GradSchoolGrad

I think the best way to think of it is in terms of Venn diagrams. There is definitely a convergence point of jobs between MPPs and JD's and that convergence point is definitely growing. This convergence point is especially true policy areas that lend themselves to be concurrently legalistic and nature and requiring an understanding of policy processes + management. Three examples I have seen in this convergence is tech policy, juvenile policy, and environmental policy. If you think about it, these areas absolutely make sense because they have very strong legalistic flavors to it involved in the policy process + management. Generally speaking in areas of convergence the JD person usually wins out because the population of JDs seeking policy oriented jobs is actually quite small, so their skills are generally cherished (this population is however growing). I will say that as a dual MBA/MPP, whenever I went head on against a JD for a role listed as JD/MPP/or MPA, even in a policy area I had a lot of background experience on, I always lost in applications / interviews. On the MPP only side of the Venn diagram, those jobs generally tend to be more either A: more data oriented or B: simply hasn't received much attention from JDs (i.e. K-12 budgeting policy, you won't see many JDs play there). On the JD only side of the Venn diagram, those are more of the pure legalistic roles. As in you will be reading legal documents and need to formulate legal interpretations. I think for you it depends on how and where you want to play public policy. If you want to play public policy in an area in which there is a lot of legal contentions, JD is > MPP. However, the moment it touches data, MPP > JD.

Originally I posted this in reference to concerns about immigrating to the US post grad school and graduate school considerations. However, I'm glad we have expanded the conversation to highlight clarity on legal language on coming to school in the US.

Just to give everyone some insights about higher education economics to give context the reality is this: 1. the price per head of an undergrad costs more than grad students. This is because if you think about it, undergraduates require more resources - housing, more campus life, more career services support, wider ranger of academic needs... etc. etc. 2. Grad students per head costs are: academics, some campus life - but nothing as crazy as needed by undergrads, and career stuff... So how do graduate programs become cash cows? 1. Tuition (any tuition): Sometimes, even if your tuition is 60% of sticker price due to scholarships, the program may be making a decent amount off of you due to generally lower input costs to begin with. 2. International students: A lot of times graduate programs cater towards a wider international student market who nearly almost always pay full sticker price. Now I have seen graduate schools improve their diversity numbers via international students (sometimes a grad school will advertise strong diversity, but those "diverse" populations are international students. 3. Resource Acquisitions: A lot of graduate programs also support major research / operational arms that attract major donations, government grants, private grants, and etc. This can be a Catch 22, because it makes it look like that the graduate school is sitting fatter, but then they have more resource commitments. From an education perspective, it can be said that there is a benefit to giving access to such programs... but it has also been argued that it distracts away from the student experience. KEY THING TO UNDERSTAND One thing I want to highlight is that the money tied to a University and the budget available are two different things. Its easy to blame a University with a large endowment for being stingy and not providing scholarships or paying its workers enough (Harvard has been accused of that). However, the budget each school has, although tangentially tied to the endowment, is a very drastically different matter. Universities have lots and lots and lots of commitments, both long term and short term that they have to balance. What those look like vary based off of University, but those commitments mean that a seemingly wealthy University, legitimately might not be able to afford more scholarships for some its programs. To put this in context: I once saw a 1+ billion endowment University do an annual draw of endowment funds, but the majority of those funds went to its medical center (hence commitments). There once was a school called Cooper Union which had an endowment to make sure that all its students have all academic expenses paid for. They changed that pricing model (to a lot of controversy) because the dean thought that in order to be competitive, they needed to make strategic investments. Not saying it was right or wrong, but this goes to show Universities are trying to balance priorities (lets just imagine in general good faith), but students can be hit hard as consequence in terms of tuition.

That GPA is a bit in the lower half side of the house. Everyone I have ever met at MSFS not only had at least 2 years work experience, but really interesting stuff too. There is a reason why this is Foreign Policy's #1 international relations school.

To second that, it depends on what your likely career outcomes are. If you have job security + low income job... it probably isn't a good idea. I don't know enough about audiology grad programs (I think that is your grad program). If it is sub 65K out of grad school, 70K is probably a bad idea. If it is more than 65K, it might be okay. However... this depends on your job security potential as well. As in is your likely job recession proof?

That is totally the right decision. Especially with a recession coming, you don't want that extra debt. I mean the downside is that it will be more difficult to move to California to do a policy job... however you can overcome that with networking and picking the right projects. LBJ is also an amazing program academically. Lots of career options coming from there. Lots of great professors as well. I know people who transferred my grad program to go to LBJ.

Go to Harris... 60K scholarship... and we are entering a global recession. The Harvard brand is not worth that debt. Oh and The University of Chicago brand is also really strong in China... (understand it is no Harvard). Also, it is extremely difficult for Chinese international students to get scholarships (unless it is research or teaching based). I am really impressed you got one to Harris.

Honestly... faculty mean nothing unless you do research for them. HOWEVER... if we want to talk about padding your resume... it is better to do research for an actual organization rather than a Professor. SAIS has an upper hand on that. Also... I would recommend you think about the pros and cons of spreading the quant / Econ courseload. This is because you'll want some easier period to take on projects / part time work to pad your resume.

Honestly, Fletcher pales in comparison to SAIS for security / conflict resolution matters by virtue of lack of access. I mean my friend who was in MALD always bragged about how her great resources was Ambassador's in residence. Meanwhile, my SAIS friends had direct access to active practitioners and the latest and greatest. Also, during the last recession my friends from Fletcher (2012/2013 graduates) really were shooting the bottom of the barrel of jobs (like admin at random military bases making 50K or so) or taking academic fellowships to ride out the recession for an additional year. That quant in SAIS, albeit annoying really became a job hunting security blanket for some people I know because they could ride the recession from their quant background and go into things such as Data analysts. I know someone who was a wheat trade analyst for example. Also... on paper at Fletcher you have access to Harvard classes and some resources, but in reality its a logistical nightmare to get there + aside from some things that purposely meant for Fletcher + Harvard collaboration, you don't have access to the full suite of Harvard benefits (trips, alumni base, and etc.). I always laugh when Fletcher people brag about how they are/were practically Harvard students (I have heard this quite a lot at parties). I myself am a Math adverse person as well and the quant in my program was brutal for me. However... if it doesn't kill you, it will make you stronger. In an era of recession, I would just suck it up to avoid the debt + come out more capable technically and better connected in your desired field.

Just out of curiosity, any responses on how President Trump's recent announcement on a "temporary freeze on all immigration" impacts their graduate school decision making thoughts? Interested in what people have to say.

Was the school that cancelled your admission a well-respected public school or a less than 1 billion endowment private? Assuming that they need to cut programming due to budgetary pressures?

Unless you want to go into consulting (make that give it a shot), you should go to Yale. Honestly, you don't want to go into debt during a recession and you would have access to the same pool of jobs regardless.

I wouldn't say I'm actively anti-McCourt, I just want to highlight its shortcomings, as in the case with any school I am decently exposed to (Fletcher, HKS, MSFS, SAIS, Terry Sanford, and etc.) to give a fair and balanced perspective. However, as someone who has been in education for a long term (from both the teaching and policy side), I think I was able to call BS when I saw something wrong at McCourt when other people simply didn't know better or realize that it wasn't normal in graduate school.

This probably isn't the the answer you want, but honestly admissions offices are going crazy right now given the competing demands of meeting quota, balancing deferrals/admissions renegs, admissions support + increased questions, and all this renegotiation. Also, McCourt and GW aren't exactly programs with deep pockets. In my opinion McCourt is already overly generous as is (the people who get scholarships will shock you). Basically the early snipers probably already got a lot of the goods and it is now people fighting over the scraps. What this means for you is that I recommend you keep on trucking, but don't expect anything. Also @tacos95... I really hope you think twice about going to McCourt because I keep tabs on the alums and for those who graduated during a booming economy that didn't go to Deloitte... a lot of them are having tough lives pre-recession.

Actually since you are interested in Cyber Security and I know someone who went to Oxford for Politics Masters focused in Cyber Security, I thought I would give you 2 cents. Specific to that topic in general... UK is a super interesting place to look into it since they have interesting policy differences and approaches than the US but still with as similar to the US state of mind as it comes to legalities. My friend found it super helpful to have a unique perspective and was able to do groundbreaking research that launched her to an awesome PhD program.

1. I think it would be helpful if you defined international policy/management better, because that potentially encompasses a lot of things. 2. Pure career based thinking - I would do WWS by virtue of alumni network strength and size. Yes, WWS is more domestic focused, but they have so many historical connections + alumni strength that Yale Jackson does not have. Oh btw... Yale Jackson just became a "school" last year. Yes, it has the Yale name, but its still a newer program trying to figure itself out and hasn't gotten its act together yet. Oh and each class is about 30-40 people. That is super small... You will have to go to employers. Employers don't come to you (at least not in bulk).

1. Look, you just need to get a job that gives you leadership opportunities, organization skills, and etc. Things to think about. A. Be a teacher B. Join the military C. Teach English abroad (when Corona subsides) D. Work for local government Focus on learning skills, padding your resume... and focus less on being cool. 2. I would recommend after 2 years of work experience. Then try to grad school on at the end of year 3 or 4. But I think more than anything, you need to find career mentors. There are so many programs around that offer career mentors to college kids (just Google). I am a first generation immigrant myself. My parents don't speak English and have 0 connections. I found mentors and networked my way to things. The sooner you get off this forum and go find yourself some mentors, the better off you'll be.

Other than UCSD, I wouldn't go to any of those schools as an American. They simply don't have the brand strength for international relations.

I don't know how things work in India (I mean I do... I worked in Mumbai before)... but not structurally as a society. Something to think about is hopping between private and public sector in India. This is generally the future regardless of country. For example... doing policy analysis for a private sector company or a MNC. I think you really might want to think about expanding your career options before you think about where you want to go to grad school (regardless of costs).

Yes... SAIS has a much better brand. Yes LBJ is only starting its brand sprawl in DC (I mean it has a pretty good one to begin with... just its spread isn't that pronounced). No its not worth going into 80K debt for a superior academic experience + brand that at the end of the day only has marginal career outcomes differences in a recession. If it wasn't a recession, we could possibly explore more depending on your interests, background, and feasibility. I would recommend doing LBJ bottom line, but also strategically thinking of how to get project / part time gigs to pad your resume. Honestly, that resume padding will matter more than what school you go to (as long as you don't go to an utterly unknown school).

1. I wouldn't go to graduate school for IR or for MPP straight from undergrad. You simply aren't as competitive, no matter how great your undergraduate career is. 2. Also, I think you should understand why you want to go to graduate school (in terms of a target career outcome) rather than something you want to do 3. In the meantime, you build your resume... anything that has leadership or technical skills on it helps. It sounds like you are applying for jobs without networking. I recommend you network first. Going hog wild on LinkedIn is a good way to start.

First of all, this is a 100% no brainer... go to to CMU. First of all... if you want to focus hard on data analysis, MSPPM-Data is simply the right degree. You will encounter a much broader learning of languages and to advanced data analysis methods. Harris' MPP is the most quant intense MPP, but at the end of the day the coding languages are on your own and not part of the curriculum. Second, the easiest way to work in NYC is get a New York oriented project or work with a New York City institution on your project. That will matter more than where you went to school or what classes you took. Speaking of which, both schools have great brand names, granted Harris is marginally better. Either way... even if we weren't going to a recession, CMU is the right pick. Especially with recession, CMU is very much the right pick.

I mean, COVID-19 has introduced unprecedented circumstances. I think this is something to work out with the school and hope they are understanding (they should be).

Agreed... but you never know until you try!

I mean if you are okay with MC MPA 1 year program at HKS and pay for all of it... you might as well defer so you can at least be in Boston for it.