2021 Applicants Forum

[WolfMan]

8 minutes ago, qwer2 said:

Cameron Diaz has a line in some movie. She looks at her boobs and says they are soggier than they ever were. Then she says "the worst they ever were and the best they will ever be again." The theme is life only gets worse. I know a lot of non-tenure track writing faculty who say life is a lot harder after the mfa stage than before. First, a community becomes less firm. It becomes hard to find someone to comment on your writing. Second, the odds of getting published are worse than the odds of getting in to Iowa. The odds of getting a tenure track job is even worse than the odds of getting published. Non-tenure track university teachers make about $60K/year, and those jobs are hard to get to. You've chosen a rough life life. Artists don't live easy.

 

Was the movie "Bad Teacher"? The one where a middle-school teacher siphons money from school fundraisers to invest in a boob job in the hope that Justin Timberlake will wife her...

Edited January 27, 2021 by WolfMan

[Greithe]

22 hours ago, Ydrl said:

So uh, I know a lot of you have backup plans that involve moving somewhere else / trying again. I hope I don’t need my backup plan, because it’s applying to U Delaware for a PhD in Linguistics (in February). Somehow this feels even more unrealistic than my current plan.

Funny you should say, because my Plan B (possibly C) is going for my Ph.D. in Education, and Delaware is on my shortlist for that, along with a few programs in Virginia. I grew up in Maryland, so that's as close as I can get to home without having to live in my car due to housing prices.

Whichever road you land on, good luck! I love Delaware's beaches and little towns. 

[jka0124]

2 hours ago, Ophelias pansies said:

Content Warning: This is gonna be a semi negative rant! I don't want to put bad energy in here but I feel like I'm singing the same tune to friends and family who don't really "get" this process like you guys do. 

I feel like my life revolves around hearing back from programs. I thought that the initial anxiety would be over by now but every time that I get an email it feels like the world is going to end. I know in my heart it's silly to think but I can't help but feel like if I don't get in I'm delusional for thinking that I actually had a chance in the first place. The imposter syndrome is hitting me really hard right now. My super intelligent friend who has gotten into competitive programs in another field helped me with applications and vice versa. She tells me that I need to calm down because the application is strong and there's nothing else that I can do. She's not a liar and she's nixed pages of my application before telling me that I've got a solid portfolio. She wouldn't lie. I know that. But, I have this awful feeling that everyone in my life is lying to me and that they secretly pity my misplaced hopefulness. It's silly but  I wish that I could physically follow my application and be a fly on the wall and hear why I wasn't chosen or why I will be chosen. I thought that physically preparing for my results would be the hardest part and waiting would be a welcome break. But, it's not the case at all. Is anyone else plagued with imposter syndrome? How are you dealing with it? 

Imposter Syndrome is ironically common. You’d think it’d cancel itself out. After all, how can everyone feel like an imposter? Surely some of us can’t be faking it! 

I was watching a YouTube video where someone said, “Don’t tell yourself no. Let other people tell you no.” Their point was to not reject yourself in order to minimize the pain of others rejecting you. That goes hand in hand with a second thing: very often a rejection is not a “no,” it’s a “not yet.” This is true for jobs, promotions, projects, grants, etc. In the case of the CW MFA, remember that many people apply several times to get into a good program. 

It sounds cheesy, but I do suggest practicing positive affirmations. Nip those negative imposter syndrome thoughts in the bud and eventually you’ll train your brain to let some of those thoughts pass over you without taking them seriously. 

[orangeslice]

P.S. Did any of you guys apply to Purdue? It looks like their acceptances usually come out the last week of January and I'm having a nail-biter of a time lol. 

[feralgrad]

3 hours ago, Ophelias pansies said:

Is anyone else plagued with imposter syndrome? How are you dealing with it? 

Personally I'm more prone to comparing myself against others (generally to my own detriment) than imposter syndrome specifically. Sometimes I feel inadequate, but I don't feel like an imposter, since I still did the work required to get into my program. As we all know, applications are a long and difficult process. And you did that work too!

One thing they stress in grad school is that writing (or any creative endeavor) is not an innate talent. It's a skill that must be honed over the course of years. That involves a lot of bad drafts and rejections. Writing something you think is sub-par doesn't make you an imposter -- quite the opposite. It proves you're putting in the work.

[M-Lin]

 

1 hour ago, jka0124 said:

Imposter Syndrome is ironically common. You’d think it’d cancel itself out. After all, how can everyone feel like an imposter? Surely some of us can’t be faking it! 

I was watching a YouTube video where someone said, “Don’t tell yourself no. Let other people tell you no.” Their point was to not reject yourself in order to minimize the pain of others rejecting you. That goes hand in hand with a second thing: very often a rejection is not a “no,” it’s a “not yet.” This is true for jobs, promotions, projects, grants, etc. In the case of the CW MFA, remember that many people apply several times to get into a good program. 

It sounds cheesy, but I do suggest practicing positive affirmations. Nip those negative imposter syndrome thoughts in the bud and eventually you’ll train your brain to let some of those thoughts pass over you without taking them seriously. 

I think that's great advice! For however many times I tried to get through the book The Artist's Way, I've never managed finish it. I think I'm allergic to self-help books. But you just reminded me that, in the book, there are instructions for "morning pages" (free flow writing) and self-affirmations. I do find it true that when I write stuff down (those insecure, self-abasing thoughts we all have), I'm able to just file it away. Like it's out of my system. As I'm writing this, the most appropriate analogy that comes up is a comparison with human bowel movements. Just flush it out! LOL 

[JPReinhold]

3 hours ago, babypoet2k said:

ohhhh big time! i've honestly felt like ad comms are just going to laugh at my sample and at how silly i was for applying. but then i find some peace in the fact that this is something that has brought me so much joy, and even if the world is lying to me and i actually really suckand dont stand a chance, it still makes me happy. PLUS we're all allowed to suck at things. thats human

 honestly i've been finding ways to keep my hands occupied. that means basically anything that doesnt need me to sit in one place. its like physically running away from even the thought of this process. it's probably not going to work long term but i just need it to work until i hear back. 

 i could not tell you how you can deal with imposter syndrome except to show your work to strangers. i put it up on instagram and people whose work i really admired also liked mine. its easier to believe that you're good at what you do when strangers who have no agenda and nothing you can give them in return enjoy your work. but also do something tangible that you can see and hold in your hands instead of just writing on a screen. it helps, i promise.

 also i feel like if im about to get all rejections, it would be so much easier to deal if i got them all at once, like RIGHT NOW. why make us wait four months to tell us. but the world is the way it is so we must, must, must remember to breathe. it sucks rn but it'll be over so soon. 4 months may feel like a lifetime but its such a smol time. u got this!

❤️

 

Poetry Twitter is the most supportive writing community I’ve ever been part of. I don’t know what I’d do without it - a very positive, uplifting group of people. Even very accomplished poets are happy to read / share / critique the work of lesser known poets (like me). I recommend joining Twitter if you’re a poet (though I hear other communities can be negative there). 

[M-Lin]

I also think it's particularly hard to get out of my head this year because I literally spend all my time home (a one-bedroom apartment) other than occasional grocery run and walking my dog. As much as I treasure this time to read and write, it's also incredibly under-stimulating. With less daylight in the winter, I think we can all get a little too deep in our heads these days. 

[WolfMan]

https://www.buzzfeed.com/alexanderchee/my-parade

Alexander Chee wrote a pretty good article about the fiction MFA. 

So did George Saunders

https://www.newyorker.com/books/page-turner/my-writing-education-a-timeline

...and T.C. Boyle

https://www.tcboyle.com/author/essay.html

[M-Lin]

What books on writing does everyone recommend? 

I've read On Writing by Stephen King, Bird by Bird by Anna Lamott, On Writing Well by William Zinsser. I recommend the latter two, though King's childhood anecdotes are enjoyable. 

How Fiction Works by James Wood is very much to the point. 

On my shelf that I've not read yet - Vonnegut & McConnell's Pity the Reader and John McPhee's Draft No.4: On the Writing Process. 

For grammar and style, obviously, The Element of Style. Recently read Dreyer's English and found it very helpful. It cleared up some things that I was always not so sure about. It's also full of jokes. 

I find non-fiction writing books illuminating to fiction writing as well. And writers' diaries/journals, when available, are so fun to read. The sense of schadenfreude I feel when I see great writers having almost the same daily struggles...

Would love to hear everyone's recommendations! What else have we got but time to read. 

 

[jka0124]

7 minutes ago, M-Lin said:

What books on writing does everyone recommend?

 

For fiction, I like Writing Fiction by (Janet, I think) Burroway and The Hidden Machinery by Margot Livesey. 

 

[mrvisser]

13 minutes ago, M-Lin said:

What books on writing does everyone recommend? 

I've read On Writing by Stephen King, Bird by Bird by Anna Lamott, On Writing Well by William Zinsser. I recommend the latter two, though King's childhood anecdotes are enjoyable. 

How Fiction Works by James Wood is very much to the point. 

On my shelf that I've not read yet - Vonnegut & McConnell's Pity the Reader and John McPhee's Draft No.4: On the Writing Process. 

For grammar and style, obviously, The Element of Style. Recently read Dreyer's English and found it very helpful. It cleared up some things that I was always not so sure about. It's also full of jokes. 

I find non-fiction writing books illuminating to fiction writing as well. And writers' diaries/journals, when available, are so fun to read. The sense of schadenfreude I feel when I see great writers having almost the same daily struggles...

Would love to hear everyone's recommendations! What else have we got but time to read. 

 

My favorite by far is The Writing Life by Annie Dillard.

[eternalwhitenights]

Aww, my heart goes out to all the people who are having imposter syndrome. I've felt that internal merry-go-round, too, at various points throughout this process (and I'm sure I will again), but I just wanted to offer a thought about it that I hope can help.

Someone above mentioned feeling like their life revolved around these applications. One, that shows how much you care about this process, so I'd consider that aspect of it a positive, so don't be too hard on yourself, love. ❤️ However, I also wanted to posit a thought for reflection: have you thought about who/what you place your sense of worth or identity in? If you place your sense of self-worth, or sense of success, or even your sense of identity solely on whether or not you get accepted into these programs, that could be a part of why you're feeling like your life revolves around these applications. You are absolutely more than whether or not you get into an MFA program this year, or ever, and maybe remembering that you are a multi-faceted person, with so, so much to offer the world, who also happens to have other hobbies and interests and dreams and thoughts to offer the world, and that can still be offered to the world, both in and out of an MFA program--just expanding your idea of what success can look like, or even what makes you "you," might be a place to start to help assuage some of the obsessive checking.

I hope you get in, and I hope all your dreams come true in a way that helps you become the best version of yourself. God bless you, friend, and sending you hugs and encouragement over these interwebz in the interim. ❤️

Edited January 27, 2021 by eternalwhitenights

[pattycat]

25 minutes ago, M-Lin said:

 

What books on writing does everyone recommend? 

 

I’m currently reading the new one from George Saunders—A Swim in a Pond in the Rain—and it’s excellent.

Edited January 27, 2021 by pattycat
Typo

[largeheartedboy]

2 hours ago, M-Lin said:

What books on writing does everyone recommend?

 

I read Matthew Salesses' new book, Craft in the Real World: Rethinking Fiction Writing and Workshopping, and found it thought-provoking on many levels. I'd recommend it to any writer, regardless of genre, as well as teachers of writing.

[M-Lin]

Thanks everyone for recommending! keep them coming

[The_Realeo]

Did anyone have to harass their recommenders for their LORs?  Two of my professors were really on it, but one of my recommenders had to be reminded a few times.  It made me really uncomfortable to do be so pushy, but I started to worry.

[orangeslice]

7 minutes ago, The_Realeo said:

Did anyone have to harass their recommenders for their LORs?  Two of my professors were really on it, but one of my recommenders had to be reminded a few times.  It made me really uncomfortable to do be so pushy, but I started to worry.

One of my letter writers was AWOL for so long I got worried she had COVID and started searching the interweb for articles about 'beloved professor, gone too soon.' Long story short, she was just really behind on grading and was very gracious about the many (many) follow up emails I sent to her. After all the letters were in I sent a handwritten thank you note that I hope makes up for the hassle! So I guess moral of this story is harass if you have to lol

[Graceful Entropy]

Literally just this afternoon got an email from a recommender (who had already wrote the letter last year), and said my emails got stuck in her junk mail. I only really needed her for one teaching rec, and got someone else to cover, but she sent it in anyways. Guess it can't hurt. 

[orangeslice]

6 minutes ago, orangeslice said:

One of my letter writers was AWOL for so long I got worried she had COVID and started searching the interweb for articles about 'beloved professor, gone too soon.' Long story short, she was just really behind on grading and was very gracious about the many (many) follow up emails I sent to her. After all the letters were in I sent a handwritten thank you note that I hope makes up for the hassle! So I guess moral of this story is harass if you have to lol

Also now remembering I sent an SOS email to Syracuse (whose staff got back to me quickly and were trying to help me brainstorm) and Texas (which had an unhelpful robot send me a form email a while later) because the letters were past deadline. Thankfully it all turned out ?

[Graceful Entropy]

For writing book recs on my side, besides the one mentioned, I've always loved LeGuin's thoughts on writing, literally Conversations on Writing is just an interview w/ her sectioned out, but it is so, so pure. And Richard Hugo's Triggering Town gets me pumped about teaching writing.

Also I love that @PaulMo has chosen this adoptive family. I love the Weike Wang rec. Brandon Taylor's Real Life has also gotten some great reviews, and specifically from some people who did postgrad chemistry/science work, I've heard that it is a great representation of that life.

[cosmictones]

5 hours ago, qwer2 said:

Cameron Diaz has a line in some movie. She looks at her boobs and says they are soggier than they ever were. Then she says "the worst they ever were and the best they will ever be again." The theme is life only gets worse. I know a lot of non-tenure track writing faculty who say life is a lot harder after the mfa stage than before. First, a community becomes less firm. It becomes hard to find someone to comment on your writing. Second, the odds of getting published are worse than the odds of getting in to Iowa. The odds of getting a tenure track job is even worse than the odds of getting published. Non-tenure track university teachers make about $60K/year, and those jobs are hard to get to. You've chosen a rough life life. Artists don't live easy.

 

nah dude we just hadn't fucked in a couple days, now I'm fine. thanks for the cold hard facts of life though lol.

[jka0124]

1 hour ago, cosmictones said:

nah dude we just hadn't fucked in a couple days, now I'm fine. thanks for the cold hard facts of life though lol.

Lmfao. Sometimes it’s just as simple as needing some Vitamin D. Whether that’s sunlight or sex. 

[JPReinhold]

I just got accepted at Miami of Ohio (poetry)!

My little ones and I just popped open the bottle of sparkling Welch's that has been sitting in the fridge door. I told them I got into an MFA and my daughter (3) ran to the fridge. I was really worried we weren't going to get to open it this year. 

SO GLAD to have an acceptance. I only applied to fully-funded programs that I'd be proud to attend, so this is big for me. I wanted to share the good news!

(And check your email if you applied!)

[tippybug]

7 minutes ago, JPReinhold said:

I just got accepted at Miami of Ohio (poetry)!

My little ones and I just popped open the bottle of sparkling Welch's that has been sitting in the fridge door. I told them I got into an MFA and my daughter (3) ran to the fridge. I was really worried we weren't going to get to open it this year. 

SO GLAD to have an acceptance. I only applied to fully-funded programs that I'd be proud to attend, so this is big for me. I wanted to share the good news!

(And check your email if you applied!)

CONGRATS!!!!!! Awesome news!