Turned Down Offers Thread

[Wonton Soup]

Tough choice BLeonard. Try not to "look back" too much. 

[Warelin]

I'm bumping this thread because I think the current cohort could find it helpful when they make their decisions.

[havemybloodchild]

Emailed POI last night to turn down MA and UIC. Knew I wouldn’t be able to swing an unfunded program ??‍♀️

[Pnwonder]

Will be emailing ASU this weekend to turn them down because it's not as good of a fit as some other offers I've received and no guarantee for consistent funding. Hope that opens up a spot for someone here!

Also, it would be helpful if folks could give some insight as to why they are declining offers. It would certainly help me as I'm trying to wrap my head around how to make the final decision between my top schools!

[reluctanthuman]

I declined the offer of admission at Ohio State yesterday, although I liked the program. My reasons are completely non-academical: I was not sure I would like living in Columbus (and I have a couple more location-related personal problems as well which were a part of my decision process), and also the stipend was a bit low.

[Indecisive Poet]

A friend of mine just turned down an offer from Tennessee (Knoxville) yesterday, if that's helpful for anyone! She is in the 18th century (mostly British), studying religion and literature and women writers.

[snorkles]

Does anyone have a sense of what the etiquette is for declining offers? Email to DGS and POI? Do I explain my reasoning? 

[spatial_person]

I declined an offer from USC today if anyone has been waitlisted 

[Musmatatus]

On 2/17/2019 at 8:09 PM, snorkles said:

Does anyone have a sense of what the etiquette is for declining offers? Email to DGS and POI? Do I explain my reasoning? 

Oooh, we should get @emprof to weigh in on this!

[emprof]

1 hour ago, sugilite said:

Oooh, we should get @emprof to weigh in on this!

Aw, thanks for asking!

First: this is a professional decision, and you are not going to hurt anyone's feelings. Admissions committees will indeed be disappointed when we fail to recruit our top choices, but no one will be personally upset or offended. Don't feel awkward or hesitant about informing programs in a prompt and direct way. As others have suggested in the forums, institutions that maintain waitlists often depend on admitted students turning them down before the April 15 deadline in order to admit anyone from the waitlist. So if you know that you won't be attending, you are doing the program (and waitlisted students) a favor by informing them promptly.

Second: you are not obligated to explain your reasons for your choice, especially if that hinges in part on private factors that you would rather not disclose (such as the decision to relocate a partner and/or family to a particular geographic area, for example). That said, if there was anything about the program that gave you pause--the stipend was lower, or the placement seemed weak, or the teaching responsibilities weren't what you hoped, or the graduate students you spoke to were unhappy--and you feel comfortable sharing that information with the DGS, or whoever has been communicating with you about your status: that information will be deeply appreciated by the program (at least if it's a program that knows what's good for it). We are constantly reviewing and refining our recruitment practices as well as our graduate program. If there are issues that are going to make us less appealing to students, we really want to know about that earlier rather than later! (Also: some programs I know of issue an anonymous survey to prospective students who turn them down, giving them an opportunity to express such feedback without having to worry that they are causing offense. But even if you don't get this formal opportunity, please know that your thoughts will be taken seriously and appreciated, so long as they are expressed cordially.) You can express your concerns collegially, along the lines of: "I'm writing, regretfully, to let you know that I won't be matriculating at X University. While I so appreciated the chance to speak with your wonderful faculty and students, the lower stipend combined with the higher cost of living in your city ultimately led me to another decision." And so on. 

Third: I think most programs have online portals where you can record your decision electronically, without requiring any explanation. But if you've corresponded at any length or spent a significant amount of time with specific faculty, you can't go wrong with a brief and professional email thanking them for their time and saying how much you look forward to seeing them and their work at conferences and in print. (In fact, you can't go wrong with a brief thank you to such faculty at the school you do choose to attend! Keep it short and sweet: thanks so much for your time, enjoyed talking to you, look forward to working with you in the coming years.) 

[beardedlady]

This was posted on the Phil board and I think it may also be relevant to us here. I'll preface by emphasizing that, of course, we should all take our time and make sure we are confident and certain with our choice of program. But if you've been accepted to a few places, and you know which are your top choices, help out those waitlisted out there and decline the offers/remove yourself from the waitlists of the programs you're certain you won't want to attend. Declining is hard--we all put enormous effort into our applications and it may be difficult to let that go.  But we also all know the difficulty of waiting. And declining offers early to those programs you won't be taking has a ripple effect. Instead of thinking about declining as shutting a door, consider all of the doors you may open for other people!

Good luck ya'll, this is one hell of a process. 

On 2/19/2019 at 2:24 AM, Duns Eith said:

[...] By your decision impacts hundreds of people indirectly, and at least one person directly. Your decline opens up a spot which enables someone to decline their lesser offers. If most shifting happens in April, there just isn't enough time for adcoms to go down the waitlist. If there is on average 3 day per offer turnaround, the adcomms can't get through 10 people on their waitlist in 3 days -- when the declines really happen.

Objections:

But they are willing to fly me out! This is a great opportunity to visit schools and network with professors I am interested in.

• This is really an unfair tease. If you know you aren't taking their offer, then you're going on false pretenses, wasting their department's money, and making people wait for minimal gains. Is it really a good idea to use people to sight-see? It isn't like you're going to get a letter of recommendation. Just add them on PhilPeople for pete's sake.

But if I decline that doesn't impact you. So what?

• For some people, if they were given an offer before the 15th, they would accept your school's offer. You are literally impacting someone's ability to get into a school or get into a better school. It doesn't have to be about impacting anyone you know. The sooner the impact, the sooner others can impact others down stream.

I am under no obligation to make any decision before April 15. If I wait, that's my prerogative.

• True. Nothing is forcing you to make a decision, and definitely not to rush you. But if nothing will change your mind about the decision, then why take the time? If you are still unsure, that's one thing, but if you already have an obviously better offer, then this shows a character defect when you know this impacts other people's futures. Comparative harm account: you're harming people. You have a right to harm people, but that doesn't mean harming is right.

Whatever my choice and whenever I decide to notify them, such course of action would be statistically normal. You cannot expect me to act otherwise.

• Okay, I won't argue that it is obligatory, but clearly you don't see supererogatory actions as worthy of aspiration. I hope you're not working in ethics.

It seems like it could be in my interest to hold onto the offer. I can use it as leverage.

• Sure, if you think they are really comparable. But I'd argue it might even be in your interest to decline. The school might come back with a counter-offer that would not have been available if you didn't give them ample time to put together a more lucrative package.

 

[StamfordCat]

Does anyone know of any stats as to how likely it is that waitlisted folks will get an offer? (I'm on UConn waitlist, btw)

[havemybloodchild]

2 hours ago, beardedlady said:

This was posted on the Phil board and I think it may also be relevant to us here. I'll preface by emphasizing that, of course, we should all take our time and make sure we are confident and certain with our choice of program. But if you've been accepted to a few places, and you know which are your top choices, help out those waitlisted out there and decline the offers/remove yourself from the waitlists of the programs you're certain you won't want to attend. Declining is hard--we all put enormous effort into our applications and it may be difficult to let that go.  But we also all know the difficulty of waiting. And declining offers early to those programs you won't be taking has a ripple effect. Instead of thinking about declining as shutting a door, consider all of the doors you may open for other people!

Good luck ya'll, this is one hell of a process. 

 

THIS 

Thank you for posting!

[emprof]

2 hours ago, beardedlady said:

This was posted on the Phil board and I think it may also be relevant to us here. I'll preface by emphasizing that, of course, we should all take our time and make sure we are confident and certain with our choice of program. But if you've been accepted to a few places, and you know which are your top choices, help out those waitlisted out there and decline the offers/remove yourself from the waitlists of the programs you're certain you won't want to attend. Declining is hard--we all put enormous effort into our applications and it may be difficult to let that go.  But we also all know the difficulty of waiting. And declining offers early to those programs you won't be taking has a ripple effect. Instead of thinking about declining as shutting a door, consider all of the doors you may open for other people!

Good luck ya'll, this is one hell of a process. 

 

This is really helpful and sound advice! Thanks for posting. 

To echo/underscore:

• Faculty will not experience meeting with prospective students as "networking" opportunities. They will be focused on presenting the program and the institution as a good fit for you. If you decline the institution's offer, it is unlikely that they will have any interest in staying in touch with you through the early stages of your graduate career, unless they are independently invested in your work (because they served as undergraduate advisors, for example). Only when you are further along--publishing, presenting at conferences--would you be legible as a colleague. I don't mean this to be dismissive--only to point out that faculty are busy mentoring and advising the students in their own programs. They're not looking to mentor and advise students elsewhere, especially in the early years of coursework and qualifying exams. And if they become suspicious that you are wasting their time and resources without any intention of attending, they will be likely to remember you for all the wrong reasons--and to steer clear in the future.

• None of the institutions I've been affiliated with (3, both public and private, all top 10 programs) has the ability or the inclination to negotiate individual graduate offers. If we learn that students have gone someplace else that offers a higher stipend, we might try to restructure our funding packages for the coming years. But unlike tenure-line job offers, graduate funding packages are not usually flexible. Of course, I can't speak for every institution! But I know this is true for a significant number of prestigious programs. 

• One qualification, just in the interest of managing expectations: a candidate declining an offer before April 15 will not necessarily (and at my institution, not even probably) result in another offer going out. At most programs I know, 2x offers go out with the expectation that x number will accept. We maintain a waitlist only for unusual situations, such as a candidate being eligible for some kind of special funding from another part of the university that may or may not become available. Obviously, given the successes of people admitted from the waitlists on these forums, this is not the case everywhere! But it's worth being aware that meaningful waitlists are not maintained everywhere.

[santraash]

Really important posts above. Everyone should read it—for present and future use. Do you think we should bump it to the main acceptances thread to ensure that everyone’s aware of it? 

[Anonymouse124]

Declined Purdue's funded LTC MA! I hope that helps one of you guys, fingers and toes crossed for everyone!! 

[Ironman1214]

On ‎2‎/‎23‎/‎2019 at 1:25 PM, emprof said:

This is really helpful and sound advice! Thanks for posting. 

To echo/underscore:

• Faculty will not experience meeting with prospective students as "networking" opportunities. They will be focused on presenting the program and the institution as a good fit for you. If you decline the institution's offer, it is unlikely that they will have any interest in staying in touch with you through the early stages of your graduate career, unless they are independently invested in your work (because they served as undergraduate advisors, for example). Only when you are further along--publishing, presenting at conferences--would you be legible as a colleague. I don't mean this to be dismissive--only to point out that faculty are busy mentoring and advising the students in their own programs. They're not looking to mentor and advise students elsewhere, especially in the early years of coursework and qualifying exams. And if they become suspicious that you are wasting their time and resources without any intention of attending, they will be likely to remember you for all the wrong reasons--and to steer clear in the future.

• None of the institutions I've been affiliated with (3, both public and private, all top 10 programs) has the ability or the inclination to negotiate individual graduate offers. If we learn that students have gone someplace else that offers a higher stipend, we might try to restructure our funding packages for the coming years. But unlike tenure-line job offers, graduate funding packages are not usually flexible. Of course, I can't speak for every institution! But I know this is true for a significant number of prestigious programs. 

• One qualification, just in the interest of managing expectations: a candidate declining an offer before April 15 will not necessarily (and at my institution, not even probably) result in another offer going out. At most programs I know, 2x offers go out with the expectation that x number will accept. We maintain a waitlist only for unusual situations, such as a candidate being eligible for some kind of special funding from another part of the university that may or may not become available. Obviously, given the successes of people admitted from the waitlists on these forums, this is not the case everywhere! But it's worth being aware that meaningful waitlists are not maintained everywhere. 

Yes--thank you for bringing that issue up. The program that I attend also does not use a wait list. Two of the three programs that I applied to (in addition to the one I now attend) also did not waitlist students. I think in a way that I like the idea of accept or reject better. The students are not left wondering what is going to happen. When they finally hear from the uni, they know exactly where they stand. 

[snorkles]

I have turned down Indiana, Ohio State, and Chapel Hill. I hope that moves the waitlist (assuming one exists) for someone! 

[ArcaMajora]

Just turned down my waitlist offer for Buffalo. Hope this helps someone on their waitlist  

[FiguresIII]

Declining waitlists at Princeton and Stanford, declining offer from Rutgers.

[trytostay]

Declined offer from Rutgers 

[ExileFromAFutureTime]

Has anyone seen examples on this forum as to how to politely and diplomatically decline offers of admission? How explicit should I be, especially if low funding is the issue? 

 

[Musmatatus]

14 minutes ago, ExileFromAFutureTime said:

Has anyone seen examples on this forum as to how to politely and diplomatically decline offers of admission? How explicit should I be, especially if low funding is the issue? 

 

Scroll up. emprof gave an example. 

[trytostay]

Is anyone admitted to Columbia considering/leaning towards another program? Feel free to PM me if you don't want to discuss it here! I'm just curious.

[cassidyaxx]

Going to be turning down Boston College MA offer, if that helps anybody