GradSchoolGrad

Lets focus this in terms of essential basics (FYI - I have family who went to HKS and know Princeton MPP well): 1. Quality of Education (defined as delivery... lets just say for the sake of argument the academic quality is tied): I would give the edge to Princeton here since they are a smaller program and arguably better organized + it does emphasize smaller class dynamics (for better and for worse). HKS is gigantic (by comparison) and there have been times where logistical challenges have made the learning environment a bit more challenging. 2 Interdisciplinary Potential: This is where HKS really shines over Princeton. Bottom line is that PSPIA is the only professional school in Princeton and its other graduate school options are simply not as robust as the Harvard enterprise. Although, please keep in mind that there is even a fair amount of collaboration opportunity between Harvard and MIT (you just have to seek it out). 3. Networking: This is where HKS really takes the cake again. The network is just by virtue of scale massively bigger and more diverse in terms of backgrounds careers. Given the number of dual decreeing that goes on with HKS + how HKS students have inclined towards some career opportunities near unheard of in other policy schools (including PSPIA), you simply have a wider range to draw from. I know people highly in touch with PSPIA alums and they have a tight knight and successful alum base, but generally speaking, they have held more traditional most MPP careers. We can dig into more, but I think these are the 3 biggest things to think about.

Gotcha. I'm not speaking about @excxn in terms of referencing terrible grades. I know one person with a 2.3 GPA who got into Harris, but he was a Navy Seal who did quasi quant projects later on in life...

So tell me if I'm wrong, but those people that I have grad school coached who got into Harris despite bad (sometimes terrible grades) are people who have: A: Brand name undergrad degrees: Ivy, Public Ivy, or Military Academy and the like and/or B: Interesting or extremely recognizable jobs that at least touched data: Also, from your opinion, what is the noticeable effect of the COVID Dip in student quality for this year? I say this because it is my understanding that all MPP schools were going off their waitlist to fill their quotas.

I completely agree with @prokem. There are ways you can mitigate (much of it from advertising perspective on your transcript) your low Calc grade. I was speaking more towards if you don't take measures to aggressively mitigate your Calc grade per the person's advice + rock the GRE quant. Without mitigation, my list stands.

If you want to go to McCourt MPP, get the brand, not really network, and learn some quant stuff, then that works for you (especially if you do part time). None of the part-times really did any active community engagement unless they worked at Georgetown. But ya, given what you pay for and your high expectations, McCourt doesn't really do much to build your professional skills and it isn't really a career oriented MPP program. The program focuses more on all things quant and school clubs that do at times bring in cool speakers, but have limited career value. If you care about having a more positive professionally oriented / social impact oriented experience, I would say look elsewhere. Your sweet spot might be UVA Batten school if you can get your GRE up. I think it needs to be clear where the C in calc impacts you and where it doesn't. Places that do calc based economics metrics like U. Michigan Ford and U. Chicago Harris are probably out for you - don't waste your time. HKS is likely out for you even though, they don't necessary require calc (though it can help). It won't matter for GWU, McCourt, Sanford. I would cross Mason and American off your list unless you just want to stay in DC and get some letters next to your name and don't really care about student experience. For example, I knew someone who went to Mason, just so she could avoid having to socialize with people (in all fairness she was Government consultant and needed a degree to advance in her career). American invested in a nice shiny new building and got lots of spending, but I know they hire ABD PhDs (and not the high experienced ones) to teach grad school classes, which much less than ideal.

1. Are you really really really sure you want to go a think tank? It is not as glamorous as you think it is. Also, the most direct way to go to a think tank is actually with PhD. As a master's degree person, you'll forever be a 2nd class person at a think tank (with some exceptions, mostly the managerial route or politically oriented routes). 2. First off, it is a a bit difficult to do large generalizations of these degrees because there is a rather wide range in how they are handled/taught. For example. IR can range from being heavily quantitative (Johns Hopkins being the most famous example such) to being highly qualitative (Monterrey being a good example). MPP is generally more quantitative, but it is generally about the design, execution, and review of policy from an analytical framework. MPA crosses over into MPP, but generally there is a lot more emphasis on execution and management aspects of policy. 3. In terms of what is competitive for foreign policy think tank roles, I would put them in these in clusters (notice how there are various degrees within). I may have missed some programs, but I like to think I mentioned most of the big hitters. Tier 1: Harvard Kennedy School (MPP) Johns Hopkins SAIS - MA in International Relations Georgetown SFS (Master of Science in Foreign Service.. and maybe Security Studies Program if you are squarely security focused) Columbia SIPA - whether you do the MIA or MPA , you should be fine either way. Tier 2: George Washington Elliot School - IR degrees Tufts Fletcher - the IR degrees (I know some people might think of Fletcher as tier 1, which I would agree for non-profit and state, but not think tank) Syracuse University MPA (a bit of an awkward fit, but you can float into national security from this angle... as they have a robust research opportunities). Tier 3: American SIS - IR degrees (some might also view this as Tier 2, but not that strong of a Think Tank pipeline... at least from what I saw) Middlebury Monterrey - IR degrees Denver University - IR degrees

So no one can realistically predict how things work anymore because of COVID + uncertain economic future. So I'll give you my thoughts based upon pre-COVID. 1. Absolutely not to HKS 2. Stretch for Harris, but wouldn't count on it... 3. Maybe for Sanford - probably a good fit 4. Very likely for McCourt - but I wouldn't go there because of not so great learning environment + you wouldn't get what you want in terms of quality non-qual stuff. 5. Very likely for Batten as well - I do think that might be your best fit (not know more about you).

I do completely agree with you about MPA and 1 year Masters at LSE not being the route towards a PhD, but I know quite a few MPP grads who went the elite Econ PhD route (Harvard/Chicago and etc.). If someone has time + money + wants to hedge their future career (as in not sure if they want to do PhD or go a professional route), I have seen the MPP option exercised quite successfully.

So here are some things I recommend you think about: 1. If you have sold your self on getting an MPP as a route to an intense Econ PhD, I would say the best 3 options for you are tied with: HKS (just take more quant classes), WWS, and Chicago - Harris. The tier below that would be: Michigan Ford - CMU - Heinz 2. I don't think SAIS is a good option for doing an Econ PhD simply because SAIS, and Johns Hopkins have a rather narrow (though very important) connection to some Econ aspects, but it isn't wide. For example, behavior economics would be something you wouldn't see that much at SAIS. I don't think you want limit yourself with Econ in a Master's program. At the end of the day, you never know what you will actually really care about academically.

I wonder how people feel about going to graduate school with a peer or peers who have been convicted of a crime? I haven't fully formulated an opinion, but just curious what others think. I will say that: 1. In one of my graduate programs, there was story (no one ever confirmed it) that there was once a student who was recently released from prison after committing white collar crime and graduated with a previous class. The general consensus was that they were glad the person got a 2nd chance in life after doing time. 2. In another of my graduate programs, one of my peers openly acknowledged and arguably bragged about having been convicted of Federal violation. Since this was a policy program, I was rather concerned if this was propagating bad ethics among our program. In all fairness to the program, my peer claimed claimed that no disclosure was made during the graduate school application.

I think it is a matter of risk. I heard of people in some schools getting removed after discovering false or incompletely provided information during their application. I also knew of someone in my graduate school who committed a federal judicial authority punished activity and not only got away from not disclosing it, but actively and openly bragged about it after matriculating into the program. HOWEVER... I think a smarter way to think about it is to think beyond the school and think towards employers. Some of them may actually pay for thorough background checks (also depending on industry). If they find out that you were deceptive to your graduate school in any way, it could be game over for you. That being said, you may want to pay close attention to the policy + specific directions of each graduate school application. As in, read the fine print.

Will vouch that is an awesome program.

I think you are worrying way too much about job experience. It sounds like you will have at least 4 years of work experience before Fall 2021. That means depending on school, you will be approx average of work experience. You will however come from an asymmetrical career background, which is fine, and in fact may work towards you advantage by virtue of being unique. I also strongly encourage to you avoid applying to online programs because honestly they are just money makers for schools and you don't necessarily get the best experience from them. I do recommend you consider flex / part time programs that are out there (I can name a few good ones). That way you at least have an opportunity to have an enhanced student experience (even if it is traveling to campus every now and then to meet your professors + classmates. Before you apply for programs, I recommend you figure out exactly what you want to get out of your degree. The number of degrees doesn't really matter at the end of the day (trust me I have 4, 6 if you count my Associate level degrees) to getter job while degree experience relevancy to a target job (or set of jobs) really matters. I will tell you point blank, that Master in Criminal Justice has a rather narrow aperture of direct outcomes (you guessed it related to law enforcement), so unless you are dedicated towards that field, it might not the be the most valuable use of your time and money. Based upon what you think you want to get a job in (private sector, public, non-profit) and leaning towards what policy area (domestic, international, etc.), then you should figure out what schools you apply to. It sounds like you are at a good starting point with GPA. However, GREs will matter too. Also if you don't have quant (Econ and Stats as a baseline), your viable options diminishes. Hope this general outlook helps.

1. First off, I think there is a lot to be said about domestic policy and how you can benefit society (assuming that is your goal). I think you need to figure out if you want to do Federal or State/Local based domestic policy. I think that is the question you need to answer first (I mean at a certain point, they are intertwined, but you need to figure out where you lean). 2. If you want to do Federal oriented domestic policy, it makes sense that you stay in DC. One option I recommend you think about the is the Carnegie Melon Heinz school's Public Policy Master's program via their satellite campus in DC: https://www.heinz.cmu.edu/programs/ The downside about this program is that you won't really get an interdisciplinary education because you will not be connected to Carnegie Melon as a whole However, the plus side is that you will be in DC and that you will have a very entrepreneur spirit. I have been impressed by every single person I have met from this program .They are all very forward thinking (I'm not talking politically) and pretty good communicators. 3. If you don't know or think you lean state, a good policy school option about be Duke's Terry Sanford School. 4. Of course Woodrow Wilson and Harvard Kennedy school are a good all around options, but they hard to get into. U. Chicago is academically great as well, but the network is not as well connected to DC. 5. If you want to focus on specific things such as the environment, Indiana University's SPEA school is a good option as well. 6. I don't think you should give up on the public sector right away. Also, depending on who wins the White House, there might be a lot more public sector hiring (but who knows). However, I think everyone should always be flexible to try private sector opportunities. The most successful people I have ever met in both private and public sector are those who have been to weave between both sides.

First off, let me highlight this only applies to MPP. MIDP, MPM, MSDPP, and the Executive programs + certificates are way better organized and managed. 1. I wouldn't say prior calc is strictly required. You need calc skills. I know people who just learned calc skills in 3 months and manage to survive (survive is the operative word). 2. SAIS is definitely more quant driven. MSFS has quant and you can go more quant if you want, but its strength lies within interdisciplinary nature + Georgetown brand for all things international relations. 3. You can't exactly teach collaboration, but you can get people to practice for it and care about it. In McCourt, they don't hold people accountable for bad behavior (faculty, staff, and students) both in and out of the classroom. For example, I know so many instances where I or my friends gave a terrible peer (non-contributor... or even net negative) bad the bad student teammate got the same grade as the rest of us, because peer reviews don't matter. Also, people are afraid to give honest feedback because McCourt has a culture that being nice is more important than being honest. When I contribute to my organization's hiring considerations, every time they ask me about hiring McCourt people, I tell them that someone has to really convince they are team players, because out of self interest I am going to go with the starting assumption that by virtue of going to McCourt, that they might not be. 4. Project pitching is for all sectors period. In government, non-profit, or private sector, to do well --> you need to pitch why your idea or your argument matters. So much about McCourt is telling a story about data (which is important, don't get me wrong). What is lost is the art of justifying your argument (with the facts + ethical considerations). Again, part of the reason why this area is problematic because McCourt has this culture obsessed with being nice, and people tend to have different shades of agreement or ostracizing (or just writing them off as a comedy act). What is missing is constructive disagreement as part of the learning process. Thereby, people struggle with making meaningful arguments. I actually met a lot of people who were adverse to making arguments period, because it scared them too much. 5. Management is hard to teach, but you can get people to exercise it during the school environment. However, McCourt doesn't practice meaningful things like rotating team leadership or any team specific roles. Its actually frowned upon to try to be a leader in any meaningful way because that is seen as overly aggressive. This goes back to in McCourt they want everyone to be nice, and if one person is unhappy, all progress must stop or that one unhappy person needs to be ostracized. 6. Policy writing skills are universal. The skills you utilize for Policy writing is the same that you use for emails. When I was a policy advisor, in non-profit, and in private sector, I use the same policy writing skills (which I learned at my internship and not McCourt) to get things done. 7. My remedial actions came in 2 types (and honestly, most career successful people in McCourt do one or both of these). A. Have internships focused on acquiring those skills that McCourt doesn't do well. B. Take classes outside of McCourt as much as possible. In my case, I went the extra mile and got another degree from another school to compensate for how McCourt shot me down.

Yes. I would say U. Chicago Harris, Michigan Ford, and Princeton - Woodrow Wilson, CMU - Heinz are the top 5 in terms of quant difficulty/intensity. McCourt is probably 6th. The difference between McCourt and those other programs are that you don't need to know calculus for McCourt. That being said, you do have more quant/quant based classes in McCourt than most other MPPs (double some). So I would say Georgetown McCourt and GWU are probably tied for the best internships in general among MPP programs in DC because those are the top 2 in general for DC area schools. However, depending on your interest area you might have better options. If you are interested in international relations, you would be better off doing Georgetown's MSFS program. If you are interested in pure data (more coding related), MS-DSPP is a good option, but I would but what Carnegie Mellon has as good if not slightly better (they have a campus in DC). As for data... it goes both ways. There are jobs that definitely require a strong data background and then there are jobs that just need a general understanding. The problem with McCourt is it de-emphasizes other skills that are important for the job market: 1. Collaboration 2. Project pitching 3. Management 4. Policy writing (one class on it and then you are done). So even if you do have the good quant skills, good luck getting a job with those other areas being weaker. I saw plenty of my classmates who could do exponential regression in their sleep, struggle to make a coherent argument. I even found my soft skills to be weakening within McCourt and had to take remedial action to fix it.

2 other things to think about. 1. If you really want to be in DC, you can do a concurrent degree. So Harvard MPP and Georgetown Law - https://www.hks.harvard.edu/educational-programs/masters-programs/joint-concurrent-degrees/concurrent-degrees 2. You could to do JD/PHD straight off the bat and forget the MPP.

Unless you want to focus your life on data analysis, work in Capital Hill, or do think tank stuff, I would not apply to Georgetown's MPP program. I also recommend that your friend post in this forum to ask about Georgetown MPP, so that she has better idea of what she is getting herself into. GWU might not have as much brand recognition + is a less quantitative program, but assuming COVID-19 will have subsided by the time you start school, you have a lot more flexibility on how to execute your career goals.

Honestly, final GPA is all that matters in the GPA realm. They give you room to justify any academic shortcomings you may have had on most applications. If you consider JD/MPP, your options improve significantly. I recommend that you apply to at least 2 T14 law schools.

School is more than about grades on a transcript. I think you cast too narrow a scope.

The perfect storm seems to work against the school's economics: 1. Feel fall of international students 2. Narrow (albeit great) job market appeal 3. Declining viability of international development in a less globalized world 4. Location is less than attractive (Somerville, not Boston) 5. High tuition 6. Not so interdisciplinary Its brand will probably keep it from dying off, but the struggles look ominous.

McCourt is really focused on data analysis and has extensive course offerings in partnership with the rest of Georgetown. Beyond that it really struggles with focus and be good at any one thing other than international development. People do generally talk a big game of what they are interested in, but follow through ranges wildly. I know a lot of people who got jobs equal to what people get straight from undergraduate. The thing you have to realize is that you compete for jobs with more than just other MPPs in the job market. You compete with JDs, MBAs, PhDs, other MPPs, other Master's, and even straight from undergrad. MPP alone, McCourt is probably tied with GWU in terms of prestige (maybe a little bit above it considering network and prestige of Georgetown's law school). However, I would put McCourt below Harvard, Berkeley, NYU, Syracuse, Carnegie Mellon, and Duke (just to name a few) in terms of other MPPs. You add onto that all the other programs, you McCourt actually falls behind a lot. I knew a lot of people who felt that they didn't get internships because they didn't go to a good enough school. The US News rankings might be silly, but people look at them, and McCourt is late teens or early 20s. The professors are all generally very good at teaching, but they struggle with being helpful for students interested in the general job market (unless you want to go into think tanks or academia). I always tell people if they want to get involved into data focused jobs, McCourt is a smart way to go. If you are still exploring on what you want to get in terms of job, McCourt is a bit risky.

So I will answer this one at a time. 1. Where you should go (since you say money isn't a main concern) - GWU - hands down. You will get the most career options from GW Law school. Reality check is that the JD will be your meal ticket and your MPA might give you some minor credibility in certain niche factors. 2. Yes. You will be able to work during your MPA phase (potentially). However, you should focus on that for experience and not for pay. If you manage to make more than $30 an hour then you will have struck Gold. I HIGHLY discourage you from working during the Law School phase. No matter where you go for your career, (even Legal Aid), they will ask you for your class rank and grades. 3. You might even get a scholarship for the MPA portion of your education. That is something to consider. 4. You know you can teach without getting a PhD. In fact, I recommend that you teach as a J.D. as an adjunct Professor (as in a expert in the field adjunct not of those minimum wage adjuncts) or teach Law School down the line. It makes no since to get a J.D. and then a PhD. What you learn in a J.D. doesn't exactly have good transferability to PhD. 5. Also, I don't know what your grades and/or LSAT/GRE are, but you really are limiting yourself by your options. I would consider Penn and NYU. Also, I would recommend you think about JD / MPP programs. MPP and MPA are somewhat different degrees but honestly they compete for the same jobs.

First of all... this is probably a better way to identify how competitive you are than a service. People working the services are former admissions officers or HR start ups, which in normal times would work fine, but in the era COVID, everything has gone weird.

Yes, Chicago is heavily quant oriented the fact that your GPA is so high and you actually have econometrics experience puts you in a good place (as long as you had a B+ or higher. Again, I don’t think GMAT is accepted for these programs. I would double check to make sure. You might need to take the GRE.