure-and-other-faculty-facts-part-2.pdf is still a good general view into the world of placement. It goes without saying that many of these statistics are the products of certain hiring trends (i.e. Baptists hire mostly other Baptists and UK alumni).

I have seen that as well. It seems that both Fuller and TEDS are on that list. I guess guys it is what it is.  I don't have the pedigree or the time available to try and get into a TT program (getting a second MA for example) again.   Since this is the religions page I might add that sometimes we just have to step out on faith. Despite what worldly promise might be negated. However, I take scholarship seriously, so I feel drawn to a mixture of both service to the church and to the academy.

If that means Bart Ehrman turns his nose up at me, so be it.