2021 Applicants Forum

[kikis_delivery]

also waitlisted at nyu for fiction!!! it's the first positive news i've heard but i'm feeling pretty mixed since i wasn't expecting to hear ANY positive news this year....but anyway not getting my hopes up too much. i'm wondering if anyone can point me to any data about how many people they've accepted from waitlists in the past. thank you!!

[lilacbread]

2 minutes ago, kikis_delivery said:

also waitlisted at nyu for fiction!!! it's the first positive news i've heard but i'm feeling pretty mixed since i wasn't expecting to hear ANY positive news this year....but anyway not getting my hopes up too much. i'm wondering if anyone can point me to any data about how many people they've accepted from waitlists in the past. thank you!!

I was also just waitlisted at NYU for fiction! I lurked the previous draft groups and I couldn't find anything concrete, but it seems like they traditionally keep a long list. I'm not hoping out hope, but imo it's really cool that someone read our work and found merit in it  Congrats!

[amyiable]

just got waitlisted at NYU as well, but I don’t think I’m going to stay on it. I’m ready for the stress of ~waiting~ to be over. ☹️

[shakyboots]

Jeez how many of us did they put on the waitlist?? lol.

[Ash...]

Also on the NYU waitlist for fiction. Just happy to be considered at all for such an awesome program! Thankful I have other offers if it doesn’t work out. 

[kikis_delivery]

11 minutes ago, shakyboots said:

Jeez how many of us did they put on the waitlist?? lol.

right??? for every person on this forum there must be lots of lurkers and lots of people who don't even know about it so it must be at least like 30 ppl on the list???

[kikis_delivery]

also not to be an idiot but in my waitlist-induced frenzy i've completely forgotten how large the nyu cohort is and i can't seem to find the info, does anyone know?

[frecklefrex]

Congratulations to everyone that is hearing positive news! I am truly so happy for you!

Would anyone like to chime in with their opinion on VCU? Positive or negative!

[shakyboots]

Just now, kikis_delivery said:

right??? for every person on this forum there must be lots of lurkers and lots of people who don't even know about it so it must be at least like 30 ppl on the list???

That is my thinking. Funny how they also won't provide the size or our place on it.

Also, to your second message: normally 40-60 per P&W, but someone posted here they are only accepting like 25-30 this year, right? I think I read that. Anyone remember?

[Blackhole]

27 minutes ago, Cristie said:

That's because you are a truth-teller. I was a cop for a bit and all I ever did was tell the truth. When I left that career, I couldn't write nonfiction...I was so mentally blocked there. But I told myself I was tired of seeing and telling all the ugly truths. I used fiction as a way to escape that often morbid reality. So I get the bad shit you see and how it sticks with you. Not everyone will agree with me, but I found that writing in third person, past tense really helped me detach from that issue I was having (from a truth-telling profession). All those times I wished the ending for people would have been different...I wrote it that way-the way I wish it could have been. Maybe try that. The guy with the bird...I'd read that one.

Hey, whatever you have written is so fascinating and so true. And I agree with you about the ugly truths and the bad shit that sticks with us. I actually applied for fiction to make the endings change or where there were no endings, make up an ending that would make it seem bearable. And I guess you are right about the third person. I am going to try that. The guy with the bird is fascinating. the bird died in 2019. He had played for the bird for 32 years. He said it required more love than he could give it. but I got stuck there. Maybe I will try again ::::) thanks so much. hugs.

[kikis_delivery]

4 minutes ago, shakyboots said:

That is my thinking. Funny how they also won't provide the size or our place on it.

Also, to your second message: normally 40-60 per P&W, but someone posted here they are only accepting like 25-30 this year, right? I think I read that. Anyone remember?

i just found this quotation on the FAQ portion of the site: "We have approximately 800 applicants each year. Of these, approximately 20-30 students are accepted in each genre. At any one time, there are about 110 students attending our graduate program."

[shakyboots]

Just now, kikis_delivery said:

i just found this quotation on the FAQ portion of the site: "We have approximately 800 applicants each year. Of these, approximately 20-30 students are accepted in each genre. At any one time, there are about 110 students attending our graduate program."

Okay, so then the 25-30 I was thinking was just a normal year's fiction cohort of 20-30 students. So that could very well be true this year, as well. Does anyone know if they are admitting a full-sized class, or have they cut seats like many other schools due to COVID?

[shakyboots]

I would really wonder about the quality of my MFA with that student/faculty ratio... Then again, maybe NYU has it all figured out. Anybody have any insight into how hands-on they are or are not, perhaps from a graduate of the program?

[iai]

12 minutes ago, shakyboots said:

Okay, so then the 25-30 I was thinking was just a normal year's fiction cohort of 20-30 students. So that could very well be true this year, as well. Does anyone know if they are admitting a full-sized class, or have they cut seats like many other schools due to COVID?

I heard from one of the accepted applicants that they took 16 for fiction this year. Seems like it’s been cut down? 

[kikis_delivery]

19 minutes ago, shakyboots said:

I would really wonder about the quality of my MFA with that student/faculty ratio... Then again, maybe NYU has it all figured out. Anybody have any insight into how hands-on they are or are not, perhaps from a graduate of the program?

maybe they just have more faculty members than other programs? their faculty list on the site seems extensive 

[lav]

49 minutes ago, shakyboots said:

Jeez how many of us did they put on the waitlist?? lol.

It looks to me that they wait listed almost everyone, and rejected almost no one. Can someone explain to me the advantages of NYU over a state/city school that charges $9,000 instead of $24,000 per year. Do you think you will learn more because of better teachers? Are you willing to pay a lot to be in New York and don't like City College's MFA?

[Blackhole]

6 minutes ago, lav said:

It looks to me that they wait listed almost everyone, and rejected almost no one. Can someone explain to me the advantages of NYU over a state/city school that charges $9,000 instead of $24,000 per year. Do you think you will learn more because of better teachers? Are you willing to pay a lot to be in New York and don't like City College's MFA?

I got rejected. I saw a couple on draft as well. My application was incomplete but that's irrelevant. But they did reject people.

[goodcynara]

Hey y'all - What are your thoughts on emailing a program that has not yet responded? I had decided against this, but something just posted on Draft is leading me to reconsider. Would love to hear your experience with this.

[shakyboots]

10 minutes ago, kikis_delivery said:

maybe they just have more faculty members than other programs? their faculty list on the site seems extensive 

Does it? Eight core fiction profs for up to sixty fiction students at once... Many schools have a much better ratio. I'd still love to attend though!

[shakyboots]

2 minutes ago, goodcynara said:

Hey y'all - What are your thoughts on emailing a program that has not yet responded? I had decided against this, but something just posted on Draft is leading me to reconsider. Would love to hear your experience with this.

It can't hurt you to inquire. They aren't that sensitive and ready to reject, lol.

[ZaytandLabna]

26 minutes ago, lav said:

It looks to me that they wait listed almost everyone, and rejected almost no one. Can someone explain to me the advantages of NYU over a state/city school that charges $9,000 instead of $24,000 per year. Do you think you will learn more because of better teachers? Are you willing to pay a lot to be in New York and don't like City College's MFA?

They rejected me ??? 

This was my weakest application. 
BUT I got into my top 2 choices sooo its' fine. I'm fine. *still crying a little on the inside*  
 

 

Edited March 16, 2021 by ZaytandLabna

[goodcynara]

3 minutes ago, shakyboots said:

It can't hurt you to inquire. They aren't that sensitive and ready to reject, lol.

LOL, thanks!

[dogeared]

Hi friends! LONG POST INCOMING. I hope it is helpful.

Some weeks back I mentioned that my institution has one final-year student in each genre join the admissions committee and review incoming apps. I got to review incoming fiction applications. I'm very grateful for the behind-the-scenes view I got of the admissions process. This week we finally had our meeting to finalize our list of offers (it was a 3-hour meeting). I wanted to offer some advice and share some observations for anyone applying again next cycle. 

As a note, of course no advice will be universal. Every department and every writer is different. There is no surefire way to guarantee admission to a program. These are just things I've realized as an MFA student/adcom member and wished I knew before applying. 

• Your writing sample is the most important thing. I think people have been told this already, but I want to emphasis this point. Your CV is not as important. Of course, it might not hurt to have a flourishing CV, but having more publications and experience in literature/writing won't mean much if your writing sample doesn't stand out from the bunch. The CV was the last thing we looked at in applications.

 

• Perfect and polished work isn't always the best. It sounds a bit weird -- I know. Of course, you should send what you are confident in. But ultimately, you are meant to grow stronger as a writer in an MFA program. If your writing sample doesn't show that you would benefit from graduate school, then some profs in admissions question what they would even be able to teach you. Think about whether you would benefit from workshop and formal education. The most excited manuscripts to read (which we all agreed on unanimously) were the ones that did something interesting and were kind of rough around the edges. This might not be the case for institutions that value something different than ours, but it is important to us that writers can really grow and get something out of our program. We weren't as excited about people who sent by-the-books "perfect" stories. The writing was great, but it was hard to picture these applicants in a workshop. This is difficult because we always want to submit the best work possible to programs. But to the admissions committees, this sample is all they can use to determine if you would benefit from graduate school. This is something I didn't think about until I was behind the scenes. I noticed myself much less interested in pieces that were perfect. Everyone on the committee was excited about the possibilities for growth they saw in a manuscript and for the successful risk takers that tried something interesting that surprised them. (Again, though, every program and committee will be different)

 

• The mindset behind reviewing MFA apps is very different from the mindset behind reviewing litmag submissions. Luckily, I have years of experience reading for litmags. In that scenario, you want to find the polished, well-written, balanced stories that don't need as much work. The ones that are ready for publication. The mindset is different when reviewing writing samples for MFA apps. We generally were interested in innovative forms/perspectives/styles that would greatly benefit from years of workshop and formal education. 

 

• You do not need an MFA from a highly-ranked program. You do not need the shortest program possible. Look at funding and program fit before anything else!  Really think about why you want an MFA. Hopefully you want it because you want to become a stronger writer and work with a community of other writers. Maybe there is a faculty member at the institution you're applying to that you really admire and want to work with. Maybe you want it to pursue a teaching career in creative writing. These are all great reasons to me. But if you just want the MFA to have the MFA, chances are you will make the wrong choices when it comes to which programs to apply to. You might get accepted to these places and not feel fulfilled. When I was first applying to MFAs in 2017, I was really interested in the big-name schools that would make me feel accomplished and important on paper. And I was really interested in the shortest programs possible. I think big-name schools are still worth applying to, of course, if you genuinely believe you could thrive and grow in that school's environment then I definitely think you should apply. And I always encourage "aiming high" because why not? But make sure the faculty and culture of that place fit with your goals. And I genuinely can say that most people I know who have MFAs agree on longer, fully-funded programs being the better choice over 1-year ones. After all, you are there to learn and work on a manuscript. If you can get paid for years to really dig into your work, I would take that. 1-year programs might be stressful and overbearing, and you might finish feeling like you were able to grow or absorb any actual information. Having the time and space to experiment and question everything is really valuable. But everyone is different! Maybe you thrive under pressure or you have other commitments and life situations that make shorter programs more ideal. That totally makes sense. No matter what though, please please please look for FUNDING. If you only aim for the most popular programs, your chances for funding are lower. There is a larger applicant pool. That is a fact. Try adding some lesser-known schools with great faculties. They often have a bunch of funding for you and a smaller applicant pool. After all, if your reasoning for getting an MFA is to learn and grow as a writer, then the name of the school shouldn't be what is most important to you. I stand by this fully. And again, I still think its great to try for more famous programs...don't say no for them.

AGAIN: This advice may vary by writer, by program, by admissions committee. Nothing is black-and-white. I just found these things to be really important to consider. 

This is a lot of writing lol. I'm sorry for the wall of text. I'm happy to DM anyone who wants to talk more. I am graduating with my MFA (fiction) in May, and I've been accepted into a PhD program for English Lit and Creative Writing for the Fall. I am happy to answer any questions! Good luck!

[shakyboots]

Just got accepted into Emerson!!

*for Creative Writing.

Edited March 16, 2021 by shakyboots

[M-Lin]

11 minutes ago, dogeared said:

Hi friends! LONG POST INCOMING. I hope it is helpful.

Some weeks back I mentioned that my institution has one final-year student in each genre join the admissions committee and review incoming apps. I got to review incoming fiction applications. I'm very grateful for the behind-the-scenes view I got of the admissions process. This week we finally had our meeting to finalize our list of offers (it was a 3-hour meeting). I wanted to offer some advice and share some observations for anyone applying again next cycle. 

As a note, of course no advice will be universal. Every department and every writer is different. There is no surefire way to guarantee admission to a program. These are just things I've realized as an MFA student/adcom member and wished I knew before applying. 

• Your writing sample is the most important thing. I think people have been told this already, but I want to emphasis this point. Your CV is not as important. Of course, it might not hurt to have a flourishing CV, but having more publications and experience in literature/writing won't mean much if your writing sample doesn't stand out from the bunch. The CV was the last thing we looked at in applications.

 

• Perfect and polished work isn't always the best. It sounds a bit weird -- I know. Of course, you should send what you are confident in. But ultimately, you are meant to grow stronger as a writer in an MFA program. If your writing sample doesn't show that you would benefit from graduate school, then some profs in admissions question what they would even be able to teach you. Think about whether you would benefit from workshop and formal education. The most excited manuscripts to read (which we all agreed on unanimously) were the ones that did something interesting and were kind of rough around the edges. This might not be the case for institutions that value something different than ours, but it is important to us that writers can really grow and get something out of our program. We weren't as excited about people who sent by-the-books "perfect" stories. The writing was great, but it was hard to picture these applicants in a workshop. This is difficult because we always want to submit the best work possible to programs. But to the admissions committees, this sample is all they can use to determine if you would benefit from graduate school. This is something I didn't think about until I was behind the scenes. I noticed myself much less interested in pieces that were perfect. Everyone on the committee was excited about the possibilities for growth they saw in a manuscript and for the successful risk takers that tried something interesting that surprised them. (Again, though, every program and committee will be different)

 

• The mindset behind reviewing MFA apps is very different from the mindset behind reviewing litmag submissions. Luckily, I have years of experience reading for litmags. In that scenario, you want to find the polished, well-written, balanced stories that don't need as much work. The ones that are ready for publication. The mindset is different when reviewing writing samples for MFA apps. We generally were interested in innovative forms/perspectives/styles that would greatly benefit from years of workshop and formal education. 

 

• You do not need an MFA from a highly-ranked program. You do not need the shortest program possible. Look at funding and program fit before anything else!  Really think about why you want an MFA. Hopefully you want it because you want to become a stronger writer and work with a community of other writers. Maybe there is a faculty member at the institution you're applying to that you really admire and want to work with. Maybe you want it to pursue a teaching career in creative writing. These are all great reasons to me. But if you just want the MFA to have the MFA, chances are you will make the wrong choices when it comes to which programs to apply to. You might get accepted to these places and not feel fulfilled. When I was first applying to MFAs in 2017, I was really interested in the big-name schools that would make me feel accomplished and important on paper. And I was really interested in the shortest programs possible. I think big-name schools are still worth applying to, of course, if you genuinely believe you could thrive and grow in that school's environment then I definitely think you should apply. And I always encourage "aiming high" because why not? But make sure the faculty and culture of that place fit with your goals. And I genuinely can say that most people I know who have MFAs agree on longer, fully-funded programs being the better choice over 1-year ones. After all, you are there to learn and work on a manuscript. If you can get paid for years to really dig into your work, I would take that. 1-year programs might be stressful and overbearing, and you might finish feeling like you were able to grow or absorb any actual information. Having the time and space to experiment and question everything is really valuable. But everyone is different! Maybe you thrive under pressure or you have other commitments and life situations that make shorter programs more ideal. That totally makes sense. No matter what though, please please please look for FUNDING. If you only aim for the most popular programs, your chances for funding are lower. There is a larger applicant pool. That is a fact. Try adding some lesser-known schools with great faculties. They often have a bunch of funding for you and a smaller applicant pool. After all, if your reasoning for getting an MFA is to learn and grow as a writer, then the name of the school shouldn't be what is most important to you. I stand by this fully. And again, I still think its great to try for more famous programs...don't say no for them.

AGAIN: This advice may vary by writer, by program, by admissions committee. Nothing is black-and-white. I just found these things to be really important to consider. 

This is a lot of writing lol. I'm sorry for the wall of text. I'm happy to DM anyone who wants to talk more. I am graduating with my MFA (fiction) in May, and I've been accepted into a PhD program for English Lit and Creative Writing for the Fall. I am happy to answer any questions! Good luck!

Thank you so much for taking the time to post this advice here! I feel like this should be published somewhere so someone can read this when they google "advice for MFA application". 

Fortunately I don't think I'll need to apply for a second round, but I'm wondering why you decided to pursue a PhD beyond your MFA. I guess I'm already thinking ahead... do you mind elaborating on that a little bit? Thanks! 

Edited March 16, 2021 by M-Lin