Welcome to the 2012-2013 cycle

[ThisGuyRiteHere]

So, to start a new topic of conversation, I had a talk with a few directors of graduate studies in the last few weeks and one thing I've consistently found amazing is the different perceptions within the department of which other schools they compete with. It really has been incredible to see who schools think they vie for candidates with.

care to elaborate

[dworkable]

I just got waitlisted at a school...part of their email reads:

 

"In the meantime, I would appreciate it if you could let me know if you receive admissions offers from other programs. This information will be useful to our admissions committee..."

 

I've gotten into some other very good schools. Should I email them back where I've been accepted and then just expect not to hear from them again?

[ThisGuyRiteHere]

I just got waitlisted at a school...part of their email reads:

 

"In the meantime, I would appreciate it if you could let me know if you receive admissions offers from other programs. This information will be useful to our admissions committee..."

 

I've gotten into some other very good schools. Should I email them back where I've been accepted and then just expect not to hear from them again?

Could go two ways. You could either raise your market value by letting them know that you are desirable. Or you can screw yourself by showing them that if they dont accept you, you have other options.

I think its more 1 than 2. I have done this with schools, and it raises my market value.

[Mnemonics2]

Interesting...any surprises?

 

Well...I realize that answering specifically might be identifying...but schools ranked about #35 that feel they compete with those around the #15 mark for students, as well as a couple of schools at the #45 mark that feel they compete with those around the #30 point.

[CGMJ]

Well...I realize that answering specifically might be identifying...but schools ranked about #35 that feel they compete with those around the #15 mark for students, as well as a couple of schools at the #45 mark that feel they compete with those around the #30 point.

 

Interesting!

[RWBG]

3) Personally, I hope the application process will prep thinner-skinned/folks for how much worse grad school and the academic job market will almost certainly be. Or, as a Swarthmore professor put it: "What you need to know first is that graduate school will almost inevitably suck. A lucky few have a great time. They’re the exception. For most, it will hurt. It will be humiliating. If you have suckled off the mother’s milk of the approval of your teachers until the point you arrive for your first graduate seminar, get ready to have a professor dislike you for no other reason than he or she disagrees with you. It won’t matter that you do all the work and do it well. You’ll be treated like a colleague inasmuch as you will be subject to the bruising ideological, intellectual and social conflicts that characterize academic life. Your views and actions will be taken seriously in that sense. But they’ll be taken seriously at exactly the moment that you most lack any platform to stand upon, when you lack any independent profile outside of your relationships with your professors and your discipline.

No one is going to pat you on the head and tell you how wonderfully smart you are for sassing them anymore. That time of your life is over." (http://weblogs.swarthmore.edu/burke/?page_id=4_)

Well, so far, grad school's a lot of fun, and way better than undergrad. I think this professor was being hyperbolic, or at the very least, had experiences that are not necessarily generalizable to many graduate students in our field. My high expectations for the experience have (so far) been met.

[TakeMyCoffeeBlack]

Well...I realize that answering specifically might be identifying...but schools ranked about #35 that feel they compete with those around the #15 mark for students, as well as a couple of schools at the #45 mark that feel they compete with those around the #30 point.

 

That may not be all that off, as students will usually apply to a range of schools. I imagine most of the data they base this on is self-reported via the application.

[Longtime Lurker]

Well...I realize that answering specifically might be identifying...but schools ranked about #35 that feel they compete with those around the #15 mark for students, as well as a couple of schools at the #45 mark that feel they compete with those around the #30 point.

 

Honestly, these examples don't seem unreasonable to me.  Sure, someone who is accepted to Chicago will most likely choose to attend that program rather than, say, Colorado, but it isn't a foregone conclusion.  Overall rank (which is already debatable) may not account for a school's specific strengths in different areas, methods, or sub-fields.  As much as we pretend otherwise, it's also possible that non-academic considerations will also influence an applicant's final decision (proximity to family, affinity for a given location or climate, etc.).

 

In my case, for example, Columbia and UCSD are ranked significantly ahead of Florida State and Penn State overall, but the decision is much narrower in my specific area of interest.  Anything could happen once I have a chance to interact with department members during the visitation weekends and have an opportunity to meet potential advisers.  In other words, it's natural that admissions committees continue to pursue the most desirable candidates until they receive signals that the applicants in question are no longer interested.

[Azruel]

Really? Your roommate just got rejected recently, right? It looks like they might be rolling out rejections? How stressful...

Well, this gives me hope!

 

Yep, I checked it just the other day when I posted here. I was still being reviewed and, when I asked him and he checked, he told me he had a denial letter. I took a look at it and offered to buy him a pizza to try to cheer him up. In the week prior I had contacted the department (I figured I had been rejected anyway) and was told basically that they have not started second round admissions yet; that would come after some people from the first round make decisions on whether or not to attend. They said that final decisions would be made, at the latest, by mid-March.

 

So if we are still being reviewed, we are still on the wait-list until otherwise notified.

[PhDhopeful2013]

Well, so far, grad school's a lot of fun, and way better than undergrad. I think this professor was being hyperbolic, or at the very least, had experiences that are not necessarily generalizable to many graduate students in our field. My high expectations for the experience have (so far) been met.

 Good to hear!

[Azruel]

Also, I hate to double post but I received a reply from NYU this morning. They are still looking at a few apps (possibly a second round of admissions or admissions into the MA for those who checked that option; they did not state specifically). So there is still some hope if you have not yet heard back from NYU.

[chaetzli]

+1 to the person who added "safety school" as comment to the Stanford rejection

[USCoregonian]

Some costs are not measurable, but then I've always been more of a poststructuralist (my IR nerds will understand me here). 

If you get rejected the first time around and you don't want to apply again, then it is a sure sign that you do not belong in academia. Getting into a PhD program is tough and the difficulties do not end there (for example, everyone can expect to have their articles rejected from journals). However, most of us are well aware of the downsides of doing a PhD and we accept it and continue with our studies. To get through a PhD program, and life in general, does not only require being smart, but persistent. 

 

Glad I'm not alone on being committed to a second round. Looking pretty clear that I'm not going to get in this time. Even just looking back on my applications a couple months later I can see where I had huge weaknesses and can really improve. Having a steady job that I enjoy and is directly relevant to my research interests certainly makes the rejections easier to take and waiting another year less of a big deal. 

Edited February 19, 2013 by USCoregonian

[hopefully2013]

This question might have already been asked, but is Yale doing interviews this year? 

[browneyedgirl]

Well...I realize that answering specifically might be identifying...but schools ranked about #35 that feel they compete with those around the #15 mark for students, as well as a couple of schools at the #45 mark that feel they compete with those around the #30 point.

 

departments will usually ask admits who turn them down where they end up going, in my experience, and also have a pretty good sense of the schools admits turned down to come there (through conversations, funding negotiations, etc.)  I wouldn't be surprised if that's where they come up with their list of competitor schools.  my program tends to lose admits to the same set of schools every year, but maybe one student each year goes somewhere we might not expect, based on their options.  to that end, the "surprise" school might well say it competes with schools X and Y because student A turned down X and Y to go there, even though that program, broadly speaking, may not be considered "equal" to X and Y.

[rkmattson]

That safety school comment on the results board made my day

[alittlebitofluck]

I just got waitlisted at a school...part of their email reads:   "In the meantime, I would appreciate it if you could let me know if you receive admissions offers from other programs. This information will be useful to our admissions committee..."   I've gotten into some other very good schools. Should I email them back where I've been accepted and then just expect not to hear from them again?

I got the same email and responded with honesty. We'll see where it gets me. :-)

[rainbowz]

This question might have already been asked, but is Yale doing interviews this year? 

 

I've been wondering that too...also has anyone claimed the admits on the board from last week?

[TakeMyCoffeeBlack]

When can we expect UNC to show some mercy?

[CGMJ]

Can anyone claim that Yale?

[raptureonfire]

4) This is one reason I'm a bit surprised people apply more than once. The opportunity costs are SO HIGH and there are so many fun things to do, so many adventures to have. Anyone who is on their second round care to speak to why they gave it another go?

 

I'm not really sure I understand the question.  I don't see that the opportunity costs for applying a second time are any higher than the first time.  Indeed, they're likely lower, as the basic framework for one's applications has already been set, and simply needs to be tweaked.

 

Why apply a second time?  Without trying to sound glib ... because when you want something, you persist and work for it.  Many people don't get accepted their first time around; it's not necessarily due to lacking qualifications.  Sometimes another year of experience, an additional publication, or perhaps a slight tweak in one's scope of work is all that's needed to hit the mark with the committee.

 

Academia is full of rejection.  Heck, all high level professions are.  As an academic, if you're not willing to get rejected, then you're not going to make it very far in terms of publications, grant proposals, job interviews, etc.

 

So, to answer you question ... why did I apply a second time around?  Because I am dedicated to pursuing a career in academia.  I want to spend my life researching, teaching, and publishing.

[Mnemonics2]

I want to spend my life researching, teaching, and publishing.

 

This.

[ThisGuyRiteHere]

I'm not really sure I understand the question.  I don't see that the opportunity costs for applying a second time are any higher than the first time.  Indeed, they're likely lower, as the basic framework for one's applications has already been set, and simply needs to be tweaked.

 

Why apply a second time?  Without trying to sound glib ... because when you want something, you persist and work for it.  Many people don't get accepted their first time around; it's not necessarily due to lacking qualifications.  Sometimes another year of experience, an additional publication, or perhaps a slight tweak in one's scope of work is all that's needed to hit the mark with the committee.

 

Academia is full of rejection.  Heck, all high level professions are.  As an academic, if you're not willing to get rejected, then you're not going to make it very far in terms of publications, grant proposals, job interviews, etc.

 

So, to answer you question ... why did I apply a second time around?  Because I am dedicated to pursuing a career in academia.  I want to spend my life researching, teaching, and publishing.

And this is why you will be successful. You have the right attitude.

[setgree]

I'm not really sure I understand the question.  I don't see that the opportunity costs for applying a second time are any higher than the first time. 

 

I pretty much meant the opportunity costs of academia itself . I think I'm getting this better now. i would have taken an all-out rejection as a signal that academia and i were a poor fit for each other and would have taken time to reflect and formulate a plan B, partly because I assume I can't make my application any stronger -- but perhaps that's wrong. Those of you who felt you were stronger the second time around, what did you do differently?

Edited February 19, 2013 by setgree

[Mnemonics2]

I pretty much meant the opportunity costs of academia itself . I think I'm getting this better now. i would have taken an all-out rejection as a signal that academia and i were a poor fit for each other and would have taken time to reflect and formulate a plan B, partly because I assume I can't make my application any stronger -- but perhaps that's wrong. Those of you who felt you were stronger the second time around, what did you do differently?

 

Dove into being involved in the field as much as possible knowing full well that there wouldn't be a ton of money in boosting my resume in the interim. Published where possible, made connections, took internships, worked up to a job in the field that I'd leave if I got in to a program just to show I could be dedicated to researching and working in political science/IR. And paid attention to what I actually wanted to do while doing that - that let me write a much more attractive SoP.