2020-2021 Application Thread

[Mad Scientist Malfrost]

1 hour ago, BrownSugar said:

Honestly, I’m just waiting for a couple more decisions so that this can be officially over (I know I won’t choose any EU option over the US).  Depending on how the rest of US decisions go, I already know where I’d like to confirm my spot. So it’s really frustrating just waiting and waiting, and I’m sure a lot of you feel this way. I just want to see the end in sight. 

Hey! I only just noticed you got a Chicago admit! Congrats on that!

[Theory007]

2 hours ago, baby__yoda said:

Wait whats the issue with Michigan? Myself and another claimed admits to UMich (I’m AP and they were Political theory I think). Not sure about Berkeley and MIT, I didnt apply there so I havent followed that closely. 

But it seems to me that admissions are being released in extremely weird patterns. UCSD released rejections before admissions, waitlists for Duke came out before admissions and Princeton released their results later than usual. I would urge people to take deep breaths, wait it out, and ignore the results page because its clearly not an accurate way to gauge whether admissions have been released nor if your chances of being admitted have diminished. 

And we have not seen any UVa admits either in this forum. It looks like rejections and waitlists were sent out a while ago but it's not even clear that anyone has been admitted yet to UVa. So weird.

[BrownSugar]

2 minutes ago, Mad Scientist Malfrost said:

Hey! I only just noticed you got a Chicago admit! Congrats on that!

Thank you  

[PolNerd]

2 minutes ago, Mad Scientist Malfrost said:

Hey! I only just noticed you got a Chicago admit! Congrats on that!

 

Just now, BrownSugar said:

Thank you  

Wait, is that for the MA or PhD? If it is for the PhD, when did you get notified?

[StarkDark1]

Just now, BrownSugar said:

Thank you  

Congrats!  I am sure our friend of 'high caliber' would be interested to hear you got into one of the top schools.  ? 

[Theory007]

1 minute ago, BrownSugar said:

Thank you  

Well done! You must be happy you got in

[BrownSugar]

1 minute ago, PolNerd said:

 

Wait, is that for the MA or PhD? If it is for the PhD, when did you get notified?

It is for the PhD. I read the email early this morning but it came in sometime last night  

[BrownSugar]

Just now, StarkDark1 said:

Congrats!  I am sure our friend of 'high caliber' would be interested to hear you got into one of the top schools.  ? 

Thank you!! Hahaha I’d love their response 

Just now, Theory007 said:

Well done! You must be happy you got in

Thank you so much! Very happy, always good to have that validation during these challenging times. 

[PolNerd]

6 minutes ago, BrownSugar said:

It is for the PhD. I read the email early this morning but it came in sometime last night  

Congrats! I am assuming that is where you will be going if you don't receive a favorable response from the pending programs?

[BrownSugar]

Just now, PolNerd said:

Congrats! I am assuming that is where you will be going if you don't receive a favorable response from the pending programs?

Actually, I prefer USC over Chicago (controversial, I’m sure haha, but it’s for a few reasons). Depending on the remaining ones, I think I’ll actually be confirming USC in the end.

I do hope one of you on the forum here can get my place at Chicago  

[PolNerd]

Guys, anyone know what an actual starting salary range of a tenure track political science AssProf is? I have years of work experience and an MPP and I think I am starting to weigh the pros and cons of giving up my current policy career and going back to school (now that I am in a few programs), especially because I think I am already making the salary of a tenure track professor at the moment. 

EDIT: No family or kids - so pretty flexible to give it all up.

Edited February 9, 2021 by PolNerd

[Mad Scientist Malfrost]

Just now, BrownSugar said:

Actually, I prefer USC over Chicago (controversial, I’m sure haha, but it’s for a few reasons). Depending on the remaining ones, I think I’ll actually be confirming USC in the end.

I do hope one of you on the forum here can get my place at Chicago  

I don't think that is controversial at all. We are all drawn to different programs for different reasons and you feel you are a better fit at USC than Chicago!  Still, you were right in saying that validation is nice. I'm looking at it in another light in that if and when I get admitted somewhere I'm going to make those programs regret not admitting me. Our value and worth as scholars are not defined by committees that don't know us.  

[BrownSugar]

Just now, Mad Scientist Malfrost said:

 I'm looking at it in another light in that if and when I get admitted somewhere I'm going to make those programs regret not admitting me. Our value and worth as scholars are not defined by committees that don't know us.  

This is a wonderful perspective. Thank you for sharing it. I’ll be sure to take it with me throughout life in whatever I do. 

[guest789]

2 minutes ago, PolNerd said:

Guys, anyone know what an actual starting salary range of a tenure track political science AssProf is? I have years of work experience and an MPP and I think I am starting to weigh the pros and cons of giving up my current policy career and going back to school, especially because I think I am already making the salary of a tenure track professor at the moment.

It depends on the school, but at the UCs it's like 80-100K/year (it increases quickly though, particularly with outside offers). It would be less at other schools. Public universities often have to release this information, by the way, so you can check.

And obviously, a job at a UC is very very very hard to get and very prestigious.

Edited February 9, 2021 by timeseries

[polisci_gal]

1 minute ago, PolNerd said:

Guys, anyone know what an actual starting salary range of a tenure track political science AssProf is? I have years of work experience and an MPP and I think I am starting to weigh the pros and cons of giving up my current policy career and going back to school, especially because I think I am already making the salary of a tenure track professor at the moment.

According to this website https://academicpositions.com/career-advice/phd-professor-and-postdoc-salaries-in-the-united-states it is around 70k. 

I think whats more important to ask yourself right now is - in the long term, what career will make you the happiest? 

[plus]

35 minutes ago, smug-face said:

Wait, has Berkeley sent you a rejection?

Presumed rejection. I’ve been formally rejected at UCSD and Princeton so far.

[uncle_socks]

9 minutes ago, BrownSugar said:

Actually, I prefer USC over Chicago (controversial, I’m sure haha, but it’s for a few reasons). Depending on the remaining ones, I think I’ll actually be confirming USC in the end.

I do hope one of you on the forum here can get my place at Chicago  

Of course this is a highly personal decision, but as someone a few years into a political science PhD, I'd implore you to reconsider this (or at the very least give Chicago an honest chance) if you seriously want to get a tenure track job, and especially if you are interested in getting an R1 job. Getting an R1 job out of USC is nowhere near the norm. Ask professors at both schools which program they think will better equip you for your future goals -- yes they want you to come to their school, but they also want you to achieve your highest potential regardless. 

The advantages of coming from a top (as defined by the rankings) are massive. There's not a big difference in between, say Chicago or Ohio State. But the prestige differential in political science in between UChicago and USC is very large.

That being said, if your long-term interests involves California or if you never really cared for an R1 job, it's much less a big deal. 

Edited February 9, 2021 by BunniesInSpace

[BrownSugar]

Just now, BunniesInSpace said:

Of course this is a highly personal decision, but as someone a few years into a political science PhD, I'd implore you to reconsider this (or at the very least give Chicago an honest chance) if you seriously want to get a tenure track job, and especially if you are interested in getting an R1 job. Getting an R1 job out of USC is nowhere near the norm. Ask professors at both schools which program they think will better equip you for your future goals -- yes they want you to come to their school, but they also want you to achieve your highest potential regardless. 

The advantages of coming from a top (as defined by the rankings) are massive. There's not a big difference in between, say Chicago or Ohio State. But the prestige differential in political science in between UChicago and USC is very large.

That being said, if your long-term interests involves California or if you never really cared for an R1 job, it's much less a big deal. 

Thank you, I appreciate you insight  One of the main reasons is really fit, and for me that matters most right now. Would you say prestige is more valuable than fit generally? I’m genuinely curious since you’re already in the process of doing your PhD. 

[guest789]

I'm not who you asked @BrownSugar, but UChicago already decided that you fit their program! That's what fit refers to and they all expect us to change our research interests anyway,

[PolNerd]

32 minutes ago, polisci_gal said:

According to this website https://academicpositions.com/career-advice/phd-professor-and-postdoc-salaries-in-the-united-states it is around 70k. 

I think whats more important to ask yourself right now is - in the long term, what career will make you the happiest? 

I love research (and honestly research that have policy relevance - maybe a TT position at the IR policy schools like Elliott or Denver could be a great fit) and I have very strong "independent" streak to put it lightly, haha so academia seems like the place I will be happy in. But the horrible TT market and the financial aspect of giving up 5 years of salary equivalent to a TT position is giving me second thoughts.

Edited February 9, 2021 by PolNerd

[BrownSugar]

Just now, timeseries said:

I'm not who you asked @BrownSugar, but UChicago already decided that you fit their program! That's what fit refers to and they all expect us to change our research interests anyway,

Thank you for your perspective! 

[verschiedene]

13 minutes ago, PolNerd said:

Guys, anyone know what an actual starting salary range of a tenure track political science AssProf is? I have years of work experience and an MPP and I think I am starting to weigh the pros and cons of giving up my current policy career and going back to school (now that I am in a few programs), especially because I think I am already making the salary of a tenure track professor at the moment. 

EDIT: No family or kids - so pretty flexible to give it all up.

It's usually between 50k-100k depending on the institutions - private/public, LAC/research unis, etc. But other than salaries there are other much more important considerations, the first of which is opportunity cost, i.e. there will be 5-7 years where you are not really making any money. Tenure track jobs are also shrinking quickly, esp. in social sciences and humanities, where more and more scholars are migrating from one temporary position to the next. Precarity is becoming increasingly the norm. As my advisor used to say, if academia is not the only option for you, do the other thing. 

Edited February 9, 2021 by verschiedene

[polisci_gal]

5 minutes ago, PolNerd said:

I love research (and honestly research that have policy relevance - maybe a TT position at the IR policy schools like Elliott or Denver will be a great fit) and I have very strong "independent" streak to put it lightly, haha so academia seems like the place I will be happy in. But the horrible TT market and the financial aspect part of not only giving up 5 years of salary equivalent to a TT position is giving up second thoughts.

This is fair. I think its really important to consider what the future will hold in terms of job prospectives, but so much can happen in 5 years time that might change the world as we know it (i.e., COVID). I know this sounds really cheesy, but I would say follow your heart and your passion, and trust that something will work out for you! Especially if you are admitted to a pretty good school or a place that you would be able to really thrive in - these will definitely help you in the future during your application process for TT jobs.

Ultimately, the future is uncertain for everyone. So just do what feels right for you.

Edited February 9, 2021 by polisci_gal

[poliscihopeful2021]

@BrownSugar Glad to hear you got accepted into UChicago - it's a great school with some incredible faculty, especially if you are interested in authoritarian politics/political economy of dev/theory. To echo some of the other people on this thread I would strongly consider going there if your final choices is USC vs UChicago, only because as much as 'fit' matters, you ultimately have to optimize for prestige if the job market is an outcome that is important to you. Not to discourage you in any way from USC, I'm sure it's a great program, it is just unfortunate how clubby/ranking-obsessed academia can be.

P.S - I say this knowing only too well that Chicago can be cold and brutal and SoCal is beautiful and warm. 

[BrownSugar]

Just now, poliscihopeful2021 said:

@BrownSugar Glad to hear you got accepted into UChicago - it's a great school with some incredible faculty, especially if you are interested in authoritarian politics/political economy of dev/theory. To echo some of the other people on this thread I would strongly consider going there if your final choices is USC vs UChicago, only because as much as 'fit' matters, you ultimately have to optimize for prestige if the job market is an outcome that is important to you. Not to discourage you in any way from USC, I'm sure it's a great program, it is just unfortunate how clubby/ranking-obsessed academia can be.

P.S - I say this knowing only too well that Chicago can be cold and brutal and SoCal is beautiful and warm. 

Thank you  I really appreciate everyone’s insights and I’ll certainly take them into account if USC v Chicago end up as my final decision!
 

To be completely transparent - I don’t have any fixed plans to stay in the US long-term (partner is European) or necessarily pursue the tenure track. I have decided to pursue a US PhD in the first place given its overall strength and career flexibility on an international scale, so that’s why I was prioritizing fit over prestige. But like I said, I WILL take into account your insights.